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So I have this wonderful forgeworld avatar and I've been trying for the better part of a week now to formulate a list at 1500 points or more that utilizes him. Unfortunately, I've yet to find something I like. How should one look at the Avatar whilst creating a list?

You NEED a farseer for fortune or the Avatar is going to get shot on approach as he crosses the table.

I have had good luck with 3 20 man guardian squads crossing the table with 2 Hvy weapons each and a warlock in each squad with conceal. just make sure you keep 1 model of each squad in range of the Avatars fearless aura.

maybe stick him with a squad of scorps or something else that will absorb wounds before the Avatar can get to smashing stuff. can never go wrong with fire prisims or war walkers. Could always take a wraith knight with a sun cannon and scatter laser to give more threats for him to worry about?

What I had thought was to take a farseer with 3 or more warlocks to try and get renewer

Although already fearless, the avatar works great with a wraith army. If your whole list is t6, your opponent will have a harder time dealing with them. Your only issue is anti-air, to which I recommend serpents. You can put some guardians/aspect warriors in there. Finally, get a squad of jetbikes to contest or cap objectives and ensure linebreaker.

The avatar is a beast in cc, but remember he's slow, use him more as a psychological threat, and his meltas

Thats not a bad idea either, I hope your dice rolling is better than mine because I can't seem to roll renew on the charts ever.

I strongly disagree wit this forced to roll for powers that the fluff dictates that a caster for eldar dedicate thier entire life to learning this power and now its a today i know this and tomorrow I know something different.

Worst case of alzheimer's I've every heard of but hey we make due.

happen to have a sample list?

The Elfzilla list still works. You need to upgrade it to wraithknights at higher point levels, but at low levels (1500):

Avatar
Farseer

Guardians
Guardians
Rangers

Wraithlord
Wraithlord
Wraithlord


I've made it work at 2k:
Spiritseer
Spiritseer
Farseer
Avatar

Guardians
Rangers
Wraithguard (8)
Wraithguard (8)

3x Wraithlords (BLs, usually) + swords

This is 1522

You can get 30+ T6+ wounds on the table, you might get renew, and you might get a 4++ on a wraithguard unit.

Basically, you make a list that is just a pain to kill. Tau shooting is wounding on 3's or 5's (2's, sure, sometimes), when they're used to 2's and 3's. You give cover to lords via wraithguard or area terrain, you give cover to wraithguard via conceal, or get the 4++, which at the very least forces them to burn markerlights to remove cover rather than up their BS.

It is tough as all get-out, and doesn't really suffer at long ranges if you take BLs on the Wraithlords.

Worst matchup is of course, Tau. I usually bring 2 mid-sized units of warp spiders. I'm aggressive with the wraithlords and spiders and cautious with the Avatar, and give them a problem of target priority. They tend to focus the MCs down with markerlights and Tau-shooting-spam, but warp spiders tear up their shooters and by the time they move on to the wraithguard, they're in threat range and the Tau are in trouble. Tau players usually have the instinct that they can focus fire down anything (and they're usually right) but this leads them to fire their pulse weapons at wraithlords, which is a really poor choice.

If you have the models at 2k, you can put even more wraithlords on the table. Or, run multiple wraithknights which is even meaner.

It works, but takes practice. You don't have the speed to adjust strategy mid-game, so you need to know where your wraithguard and wraithlords need to end up several turns ahead. Usually, this is parked on an enemy objective. Each of the above list templates come in about 500 points less than the label, so you can add in warp spiders, GJBs, or whatever you like.

interesting, and I like the idea.

Unfortunately, I only have the 1 wraithlord and the avatar, and no wraithknights...

I typically play Ulthwe, and so I'm having a hard time this edition with trying to mimimize aspect warriors, maximize psykers, and utilize less wraith list.

Great post Gwyidion.

Two words....target saturation

995pts

Avatar with NightVision and Fastshot
Spiritseer
Spiritseer

Wraithguard
Wraithguard

Wraithknight

Aegis with Icarus

Let the Avatar move up to the Icarus T1 so he can intercept any flier T2 before moving on. BS10 and 2 x S9AP2 is helpful. Then he can move up and fire his 2x Melta shots the same turn.

At 1k you bring 15 T6 wounds and 6 T8 wounds.

deathmagiks wrote:
interesting, and I like the idea.

Unfortunately, I only have the 1 wraithlord and the avatar, and no wraithknights...

I typically play Ulthwe, and so I'm having a hard time this edition with trying to mimimize aspect warriors, maximize psykers, and utilize less wraith list.

If you want to avoid wraiths, use the Avatar, and minimize aspects, you're definitely going to want to go the route of a number of large Guardian squads, with attached warlocks, and the Avatar to provide fearless. Use Serpents with guardians or DAs in side for mobile objective capture. 2x Farseers can help you increase your odds of getting fortune, which will help the Avatar survive.

I've never run that list. It appears like it could work.... but I don't have any empirical evidence to support it.

Gwyidion wrote:

deathmagiks wrote:
interesting, and I like the idea.

2x Farseers can help you increase your odds of getting fortune, which will help the Avatar survive.

This is not possible unless your playing at 2k points.

You can't have 2 farseers and an avatar as each takes up an HQ slot.

I'll just say it's her boyfriend and she's showing him off to the army for motivational purposes.

I don't think the Avatar needs Fortune, but he does require a target saturation model. I've had good success running the following, with an Avatar as an allied HQ for a Dark Eldar army:

My 1850 List:

Baron
Wracks
Wyches
Wyches
Beastpack
Talos
Talos
Talos

Avatar
Rangers
Rangers
Wraithknight

ADL w/ Quad Gun

Now, the Beastpack has been giving intervening model saves to the Talos', and the 5++ Avatar has taken up one flank and the 5++ Wraithknight the other. The only reason the Avatar ever dies is because it's the easiest MC to kill, and my Wraithknight and Talos' end up getting into my opponent's deployment zone.

Lots of good things said above, so Ill hit on exarch powers you can upgrade em with.

Night vision-this power is awful and has no business on the Avatar. The notable exception being if your using him on an icarus with fast shot. Otherwise, this power is worthless.

Fast shot-The second rule of zombieland is the double tap, and the first rule of the Avatar is to take fast shot. For pennies you add a second BS10 melta shot. Put that on a fleet model with battle focus...this power is all but required.

Crushing blow-This is a fairly average power, but it has some uses. Against T5+ models it shows return, and makes it a bit easier to crush lighter armor as you won't have to use smash. Nothing great, but it has merit.

Monster Hunter- Lots of the tougher enemies you would need the extra S from crushing blow against are MC's, and this certainly gets more mileage than crushing blow in that respect. Too situational for a TAC build, but remember it also allows you to re roll failed to wounds from shooting so it works with your wailing doom.

Marksman's eye- An expensive power to give your melta fingers a slightly better chance to snipe out models. Gives you slightly better odds to pick out a plasma gun or some other hidden weapon that is bad news for the Avatar, but way too expensive for the price. Stick to calling on a 6 and grab something else.

Disarming Strike-The most expensive power, but rightly so. You get a chance to take out the fancy weapons most other challengers will bring that can hurt the big boy. With WS10, the odds should be ever in your favor to win this roll off. The main problem is getting the avatar into combat before he falls to gunfire.

TLDR-Your taking fast shot, and maybe one other power.

If you use the Avatar, ALWAYS take Fast Shot. Since his ranged weapon is, in effect, a Melta Gun, getting a 2nd shot for cheaper than anyone else in the game gets a 2nd one is auto-add. You don't have points? You MAKE points, Dawg!

The rest of the advice I'll leave to a few of the more tactially inclined peers.