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Hello

Well i i was reading my ultramarines novels i took a liking to the Iron Warriors and as such i am making a 2000 points(or probably more) army , i will not restrict my self for a "iron warriors fluff list" so any thing is a go as long as they are not a hellturky (flyers add other dimension to the game that i do no really like ). Right now i have this. Also this list in not to be used against flyers , but i have a Aegis with a Quadgun if needed .

HQ: (Mark of Nurgle in all of then)

Sorcerer in Power Armour with force weapon(axe) and bolt pistol.
Chaos Lord (Abaddon body) in Terminator Armour with Lightning Claw and Power Fist (i use this model often as a Terminator sergeant/Champion)
Great Demon of Nurgle (the ones that GWS sell with a big sword) with Power Armour and the wings are "in the making"
Iron Warriors Ironsmith with Combi Melta and Power Fist (the claws)

Elites:

5 Terminators (Mark of Nurgle or Khorne in all of then)
Champion with Lightning Claw and Power Fist
1st with Combi Flamer and Power Axe
2nd with Chain Fist and Combi Bolter
3nd with Power Fist and Combi Flamer
4nd with Auto cannon and Power Mace

Chaos Dreadnought (aka hellbrute)
Twinlinked LasCannon and Missile luncher

Plage Marines
Champion with Power Fist and Bolter Gun
2 Plasma Guns

Troops: (Mark of Nurgle in all of then)
10 Chaos Space Marines
Champion with Power Sword and Bolter Gun
2 Plasma Guns

10 Chaos Space Marines
Champion with Chain Sword and Combi Melta.
2 Plasma Guns

10 Chaos Space Marines- (Are going to be upgraded to 10 Noise marines next month)
Champion with Chain Sword and Bolter Gun
1 Heavy Bolter - (will have 8 sonic blasters and 1 blast master)

Cultists (AKA Meatshields )
10 CCW with Flamer
10 Shotty with Flamer

3 Rhinos with dirge casters

2 Icon Bearers

Heavy Support: (Mark of Nurgle in all of then)

5 Havocks with 4 Missile Luncher (for anti Armour and Horde Control)
4 Obliterators in units of 2 .


So my question is what next ? Obviously i will not use every thing in a list but i would use something like this

Iron Warriors Ironsmith with combi melta and some chaos artefact
Sorcerer with Mastery level 3 Force Axe

1 x 10 Plagues Marines with 2 Plasma Guns with a Rhino
1 x 10 Noise Marines with Sonic blasters and 1 Blast master with a Rhino
1 Dreadnought with Lascannons and Missile Luncher

2 x 10 Chaos Space Marines with 2 Plasmas, one squad with a Rhino

2 x 2 units of Obliterators
1 x 5 Havocs with 4 Missile Lunchers (possible with flak if there are flyers involved)


So my question is i have a extra Predator and a extra Dreadnought from my Ultramarines that i can convert to chaos , i am tending to convert a predator but i am in doubt regarding the type of predator .
Should i have more Anti Infantry or Anti Tank ?
Also regarding the list i know that i have to sort the terminator weapons to be more compatible ,other that that any thoughts?

Best Regards!

my suggestion would be to consider waiting for the Space Marines codex to drop with fluffy chapter traits (?) for Iron Hands.

If you like the obliterator models you could always use them as counts-as centurians.

thank you but i already have a large Ultramarine army and a small crimson fists detachment so no more Codex Chapters , i want Chaos ! Plaque Marines , Noise Marines ,Mad berserker's for all its faults the chaos codex as a certain attraction to me.

 GarretAsh wrote:
thank you but i already have a large Ultramarine army and a small crimson fists detachment so no more Codex Chapters , i want Chaos ! Plaque Marines , Noise Marines ,Mad berserker's for all its faults the chaos codex as a certain attraction to me.

Thank you for reminding me why i play chaos

 GarretAsh wrote:
thank you but i already have a large Ultramarine army and a small crimson fists detachment so no more Codex Chapters , i want Chaos ! Plaque Marines , Noise Marines ,Mad berserker's for all its faults the chaos codex as a certain attraction to me.

but then how is that Iron Warriors?

I actually don't know much about Iron Warriors fluff. I would assume siege warfare and bionics are their big things. Therefore Plague Marines would probably work well as your stock standard Iron Warriors marines while stocking up on as many big guns as possible.

They have a fantastic color scheme. Good luck.

Why are you using four HQ choices for? That's a lot in points there. I cannot see the point in majority of them if I am honest. You have got like four vehicles for the Warpsmith to look after, the Prince really should have the mace and the Chaos Lord is pretty meh and offers nothing.

Helbrutes are pretty meh.

You do not need close combat upgrades on Champions when you are using Rhinos, chances are they will not charge.

Havocs are better with autocannons, though the missile launcher isn't bad.

Well i have 4 Hq but normally only use one , the Ironsmith (note that this is nor a WarpSmith ) if i have space points i put the sorcerer there, I use the Helbrutes because i had 6 space marines dreadnoughts and tons of bit to convert them and since i lack a bit of anti tank fire-power it has cover some ground even its not the best around. Havock are Missile launcher because i can not find autocannons for a reasonable price and the missile launchers have been performing well (better that the hellbrute)

I was thinking of Converting a Predator or 2 , so Triple Las or AutoCannon/Hb?

but then how is that Iron Warriors?

For Iron Warriors Fluff one can check the lexicanum : http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Iron_Warriors#.Uh9rGD-wWpU
Iron Warriors are experts in siege warfare with a ruthless and practical touch , they are Chaos undivided , i am building a iron Warriors minor faction.

Thank you for reminding me why i play chaos

Chaos brother , Chaos , there is nothing else that compares to it !

I have no idea what you mean Ironsmith. There's nothing in the CSM codex called an Ironsmith.

A Iron Smith is a specific iron warriors Chaos Lord check it at : http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1130404 .
I do not know why it did not get a chaos codex entry ,on Iron Warriors command ranking its on level with the Dark Apostle for the Word Bearers

Edit: Ok my bad is War-smith not iron smith, but its a Chaos Lord that only the IronWarriors can take but sadly it dos not have a unique profile.

If you're goi g for the Iron Warrior theme, how about some siege guns?
Vindicators and Allied Basilisks?

I got an iron warrior army and it has

30 marines in rhinos with 4 meltaguns two flamers champs with a maul an ax and a sword and IOV on everybody
three vindicators with extra armor
a warpsmith
hellbrute with a multimelta

mind you this is about is short of 1,500 points
but thats a good start the other option you can go instead of vindicators is taking oblits cause the oblit virus originated in the Iron Warriors and maybe use some cultists for the all mighty meatshields.
remember Iron within iron without and your hated foe is the imperial fists

and if you wanna take havoics lascannons are your friends

Thank you guys ! I would love to Buy like 4 vindicators (2 chaos and 2 normal) but i am moving to the UK next month and can not carry all the stuff i need to take , also my wife would put me in the couch for the next year if i spend £100 in minis .I am not into allies , i needed to sell my gaunts gost to fund my chaos army and as such i can to in good conscience buy Guards right now , but i have 20 cultist to use as a meat shield!

Right now i can convert a dreadnought or a predator , what do you think its the best ?

remember Iron within iron without and your hated foe is the imperial fists

That all there is ! I love this guys , I am spending 1 and half on each mini!

personally i would go with the dred but it really depends on what youw anna do honestly...

 GarretAsh wrote:
A Iron Smith is a specific iron warriors Chaos Lord check it at : http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1130404 .
I do not know why it did not get a chaos codex entry ,on Iron Warriors command ranking its on level with the Dark Apostle for the Word Bearers

Edit: Ok my bad is War-smith not iron smith, but its a Chaos Lord that only the IronWarriors can take but sadly it dos not have a unique profile.

It's from the 3rd ed CSM codex I think.

Ironsmith=warsmith (his like a company master)
you can also make a biker lord with burning flame of kharn

I also run an Iron warriors army
for Havoks i would use autocannons (alot of dakka)
in the 6th edi more plasma is better
i use 2 Vindicators if you use them right and smart they will reward you fast
Bike anti unit squad

and right now im thinking about scrap building a hell blade for my Ironwarriors (allready have drake but i want hell blade also)

well i guess you can use MoN and say its "bionics"

Good luck!

my full list is:
bike lord
Termi lord
termi squad
2 Csm with rhinos
20-30 cultest
6 bikers
helldrake
2 Vindicators
havok

sometimes i even run the drake as aa without flamer

Bike seems very nice i use a C:SM Command Squad in Bikes and they rock , I will probably buy Vindicators(or bikes) next month since i manage to avoid(i am still regretting it ) to buy the limited edition ultra codex and as such i can buy some minis .

Regarding marks i has making the maths and since i currently own 3 10 man chaos space marines(plus 10 plague) and will convert one to noise marines i will have 10 plagues 10 noise 1 MoN x2 plasma squad and 1 NoS with icon of excess for CC.

It's from the 3rd ed CSM codex I think.

well it seems that i need to find a 3rd ed CSM codex , ebay here i go.

Ok by the way in the chaos space marines CC squad i was planning to give then melta guns , but are the melta justified or are flamer better fitted (i have 2 cultists squads with flamers).

You can't mix and match the codexes. All the 3rd ed CSM codex will do is tell you the rules and that is it. The only rules available and current are those for the Warpsmith.

Yes , i know , but i just read the old rules and the background regarding the codex and the unit , my Ironsmith model being is a Power Fist/ Lighting claw chaos lord with the 4++ upgrade witch i always forget the name.

FLUFFINESS:

To be honest your list does not look at all as Iron Warrior. You should have more Obliterators, more Maulerfiends, Helldrakes and all that is half-living and half-machine. Too many Plague Marines, Noise Marines.. Sorcerer?. Less fancy marines, more crude lascannons and more metal
Additionally, from my understanding there are two different kinds of Chaos Undivided:

1) Do whatever you want. Everybody in the legion worships whatever he want, it can be all gods, one of the lesser ones, just one and can be a champion of one or multiple gods at once. Example: Abaddon and his Black Legion

2) Just worship Chaos by itself. There's no god that is better or more powerful than another one. Chaos gods are seen as a single pantheon of gods, and they worship this idea of Chaos... UNDIVIDED, as the name says.


From my understanding the Iron Warriors fall in the second category, so they should not take any Mark at all.
Actually they worship much more weapons, machinery and all that is mechanical, more than gods. I believe that IF there's a legion that should NOT have marked units that is the Iron Warriors. There's no rule to stop it, but since there are no rule or supplements for Iron Warriors, I don't really see the point in making an Iron Warriors army and not being fluffy. If you say you really love their background then just follow it, otherwise it means you don't like it and I can't see the sense in following it only when you care enough.

If you really like their colour scheme but feel uncomfortable with all their restrictions then I really suggest you to come up with a new cool name and say that you are not playing Iron Warriors, but a splinter warband that decided to create a schism because they felt the same way as you
Another idea is to use the rules for Marks, but calling them bio-engineering improvements. It's a bit of a stretch, but at least it makes some kind of sense. The problem is that I believe you need to be quite good to model them ^^


COMPETITIVENESS:

1) 10 CSM by themselves are wonderful way to throw away 200+ pts. You must stick them to a powerful lord or find a way to make them fearless (Fabius Bile or Icon of Vengeance). Maybe it's me with my damn rolls, but every single time I played one or more units of CSM without fearless... they all died at the first leadership test!

2) Noise Marines and Plague Marines are wonderful Troops. Yes I said troops. Taking them as Elites is just crazy. So take one Lord with the respective mark and make them troop. If you can't/don't want to take both Nurgle and Slaanesh lord just pick one of the two. They are the best choice to hold objectives, don't waste them!

3) Blastmaster and Sonic Blaster rarely mix up very well: different range and often different optimal targets.
I do suggest 2 Blastmasters in a 10 NM unit (yes, you can, FAQ'ed). Consider an Icon of Excess on them if you have enough spare points.

4) One helbrute by himself is guaranteed to blow up at most at turn 2. They carry such a huge amount of firepower in an AV 12 that is almost like begging your opponent to kill them. I really suggest to take 2 of them, possibly mixing them up with some MC or something that is resilient and scarier than them. Otherwise you are guaranteed to waste points.

5) Missile Launchers on Havocs IMHO suck. Even with flyers, the way to go is 4 autocannons. Just do the mathammer and you'll see that you have almost the same chances to blow up flyers with 4 Autocannons hoping on 6s than using Flakk. But for everything else they are better. And cheaper.

Thank you Diablix , true to be told they are a iron warriors spin off , I paint the gold details(like the shoulder trims) in black , to represent the Honsou troops that attack ultramar, i do not really mind much the fluff misalignment since i will play mostly for fun and i do not like the "big(in size)" units like the Maulerfiends and the Helldrakes . I will buy(as money allows) more plague marines and noise to run some thing like 3 noise and 3 plague (troops and elites) with obliterators and havocks.

I need to change the havocks ,where can i get autocannons for then ??