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Spiritseers (x3) 210 pts

5 wraithguard
Wave serpent
Twin linked scatter laser
Shuriken cannon
290 pts

5 wraithguard
Wave serpent
Twin linked scatter laser
Shuriken cannon
290 pts

5 wraithguard
Wave serpent
Twin linked scatter laser
Shuriken cannon
290 pts

5 Swooping Hawks
Exarch
Sunrifle
Hit & Run
Marksman's Eye
130 pts

Wraithknight (Warlord)
Sword and Shield
2x Scatter lasers
290


My main plan is to use each squad of Wraithguard with a Spiritseer and have them move up in the Wave Serpents and disembarking them upon objectives. On turn 1 I just might be able to take down some light vehicles using the Serpent Shields. The Swooping Hawks are used for taking out light infantry (thank god the amount of shots they put out), and the Wraithknight will be my tower of badassery ruining everything in it's path. May use the starcannons instead of scatter lasers so I can take down termis. Any thoughts?

It's a solid list.

I would give d-scythes for one squad of wraithguards so you can drop them off at an objective and let them overwatch stuff to death. Specially the objectives that is close to the enemy infantry.

I do love the swordknight even though internet has deemed it worthless (not enough bonus compared to just let it have any of the shooting weapons).

sgtspiff wrote:
It's a solid list.

I would give d-scythes for one squad of wraithguards so you can drop them off at an objective and let them overwatch stuff to death. Specially the objectives that is close to the enemy infantry.

I do love the swordknight even though internet has deemed it worthless (not enough bonus compared to just let it have any of the shooting weapons).

I was contemplating giving each squad a D-scythe or 2 so that way they can each have some protection from swarming. But it won't really matter seeing that I plan on making every option magnetized, yes even the wraithguards. That way I can go freely experiment on what I should use on what and when with out any of the regret.

D-Scythes are an all or none option.

The Sword Knight is a bad option. Compare for 10 points more you get Suncannon and Scatter Laser. That guy still has the 5++ and is basically exactly the same in combat 1 reroll to hit is all that's different. But rather than 8 S6 Ap- shots you get 4 S6 Ap- and 3 S6 Ap2 twin linked blasts!!! Just massively increases his threat level for just 10 points with no down side.

Also what's your AA plan? Just the 3 Serpents? If so Helldrakes will ruin your day.

The entire squad exchanges for D Scythes or none. Wish we could mix and match.

I think you would be well suited to add Holofield or Ghostwalk matrix to the Wave Serpent to ensure they can get to their desired position.

I don't understand the need for 2 Scatterlasers on the Wraithknight. It appears you want the sword but it only gives a reroll. For 10 extra points you can get stronger shooting and retain the invulnerable save.

I would def add Holo fields to all of the serpents, the 4+ jink save is tremendous

Also, are you likely to get 70 points worth of kills back from each Spiritseer everygame, you're spending a lot of points to reroll maybe one dice per unit per turn.......

 FlingitNow wrote:
D-Scythes are an all or none option.

The Sword Knight is a bad option. Compare for 10 points more you get Suncannon and Scatter Laser. That guy still has the 5++ and is basically exactly the same in combat 1 reroll to hit is all that's different. But rather than 8 S6 Ap- shots you get 4 S6 Ap- and 3 S6 Ap2 twin linked blasts!!! Just massively increases his threat level for just 10 points with no down side.

Also what's your AA plan? Just the 3 Serpents? If so Helldrakes will ruin your day.

I see your point with the sword knight. But if you wouldn't mind telling me what AA means? I'm 100% sure you are not calling me a drunk and I am fairly positive a helldrake won't care if I was intoxicated or not.

Also as for the upgrades to the Serpents, at first I choose not to because I wanted to keep it 1500 pts or less but I am going to up the points to 1600 so I can get the proper fixes.

And the Spiritseers allow my wraith units to have the Battle Focus rule (Iyanden Supplement ) My main reason for so many.

AA means Anti-Air. Basically what is your plan to deal with flyers?

 FlingitNow wrote:
AA means Anti-Air. Basically what is your plan to deal with flyers?

Oh okay, What about reapers? I have been told they are good against flyers.

I also agree with dropping a Spiritseer for some upgrades on Serpents. I would take Holofields over chin cannons on the Serpents too as you'll be usually just snap firing the cannons.

The sword option on the Wraithknight sucks. I personally prefer the two heavy wraithcannons, but in your list that's a bit redundant, so I'd go with suncannon and one scatter laser (for twin-linking goodness).

I would also reconfigure the Swooping Hawks squad. You're blowing fifty points in upgrades on your Exarch. That's a 66 point model. I would much rather have 6+ models for the large blast.

Furthermore, as for the d-scythes, it's all or none, I'm afraid. You can't just give it to a couple of squadmembers.

As for your tactics, Wraithguard are tough. but not invulnerable. Add in the short range of their guns, and they don't make good objective campers. You should use them more actively.

Also, you have three Spiritseers, which I think is a bit excessive for 1500 points as they don't really add anything to your list.

Here's the changes I would make:

Spiritseer 70

3x Wraithguard in Serpents 870

6 Swooping Hawks 96

Wraithknight with suncannon, shield, scatter laser - 300

1336

This leaves a bit of wiggle room. I'd spend it on holofields for the Serpents (45), d-scythes for the unit joined by the Spiritseer (50), an Exarch for the Swoopig Hawks (10) and three Jetbikes (51) with 8 points to spare.

 Crowly wrote:

 FlingitNow wrote:
AA means Anti-Air. Basically what is your plan to deal with flyers?

Oh okay, What about reapers? I have been told they are good against flyers.

Whoever told you that was wrong. Reapers are horrid. The good AA options in the codex are guided/prescienced Warp Spiders or Crimson Hunters. Spiders are the more competitive all round option Hunters require you to remove interceptors and have reserves manipulation. In either case a Mantleseer would be required.

Thud wrote:
The sword option on the Wraithknight sucks. I personally prefer the two heavy wraithcannons, but in your list that's a bit redundant, so I'd go with suncannon and one scatter laser (for twin-linking goodness).

I would also reconfigure the Swooping Hawks squad. You're blowing fifty points in upgrades on your Exarch. That's a 66 point model. I would much rather have 6+ models for the large blast.

Furthermore, as for the d-scythes, it's all or none, I'm afraid. You can't just give it to a couple of squadmembers.

As for your tactics, Wraithguard are tough. but not invulnerable. Add in the short range of their guns, and they don't make good objective campers. You should use them more actively.

Also, you have three Spiritseers, which I think is a bit excessive for 1500 points as they don't really add anything to your list.

Here's the changes I would make:

Spiritseer 70

3x Wraithguard in Serpents 870

6 Swooping Hawks 96

Wraithknight with suncannon, shield, scatter laser - 300

1336

This leaves a bit of wiggle room. I'd spend it on holofields for the Serpents (45), d-scythes for the unit joined by the Spiritseer (50), an Exarch for the Swoopig Hawks (10) and three Jetbikes (51) with 8 points to spare.

Thanks for the detailed input! What weapon on the Serpents would you suggest be best for anti air? Or should I look for a better source like Warp Spiders he suggested?

You wont want to use the shield on Aircraft, just because you're so incredibly likely to miss. Using the SL's hit to Twin Link the Shuriken Cannon will hopefully net you a glance or two on AV12 fliers, if not a pen on the softer ones. If you're really worried about it, I'd go with Twin Linked Bright Lances and Guide from a farseer, although you'll get a ton more mileage from your Wraithguard if they're ever in range. That S10 distort will really put a hurt on the Flyers which are at best AV12. Give them Guide and you should be downing them in 1 turn with a squad or two.

I'd advocate for dropping the Hawks for Warp Spiders. They're great for munching through 5 to 15 man squads and if you use battle focus and their jetpack move well, they are really hard to keep up with in the event that you accidentally leave them out in the open after shooting.

I have to disagree with jberry on everything he said about flyers. Bright lance Serpents don't have enough shots and SL+SC are all S6 which means you'll need to fire ALL your Wave Serpents to glance 1 flyer. Which not only means that flyer continues for 2 more turns unabated but the other flyers your opponent has are completely fine probably for the rest of the game. Given most CSM armies run about 2-3 Helldrakes and could possibly have 4 and 2 FMCs you can't afford to leave yourself that open. Likewise guard generally have at least 3 Vendettas, Necrons will have anything from 3-8 flyers at this point level.

Putting the Wraithknights firepower into the air just wastes a 240 point model. Against flyers you need either volume of preferably S7 shots particularly with guide/prescience or skyfire. SL Serpent should twin link its other weapons with shield and cannon that's on average 13 twin linked shots into the air (4 S7). That is passable AA but for me not main line AA just support AA. 10 Guided Spiders put 20 S7 shots in the air that should cause any flyer a real concern.

 FlingitNow wrote:
I have to disagree with jberry on everything he said about flyers. Bright lance Serpents don't have enough shots and SL+SC are all S6 which means you'll need to fire ALL your Wave Serpents to glance 1 flyer. Which not only means that flyer continues for 2 more turns unabated but the other flyers your opponent has are completely fine probably for the rest of the game. Given most CSM armies run about 2-3 Helldrakes and could possibly have 4 and 2 FMCs you can't afford to leave yourself that open. Likewise guard generally have at least 3 Vendettas, Necrons will have anything from 3-8 flyers at this point level.

Putting the Wraithknights firepower into the air just wastes a 240 point model. Against flyers you need either volume of preferably S7 shots particularly with guide/prescience or skyfire. SL Serpent should twin link its other weapons with shield and cannon that's on average 13 twin linked shots into the air (4 S7). That is passable AA but for me not main line AA just support AA. 10 Guided Spiders put 20 S7 shots in the air that should cause any flyer a real concern.

i agree spiders are amazing AA. espicially guided.

So take Spiders and a Farseer? I'll have to find a way to squeeze them in.

although make sure you can find points for the farseer to have a bike + MOTLG.