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Hi guys,

Here a list for which I need your help, since I'm new to Space Marines.

The objectives behind it are to avoid massive spam, avoid the White Scars sudden bike love but yet to achieve something quite balanced and efficient (I perfectly understand that it's not a ETC-type list but the goal is to make it look like a real Space Marines spearhead or detachment AND to be effective with it).

Some notes at the end of the list too.

1500pts - Space Marines

Tigurius (with the 9-men Tac' Squad)

Tactical Squad, 9-strong, with Rhino, Combi-Grav, Grav-Gun

Tactical Squad, 10-strong, with Rhino, Combi-Melta, Melta, Multi-Melta

TFC, Drop Pod (Empty Drop Podwill be dropped in turn 1. TFC to be deployed as standard)

Sternguard Vets Squad, 10-strong, Drop Pod, 5 Combi-Melta (dropped in subsequent turn, 2 teams of 5 men)

Stormraven, Twin-linked Las-Cannon, Multi-Melta (act as anti-air hunter + anti-armored vehicle, while transporting the Assault Squad)

Vanguard Vets Squad. 6-strong, Powerweapon + Stormshield, Powerfist + Stormshield, 6 Jetpacks (will most likely (multi-)charge a high value target(s) left in enemy's backfield)

Actual total: 1403

Here's a few options I have identified. Feel free to give me yours, for I'm completely unaware of what the list is lacking of:

1) Spend the 97 pts in :
a) Deathwind on the 1st DP, Hurricane bolters sponsons on the Stormraven, few other things here and there.
b) New 5-man Tac Squad + Rhino, or footed 10-strong
c) Improve to hell the Sternguard Vets
d) others that you might think about

--or--

2) Remove Tigurius, freeing a total of 262pts and use them to
a) Take a Librarian fully stock, and a Company Command Squad on bikes with Gravguns all the way
b) others, according to what the list might lack according to your experience.

Bonus Final question: if Tigurius is removed, what Chapter would you recommand to go for ? Initial thoughts were either on WS for the scout move or to Iron Hands for IWND and the 6+ FnP

Thank you so much in advance (and sorry for the poor english level... that little flag next to my name means I'm no expert here neither )

Why drop in TFC? It won't shoot first turn. Instead use the 97 points to get 5 battle brothers with combi-melta and meltagun, and give them the drop pod.

To me turn 1 alpha strike is very important. The above will help you with that, much more than the rhino squads which will not be able to use their short ranged weaponry until turn 2 or 3 for full effect.

Driving a rhino up turn 1 for grav fun sounds like a plan though. Opponent can try to destroy it and kill the marines inside, but will take a lot of firepower. The risk is he will succeed and you will be a squad down.

Well, I intended to drop an empty Drop Pod on turn 1, to allow the 2nd Drop Pod (the one with Sternguard Vets) to arrive in the following turns). I corrected my initial intentions on OP, on the TFC line.

I must admit I'm tempted to use a "higher impact 1st turn drop pod action" with some "suicide units" to target the key elements of the enemy. But I guess this is not very "fluffy", to send battlebrothers to die...

I would definitely try and squeeze in another drop pod, and give the thunderfire's to another unit. Having 3 drop pods is infinitely better than having 2, as you get 2 on turn one. I'm not sure why you want the sternguard to come in later - surely they are better as a turn-one alpha strike?

With the previous codex, I found 10 sternguard was a bit overkill. You could instead do 2 squads of 7 sternguard in pods (that both come down turn one and slag tanks) and then a third pod with a combat squad to come in later to claim objectives. Just my opinion anyway.

Tigerius, despite his points drop, is quite an expensive HQ at this points level.

The objective is not to have a strong alpha-strike. That's the reason why I send an empty Drop Pod 1st.

Most of my firepower will be ready to bring the pain around turn 2 (Rhino moving 12"+6" on turn 1 plus another 6", then squad deployed 6" away from the transport will bring me in good position to unleash some serious firestorm. Add to this the arrival of the Stormraven. So that's the moment I want my Sternguard to arrive, joining their guns to the bolts party.

My fear is that if I send my Sternguard in Drop Pod on turn 1, they'll find themselves completely isolated from the rest of the army, in range from a good portion of the enemy units and will most likely be focused down to hell by my opponent...

What would you recommand for HQ ? some good "points value"/effectiveness ratio out there ?

Yeah 1st turn alpha strike is not always the best thing. Sometimes its better to drop the chaff(empty drop pod in this case) and let the opponent move forward or get their own reserves in to hit them then. Its situational.

I actually like the idea of dropping the empty pod. You can use it as LOS blocking or a speed bump for a CC army to have to go around. Then dropping the sternguard in concert with your tac marines hitting their lines for an awesome 2nd turn. I think its a pretty good idea.

 squall018 wrote:
I actually like the idea of dropping the empty pod. You can use it as LOS blocking or a speed bump for a CC army to have to go around. Then dropping the sternguard in concert with your tac marines hitting their lines for an awesome 2nd turn. I think its a pretty good idea.

That's exactly the spirit. I'm also considering installing a Deathwind Launcher on the empty drop pod. So, in turn one, my opponent will get a nasty annoying empty pod, blocking his LOS and poping a S5 pie-plate in his face each turn if he doesn't take it down. So either a) he must redirect a part of his dakkadakka on a wonderful 35pts-worth empty piece of metal or b) shoot on my Rhinos, offering them at least a 5+ Coversave (since I don't know if one can shoot THROUGH an opened DP - or if you can keep it closed) or no LOS at all and enjoy a regular S5 green disk on his lads.

Well used, this "mobile" piece of terrain can give me at worst some cover and best 1 or 2 turns of "lesser dakka on my face"...

Since my Drop Pods seems to be the center of all the attention, may I conclude the rest of the list seems pretty solid (or at least decent) ?

Thanks in advance for all your feedbacks and opinions !

Edit: well, actually it's a tiny bit more than 35pts with the Deathwind but hey, still really cheap