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In terms of ranged offense, Wraithguard have 2 options, Wraithcannons or D-Scythes.

Wraithcannons are 12" S10 and AP2 which also cause ID/Autopen on a 6.

D-Scythes are a template (8.5"~) S4 AP2 which also cause ID/Autopen on a 6.

Both are very strong in their own way and since you can have 5 man units as troops in Serpents, the range of the weapons is not as much of an issue anymore. Wraithcannons excel at taking out armor and high T units/MCs and S10 is a very scary S threshold to throw down on the table. D-Scythes Excel at taking out infantry-especially anything with a 2+ save and can even threaten MCs and vehicles with a lucky 6 while also being a very scary unit to charge thanks to their wall of death.

Therefore, I'm wondering what people think in terms of including Wraithcannons and D-Scythes in any combination when taking multiple units of Wraithguard?

Specifically:

(1) How would you equip the Wraithguard when taking 2 units in Serpents?

(2) How would you equip the Wraithguard when taking 3+ units in Serpents?


Personally, I think if only 1 unit, take D-Scythes. If multiple units, perhaps a mix of the two weapons is ideal. I'm jumping between 2 D-scythes or 1 of each myself if only 2 units are taken and if 3, probably 1 of each for sure with the 3rd one being D-Scythes if I have the points.

I don't see how you can't run both. 12" vs. 8.5 for the template. I think both have a place in a list. unless you want to take firedragons still as your anti super tank weapon still (WC still work better vs. stormravens and the like especially with rerolls)

D SCYTHES. are freaking amazing. probally because 8/9 of the players in my meta are marine players, but still....

2 5 man squads of d scythes in serpents demolish anything. if you need anti tank, just get war walekrs.

D-scythes make everything cry thanks to distortion and template. Hordes, elites, vehicles, when used en masse it kills them all.

It's a tough choice as D-Cannon Wraithguard are supremely effective against vehicles.

For extra points and shorter range the D-Scythes are supremely effective against everything else.

Their roles are opposed but, they are very good at each role; so making the choice between the 2 is entirely dependant on what the rest of the army looks like.

Don't get me wrong, D scythes are incredible but I usually prefer wraithcannons. That said, this is mostly due to how I run my wraithguard. If I am on foot 10 strong, I need the extra range of the cannon, albeit small. I usually do 5 in a serpent with a spirit seer for psychic buffing and maybe some shooting support(psychic shriek). Since I go shooty, the spirit mark boosts the ability of the wraithcannons and ensures they connect. D scythes can't benefit from this.

Even if I run 2 squads of wraithguard, I usually run 2 spiritseers. I could run 5-6 wraithguard with D scythes, but I could just have another spiritseer for the cost. When I have points, I sometimes run d scythes but it is rare I can get enough to do so.

I run 2 squads of Wraithguard with Wraithcannons in Wave Serpents and 1 Squad with D-Scythes at the 1500 - 1850 range.

I tend to see a lot of either multiple-wound tanky characters (i.e, the Tau Buff'Mander) or an ample supply of MCs (Wraithknights/Riptides etc) so I've always valued the Wraithcannon over the D-Scythes simply due to the fact that even if the don't ID something, they are still S10 AP2 which is great for taking down big beasties.

Iranna.

As a marine player, I can tell you that when I see D-Scythes they become a priority target just behind the Suncannon.

A Wraithguard unit in a Wave Serpent with D-Scythes have ruined my plans on several occasions. The AP2 template with a T6 model behind it is just evil.

I do have to concur with others -- I think one of each unit toting D-Scythes and Wraithcannons is the way to go in a TAC style list (and is typically how I've faced it on numerous occasions).

D-Scythes have less range but are just as good as wraith cannons but in a different way. Against Orks, Nids, Guard and other warmies that like to swarm the flamers just cant be beat. 5 flame templates hitting 3-5 guys each wipes out a unit fast. On the other hand the Wraith cannon is very good against single targets including high toughness models due to the high STR they have. That being said in my 4500 point game I have this Sunday I am running 3 full troops of wraithguard against orks. 2 squads will be using the D-Scythe.

 NickTheButcher wrote:
As a marine player, I can tell you that when I see D-Scythes they become a priority target just behind the Suncannon.

A Wraithguard unit in a Wave Serpent with D-Scythes have ruined my plans on several occasions. The AP2 template with a T6 model behind it is just evil.

I do have to concur with others -- I think one of each unit toting D-Scythes and Wraithcannons is the way to go in a TAC style list (and is typically how I've faced it on numerous occasions).

my whole merta is marines.... hence why i love my d scythes so much. ^^^^

I can see people have generally realized how devastating D-Scythes can be. There are time when my D-Scythes have absolutely devastated units and it is glorious!

However, in my particular case, I ended up going for 1 unit of each so that I would have points to get holofields on the serpents . In the future, I'll prob do 2 scythes and 2 regular in serpents with some spiritseers thrown in for some psychic shriek to spread around. Throw in some wraithknights and I think that's a fun and solid army.

D-Scythes scare the hell out of MCs charging, Have killed a brood of MCs on the charge before.

D-Scythes are simply amazing, full stop. They're that good that taking two units would seem to be a bit of overkill, unless you're facing large hordes. HOWEVER the one thing they're not all that fantastic at (anti-tank) is dealt with brilliantly by wraithcannons instead. The former are also no good against flyers at all, whereas the latter can at least snap-shot.

So, taking one unit of each is something of a no-brainer, that way you have all bases covered. If I only had enough for one unit I'd go for the Scythes.

I like to run Scythes on the Wraithguard and leave the D-cannons to the Wraithknights.

I always go with the D-Scythes. I don't need Wraithguard to go MC hunting, or even tank hunting (War Walkers/Wraith Knights handle that). Even if I do, and if for sake of argument range is not a factor (since we've all got our guys in Wave Serpents....) you've got more of a chance to ID the MC with D-Scythes than you do with Wraithcannons (by about 30%), and if you don't ID it you'll get charged and killed on the next turn unless you're packing D-Scythes in which case you're twice as likely to cause ID (meaning no one with a non-eternal warrior MC should EVER charge 4+ D-Scythes). Vehicles obviously fear the Wraithcannons more than the D-Scythes, but again, that's why I take War Walkers.

 Jabeedo wrote:
I always go with the D-Scythes. I don't need Wraithguard to go MC hunting, or even tank hunting (War Walkers/Wraith Knights handle that). Even if I do, and if for sake of argument range is not a factor (since we've all got our guys in Wave Serpents....) you've got more of a chance to ID the MC with D-Scythes than you do with Wraithcannons (by about 30%), and if you don't ID it you'll get charged and killed on the next turn unless you're packing D-Scythes in which case you're twice as likely to cause ID (meaning no one with a non-eternal warrior MC should EVER charge 4+ D-Scythes). Vehicles obviously fear the Wraithcannons more than the D-Scythes, but again, that's why I take War Walkers.

Why do you think that you're more likely to ID a MC with a D-Scythe than a Wraithcannon? *with regular shooting*

Because you don't have to roll to hit with a d-scythe. With BS4 you miss 1/3 of all shots hence the 33.3333333333333333%, which Jabeedo shortened to "about 30%".

Still, it ignores that some MCs are T5 *cough cough Riptide* so every shot causes ID with the Wraithcannon.

Riptide is T6 but has 5 Wounds. However, a lot of the scary MCs for Eldar are Demon Princes and they are T5 so that is a bonus. Not to mention anything on a bike or Centurions/Obliterators being ID with the Wraithcannon.

Ultimately, the wounding on a 2+ via S10 might outweigh the 6 needed from the D-Scythes. It depends entirely on the target and situation.

I've always kinda felt that the D-Cannon is more of an offensive weapon, with the Scythe being better for defence; particularly obliteratey in Overwatch... I haven't had a chance to try either yet, but my thinking is to use the Cannons if I was Serpenting them up to try and kill stuff, with the Scythes if I want them to take and hold objectives...