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Made in us
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot






Schrott

Engage mass SM defense by rabid fans, IG defense by facts and all kinds of general hell.
But I will say this.
A Baneblade is known as the most powerful battle tank in the Imperium, and there are more Baneblades in service then there are Space Marines. Not counting the different baneblade varients.
Made in us
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot






Schrott

Lets set some ground rules.
The SM don't have their space ships. Cause then the Navy would get involved (and once again its a matter of superior numbers and Anti ship weapons).
The fighting is on the ground. Lets just say in a vacuum without all the rest of 40k getting involved (xenos, chaos etc) they fight on a battle field large enough to support all SM and All IG (and their equipment and all needed ammo and supplies)

My arguments against Librarians. IG have more psykers, perhaps not as powerful but there are far more then them, plus I've read about anti psyker weapons, such as tank shells infused with a psyker crystal that prevents the psyker form acting upon the shell (it was used to disable and destroy a Weirdboy Gargant in "Baneblade"), so I'm sure the anti psyker weapons would fry the librarians, especially when used in the sheer numbers the guard have.

Arguments against the main characters: they will be flattened by the unending numbers of troops and tanks. If not already turned to paste under the unrelenting bombardment of artillery. Their only saving grace was their plot armor.

Tank vs Tank:
Land Raiders are powerful yes, But when something is RARE in SM then its REALLY REALLY REALLY RARE. If something is "Rare" in IG, that means there are Millions of them, but since there are trillions+ of guard then even then not everyone will get one, much like Baneblades, they are "Rare" but there are still more Baneblades then there are Landraiders by far.... There are more Chimeras then there are rhinos or razorbacks, there are more Leman Russ Tanks then there are Predators and so on.
heck I think the only IG thing that is "rare" and doesn't out number the SM things are Vortex Deathstrike missiles..... but there are possibly still thousands of them.....

Troop vs Troops:
While yes 1 SM is worth something like 10 to 1000 guardsmen there are still billions more....
Then there are Storm troopers, Ogryn, and so much more.

"Killing high command"
Well.... still more Commanders then there are space marines. Plus they are trained to take command should Sarge fall. And do you really think that the team of space marines sent to kill X commander would get through it all without casualties? Not when there are thousands of guardsmen around them and then some.

"We have aircraft! like thunder hawks!, Valks are part of the navy!"
Some Valks are permanently attached to guard regiments (rare but it happens), plus im sure we have enough Hydras and just plain bullets that Thunderhawks and storm ravens and whatever else will be shredded to tiny pieces by the wall of rounds going skyward.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/09/24 19:57:22


 
Made in us
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot






Schrott

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Virus_bomb#.UkIBNyPD-M8

I quote from lexicanum
"The virus [The Life-Eater Virus from Virus bombs] can penetrate power armour and rebreathers."
So good luck melting yourself space marines......


Made in us
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot






Schrott

 TheSaintofKilllers wrote:
 Engine of War wrote:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Virus_bomb#.UkIBNyPD-M8

I quote from lexicanum
"The virus [The Life-Eater Virus from Virus bombs] can penetrate power armour and rebreathers."
So good luck melting yourself space marines......



Didn't 2/3 of the marines survive the Istvaan 5 virus bombings?


http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Isstvan_III#.UkICySPD-M8

once again quote lexicanum.

"Captain Saul Tarvitz of the Emperor's Children, working on a hunch, had managed to remain in the fleet, where he discovered the planned bombardment and commandeered a Thunderhawk to save his betrayed brethren. Thanks to Tarvitz's warning, a few hundred loyal Space Marines managed to survive inside airtight bunkers and bomb shelters. As the putrid gases resulting from the rapidly decaying organic matter filled the atmosphere, Horus ignited a firestorm on the planet which melted the hives and razed the cities. The psychic death scream of the twelve billion is said to have been louder than the Astronomican[1][2][3].

Despite this, many loyalists of the four Legions managed to survive, and an enraged Angron, acting against Horus's orders, led his Legion to the surface to slaughter the survivors. Horus, trying to salvage the situation, sent detachments of all his Legions to slay the Loyalists. The Loyalists, fighting tenaciously, turned the planned slaughter into a full-scale battle. Under the command of Captains Garviel Loken and Tarik Torgaddon of the Sons of Horus (redubbed the Luna Wolves), Saul Tarvitz of the Emperor's Children, and Ehrlen of the World Eaters, the loyalists were able to mount a surprising defence in the ruins of the capital city. Ultimately, the Loyalists were crushed, in part to Lucius's betrayal and the orbital bombardment of the Choral City, but made Horus pay dearly. The battle lasted for three months and inflicted huge losses upon the traitors. It was a Pyrrhic victory at best. While the battle raged upon the planet, a handful of loyalists led by Captain Nathaniel Garro of the Death Guard managed to commandeer the frigate Eisenstein and fled to warn the Emperor of Horus's betrayal. "

Only a handful who fled on the frigate. which is a lot less then 2/3rds. And those who survived the Vbombs survived by airtight bunkers... not their power armor alone.
Made in us
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot






Schrott

It comes down to who writes it and who are the main characters.
SM main characters?
IG/PDF die in droves to make bad guys seem powerful vs SM characters who then swoop in and win the day,

IG main characters?
SM are powerful but IG are still highly trained, intelligent and powerful in their own right, high casualties in IG is just a way off life, but beating opponents that even SM would find tough makes them all the much more heroic.


Read both sides of the story (i.e read both SM and IG novels)

Not all IG are incompetent. Some are capable of putting down full blown demon incursions or other acts of gods just like SM.
Made in us
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot






Schrott

Most claims are that Baneblades are often rarely seen and those who have them have 1 to 10 under their command with "very few" regiments having them.
Consider there are Billions or more regiments and that "very few" in terms of billions can number in the upper hundred thousands to low ten millions (or more, this is a really low and rough estimate)


Lets say that about 500,000 regiments have access to 5 Baneblades each.
That's about 2,500,000 or 2 Million 5 hundred thousand Baneblade Super Tanks.

This does not count all of the Baneblades varients.
With the Standard Baneblade there is the Banehammer, HellHammer, Stormblade, StormSword, Shadowsword, StormHammer, Stormlord and Banesword.

Each of which carries a weapon that can easily turn any space marine into dust, if not enough firepower from secondary weapons alone to vaporize space marines.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/09/24 23:19:15


 
 
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