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How useful are they??

I've been running 5 PMs with 2 Plasma guns in a Rhino.

But they rarely do anything for the entire game besides getting their rhino blown up and then foot slogging for the rest of the game.

And the occasion of the plasma killing themselves :/

But yeah, I'm not really sure what to think of this unit as they don't do anything particularly good besides survive.

The reason I like them is for the relic as once they grab the relic they are pretty much solid for the rest of the game.

Plague marines survive and are scoring. That's pretty much what they do.

Can't 5 plague marines have two plasma guns?

Where are you starting the unit?

If you start them in the middle of the board then you move forward 6" with the rhino, jump out 6" into some cover, and then you have occupied the exact center of the board. From there you control most of the board making it impossible for the opponent to move around freely and firing your 24" range guns on the majority of the board surface.

If you are outside of range and need to go further you should move the rhino 12" and then flatout another 6". The next turn you will get another 6" at least even if the rhino dies. If you start at your edge of deployment zone that is 12" into the opponent deployment zone(ie either 12" or 24" from their board edge).

Plague marines are great, the problem your having sounds like the rhino not the marine. As stated, rushing em up to midfield(where plague marines excel) is a good call, and if you only have one rhino then that's why it is going down. They need saturation or they pick easy.

Once plague marines can dominate the midfield, they are fairly hard to stop. Dakka with special weapons, great survivability and fantastic CC that deters all but the strongest melee units.

I run 3-5 MSU Plagues in my typical lists. Delivering high density special weapons on resilient scoring units is usually pretty good. You just want to make sure your list as a whole has a lot of similarly annoying-to-kill units like Obliterators. The relative scarcity of quality light and medium armor in the CSM book means you really do need to spam rhinos to get any to live long enough to deliver the special weapons at point blank.

 GreyHamster wrote:
I run 3-5 MSU Plagues in my typical lists. Delivering high density special weapons on resilient scoring units is usually pretty good. You just want to make sure your list as a whole has a lot of similarly annoying-to-kill units like Obliterators. The relative scarcity of quality light and medium armor in the CSM book means you really do need to spam rhinos to get any to live long enough to deliver the special weapons at point blank.

You can keep RHinos alive longer by running a pair of Maulerfiends. They tend to draw all the AT fire their way, and rightly so. Problem is, once you've got them on the board, you tend to want to start pushing the MTO envelope further and further (not that that's a bad thing)

I have to agree with GreyHamster. You have to understand that your going to be facing for the most part lascannons (str 9) and then the next tier of weapons (str 6-7). Every list needs the ability to take out AV 14, and lascannons are normally the best bet at range. When you don't run AV 14, they go down to the next viable vehicle target, aka transports, or things like MCs, Oblits, so on and so forth. They will still have a bunch of Str 6-7 weapons even if they have better targets to shoot at, as those weapons are normally used for transport poppers or MC killers, depending on the AP (Plasma vs Autocannons).

Because of this general theory of weapon load-out, your best counter is to spam a AV type or don't run vehicles. You will probably need 4+ Rhinos to have some alive to last more than 2 shooting turns against your average gunline, and that is if they roll below average without any other valuable targets to also draw fire (Terminators, MCs, Oblits, etc). This can be expensive depending on your point limits. Your other real option is to run heavy slots with vehicles or the like to give your list and thus your Plage marines survivability.

If you don't run vehicles, the points spent on Rhinos can go back into the troops. Then all lascannon fire does then is kill a Plague marine (and you still get FNP because your not doubled up). Plague Marines can still run, and if you can't shoot anything, run them. Technically your moving just as fast as you would in a rhino anyways, you just have a few more bodies to absorb the extra fire. Besides, Rhinos are also a victory point.

Of course this is the reason why there are Chaos LR lists out there. But I feel without POTMS that they are lacking and your wasting a ton of points on something that might not even shoot.

I run usually 2 - 3 squads of 7x Plague marines each in a rhino. Surprisingly, in my last two games, my rhinos didn't explode. They were glanced to death, but I usually expect at least one to blow up very quickly. Usually move 12", then pop smoke, hopefully in cover. Then move 6" and disembark.

I guess they are the type of unit that increases efficiency as you spam more of them.

I'm personally just not a huge fan of the Rhino, it just dies most of the time...

But yeah, I tend to use it to flank people instead of controlling midground, I guess they'll be a useful unit to guard mid-field.

 Makutsu wrote:
I guess they are the type of unit that increases efficiency as you spam more of them.

I'm personally just not a huge fan of the Rhino, it just dies most of the time...

But yeah, I tend to use it to flank people instead of controlling midground, I guess they'll be a useful unit to guard mid-field.

Rhino's are a 12" first turn move and mobile cover. If you think of them as such they work well.

That is your problem. They are not a finesse or flanking unit. They are a tough board control unit. They just don't have the damage or speed to make an effective scapel...so you have a hammer.

Fire two plasma guns from the top of the rhino till it explodes, then have your Pam's capture forward objectives.
Don't expect 3 bolters and 2 Pgs to accomplish amazing things, but 3-4 squads of these are tough to move for the points.

Personally i prefer noise marines, because blastmasters make tau and eldar cry

Plague marines may not be killing much, but they certainly do not die. 2 plasma gun squads are great, but naked 5 man squads are a relatively cheap scoring unit that will not be a high priority for your enemy, and will likely never be destroyed all game.
I prefer to run them without rhinos as well. The rhinos seem like a waste, and plague marines have all the time in the world to move around the board.