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Ok, was doing some tactic chatting, and someone has pointed me in the direction of the imperial armour Wraithseer. The group of friends I play with have absolutely no problems with imperial armour additions and forge world models, so I thought I'd get a feel for the list on here. I want to know if it is a viable list, or a waste of points? I'm a little short on numbers, but with 4 MC's and 3 serpents alone I should be able to deal with a lot. My only other curiosity is who to make my warlord.

Anyway, here goes,

HQ

Farseer 135 Pts (Current warlord & Joins avengers)
Singing spear + Wraith forge stone

Wraithseer 225 Pts (Imperial armour)
D-Cannon

Spiritseer 70 Pts (Joins Wraithguard)

Warlock 35 Pts (Joins guardians)

TROOPS

10 x Guardian defenders 250 Pts
Heavy weapon platform - Shuriken Cannon, Wave serpent with TL SL, holo field + Shuriken Cannon

9 x Dire Avengers + Exarch 305 Pts
Shimmershield & power sword, Wave serpent with TL SL, holo field + Shuriken Cannon

5 x Wraithguard 355 Pts
D-Scythes, Wave serpent with TL SL, holo field + Shuriken Cannon

3 x Windrider Jetbikes 61 Pts
Shuriken Cannon

HEAVY SUPPORT

Wraithlord 160 Pts
2 x Bright Lances

Wraithlord 160 Pts
2 x Bright Lances

Wraithknight 240 Pts

I only number 39 models, but with the four MC's there is enough toughness 8 wounds to worry any army, even tau. The idea being a walking wall of wraith lords, with the avengers behind in the serpent, the Farseer using his wraith forge stone to gain wounds back. If the avengers get out, which they might, they have a 5++ from the shimmershield! and can start throwing around things like guide. The defenders will be for an objective, with the warlock using conceal to make them difficult to remove, the wraith guard are there to shift any enemy's held up in decent cover. The bikes are late turn objective grabbers, and the wraithknight can jump around being all wraithknighty causing havoc. The MC's can deal with pretty much anything, and the serpents are good for hitting infantry, add the avengers shurikens to that, and even the scythes and infantry really shouldn't be a problem.

I'm very interested to hear what people think I will struggle against!

Thanks!

For your warlord - the spirit seer is in a tougher squad, but they'll get everything shooting at them.
The Wraithseer in IA 11 (the only diff between this and the one in imperial armour apoc is the fnp has gone to a 5+) has a rule which states "may not be used to fulfil the mandatory HQ slot" so I think potentially RAI your farseer should be your warlord - BUT there is nothing stopping this RAW as far as I know.

The only thing I see hurting this list are things like sternguard with flamers drop podding and melting your guardians or melta'ing your wave serpents on turn one before you get chance to move to get the holo fields going. Thats what I hate on the table anyway.

I like the list

Sweet, cheers dude. The Farseer will prob have the protection of the avengers, and they all have 5++. The IA FAQ updat I have says the FNP is 4+, and it's the 6th ed update as it updates all the psychic powers to fit the current edition. I'm using the IA 11 book, plus the FAQ update.

Hopefully its going to be a relatively fun and competitive list!

Khaine's Wrath wrote:
Sweet, cheers dude. The Farseer will prob have the protection of the avengers, and they all have 5++. The IA FAQ updat I have says the FNP is 4+, and it's the 6th ed update as it updates all the psychic powers to fit the current edition. I'm using the IA 11 book, plus the FAQ update.

Hopefully its going to be a relatively fun and competitive list!

In Imperial armour apocalypse, the fnp has changed to a 5+

They've got the rules on the forgeworld site - the part where they are advertising the book. If your eyesight is any good On the page with the wraithseer on, its a 5+. Its a newer book :(
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Imperial_Armour_Books/IMPERIAL_ARMOUR_APOCALYPSE.html

So is this now the book to use?


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I can't find a PDF download for my iPad anywhere!


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Ok, he's still pretty cool, but it doesn't give him ranges on his psychic powers, and he can't take a D-Cannon anymore!

That's got to be a mistake. I bought imp armour apoc today and you're right, its not listed. But the Wraithseer is equipped with it in the pic and you get the head, spear and the d-cannon in the upgrade kit.
I'm going to use the mymeara rules but reduce the fnp rp a 5+ until I hear back from forgeworld. I'm going to email them to confirm it either way.

Sweet. Can you let me know if you hear anything? I'm going to buy the model soon. The apoc book does allow you to take a heavy wraith cannon, which is tasty-ish. But jaws excited about a D-Cannon shot!

At least its better than what happened to the warp hunter. That lost torrent, its ap2 and they gave st7 where it used to just hurt on a 2+ previously. It also went up 30 points...I'm selling mine now. Never did get round to making it lol.
On the wraithseer, If I can't have a d-cannon, I'll be using a wraithcannon. It gets a better range and its st10 still.

Comparing mymeara and ia apoc, its lost its cover reducing power, its gained spirit mark and sunder and its lost its range on the blessings it can cast...as in there is no range listed now, so they've got a lot better - its fnp or fleet on any unit on the table now... That combined with its longer ranged wraithcannon means I think it'll actually be more use now.
Still want my d-cannon back though.
I emailed yesterday, I'll let you know if I hear anything

Yeah, I think he's still worth taking! I thank you for pointing me towards him!

As for the list, I've made some adjustments....

I've dropped the guardians and their serpent, along with their warlock, and the jetbikes (I know they're awesome, but I hate the models!) as I'm trying to make the list really fluffy. In their place I have an upgraded spear for the Farseer ghost walk matrix on the 2 remaining serpents, and 2 x 5 Wraithguard with cannons. My rate of fire drops, but power increases! And it means more wraiths! Keep them close to the spiritseer in the serpent so they all get voice of twilight with a walking wall of MC's behind. Basically keep them all close for Farseer, spirit seer and spirit mark bonuses and have a walking wall of death!


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Does the Wraithseer benefit from spirit mark?

well i like that original list, but drop dire avengers down to a 5 man unit, no need to waste points.

Well, the list is a totally different shape now!

Farseer
Wraith forge stone
Guardian helm

Spiritseer

Spiritseer

5 Wraithblades
Axes

5 Wraithguard
Scythes and serpent with TL SL, Shuricannon, holo's

5 Wraithguard

5 Wraithguard

5 Wraithguard

Wraithlord
2 star cannons

Wraithlord
2 star cannons

Wraithlord
2 bright lances

Wraithknight
Heavy cannons.

It's 2000 points exactly....and lots of ghost warriors!


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The Farseer will live in the blades unit, should almost never die! Haha!

1 spiritseer in scythes, 1 in another guard squad. Keep foot wraiths and lords all around the foot seer, battle focus and furious charge everywhere. Should be vile!

drop 5 gun wraiths to give combat wraiths more men.

then consider some wa yto keep other wraiths alive (preferably wave serpents) or, drop those and make another axe/sheild unit to foostie it across the bouard, and make all wriath lords have X2 BLs, and you should have your anti tank covered.

I don't think either of those suggestions are worth it. If I increase the farseers body guard, I start tying up far too many points to just keep him alive, which is essentially they're job. I'm not overly interested in CC in 6th ed, since it's terrible. I did consider dropping one unit of foot guard, down to only 4 troop choices, but gives a unit of foot guard a serpent. But that reduces my infantry to 4 units, and means I have 10 wraiths marching other than 15.

In game, I think this lists greatest challenge will be overcoming the low model count - I wouldn't drop it any further.

I like the idea of the WS - but you've only got one. I think that'll get targeted immediately by your opponants. Thats what I'd do at least. Every man and his dog knows D-sycthes in WS = Kill it with fire. Although if you can get the cover save going, you may be able to force your oppo to waste a lot of firepower on killing it, hopefully getting the rest of your wraiths nearer.
I'd be tempted to put more bodies in - for the price of that serpent, you can get another 5 wraithguard. I'd almost be tempted to make a 10 man axe squad with the farseer. T6, 4++ and fortune if you can get it would provide a very tempting target for a lot of armies (and it will take ages to kill it -especially if you get fortune)
I've had success with 10 man WG in the past, people fixated on killing them at the detriment of taking objectives etc and winning the game
In 6th (pre codex) I took two farseers, the wraithseer and 10 WG - I had conceal, invisibilty, fortune and 4+ FNP (so 2+ re-roll/4+fnp). Most people tried to kill it for a whole game, even though it didn't really do anything and they'dve been better ignoring it.
I do think the WS has merit though - although with only having 1 ws on the table, I'd keep it in reserve. By turn two/3 something should be in range for you to burn and it'd negate things like pods trying to take it out for an easy first blood on turn one.

I considered keeping him in reserve! I do have the exact same fear as you have said, but in my experience so far, a lot if that turn 1 & 2 firepower has been pumped into the wraithknight & lords! Letting the serpent get its shields going, and allowing the scythes to get that little bit closer!

Khaine's Wrath wrote:
I considered keeping him in reserve! I do have the exact same fear as you have said, but in my experience so far, a lot if that turn 1 & 2 firepower has been pumped into the wraithknight & lords! Letting the serpent get its shields going, and allowing the scythes to get that little bit closer!

Fair enough

My opponants when I used wraithwall always focussed on my troops first - if you can't score, you can't win...


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WOO! I literally just got an email back from forgeworld about the wraithseer!

Forgeworld wrote:
Thank you for your email. You should replace the option for the wraithcannon with a d-cannon,same points cost, in your rulebook.This will be noted in a forthcoming FAQ.

I know its a bit late and you aren't taking one now...but better late than never

That's cool! I'm going to get one as an option. Always nice to have variation! Happy with that though.