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I can't seem to win with my Tau army ! At the beginning of the month i took part in our own tournament of 8, and everything seemed to go wrong ! Game 1, Chaos Demons, and a great big flying Daemon Prince. This was actually the closest game, it was The Scouring, we both finished off the majority of each other's troops, however i didn't pay enough attention to 3 nurglings camping on the highest value objective, and i lost. Next game, The Relic, against Space Marines. Starts off well, with an overcharged Riptide shot i destroy one squad of troops and the enemy warlord. I also grab linebreaker by outflanking Fire Warriors into the enemy base with Darkstrider. But everything went DAMN WRONG, much to my extreme annoyance -_-. A land raider unloaded a squad of troops to grab the Relic, they re-embark next turn, and even though the LR had to move slowly in order to avoid losing the Relic, both my Riptide AND Hammerhead failed to do anything, giving me a draw ! WTF ! Next game was the worst though, vs Eldar, Big Guns Never Tire. I give the opponent initiative, planning to get in the first shots as he moves out of cover. Turn 1, his Prism tank blew up my Hammerhead. Most of his stuff gets halfway across the board. I lay down some Riptide overcharge fire, pretty much it as parts of the army were still skimming cover. Turn 2, they all get into range, damn Shuriken fire from multiple sources and whatever the hell else kill ALL my troops, 2 of my 3 XV8's. These are 1000 pt games, bear in mind. When i get my turn i manage to bring it around a bit, my Sun Shark arrives and manages to blow %&$* up, and my Riptide has some more fun. Outflanking Darkstrider with FW's die quickly because some bikers manage to get to them, shoot, then assault them. In the long run, it was likely i would have finished off the rest of his units. However it was impossible to win with my only tank and troops gone.

And yesterday really put me over the edge, a battle against Necrons, 1500 pts. In my first turn, Riptide overcharges and kills nearly all of a necron squad. A FW squad finishes off the rest, but the Overlord can come back regardless with Ever Living. Elsewhere, two squads of lychguard advance. Long story short, my entire army is in the process of being melee'd to death, there is really no-where i can maneuver, my opponent suggested we play Dawn of War, both using the long sides of the table. Well, i didn't realise this was a blatant way of giving himself a massive advantage. His flyer kills both my Hammerhead and almost insta-kills my Riptide, thank god i remembered that i payed for 2 shielded missile drones. That game never finished, but by the looks of it there is really no point finishing it off. So what can i do ? The only model that actually seems to pull it's weight and kick arse is the Riptide. All the troops DIE quickly, i can't move them out of my base as they will DIE even faster. The Hammerhead is useful, submunition shots do come in handy, i always keep it back to take advantage of it's range but it still gets destroyed quite easily. XV8 squad, all with Missile Pod/Plasma Rifle, ought to be killing machines, but they seem to miss enough shots in a way that they don't seem to make an impact. The Sunshark, like the Hammerhead, is quite useful too. But in my Necron game, a direct hit of the bomb killed a grand total of 2 necron troops. I know they're supposed to be for horde armies but none of our tournament use those type of armies, bar 1. And the Pathfinders, well, i don't use their markerlights as nearly as much as i should, and i can never seem to get them in a defensible position, the nature of Outflank means i'm always coming onto the board in full view of everything. I also have a Pirahna with fusion blaster, but on it's own, naturally it's only going to kill one thing, and i didn't use it in any of my 1000 pt games and i didnt get a chance to use it in my 1500 pt game against the Necrons because there's not really much point finishing that game. The rest of the points, pay for 4 squads of 6 FW's, as well as a lot of upgrades across all the units, 1 thing i think is obvious is that i spend a lot on vehicle battle systems, FW Shas'ui markerlights, without them ever being useful. SO here's the list:

HQ:

Darkstrider
Armour: Recon
Weapons/Equipment: Pulse Carbine, Photon Grenades, Blacksun filter, Markerlight, Structural Analyser
Special Rules: Independent Character, Outflank, Scouts, Supporting Fire, Fight on Foot, Fighting Retreat
100 pts

Heavy Support:

Hammerhead Gunship
Weapons: Railgun (with submunition shots), Twin-linked Smart Missile System
Special Rules: Disruption Pod

145 pts
Elites:

XV104 Riptide
Armour: Riptide battlesuit
Weapons/Equipment: Ion accelerator, Twin-linked Smart missile system, 2 x Shielded Missile Drones, Riptide shield generator, Multi-tracker, Blacksun Filter, Velocity Tracker, Stim Injec
Special Rules: Interceptor, Supporting Fire, Nova Reactor, Deep Strike, Skyfire

317pts

XV8 Crisis Team
2 x Crisis Shas'vre - Missile pod + Plasma rifle, 2xDrone Controller, Multi-tracker, Blacksun Filter
Crisis Shas'ui - Missile pod + Plasma Rifle, Iridium Battlesuit
6 x Gun Drones
Bonding Knife Ritual

282 pts

Troops:

Fire Warrior Team (x4)
5 Fire Warriors
1 Fire Warrior Shas'ui - Markerlight, Target Lock, 2 Gun Drones
6 x EMP Grenades
Bonding Knife Ritual

484 pts

Fast Attack:

Piranha
Fusion Blaster
Disruption Pod

65 pts

Pathfinder Team
10 Pathfinders
Recon Drone
Grav-inhibitor Drone
10 EMP Grenades
Bonding Knife Ritual
2 x Rail Rifle

169 pts


Sun shark - twin linked missile pod, disruption pod - 180 pts

This list is actually slightly different to the one i played, but the majority is the same. I don't use drones with my FW squads as they keep breaking and i don't like having an army with any proxies. I know i definitely need a better HQ to fill out the extra slot. So could you guys give me some tips on how to turn my 1500 pt army into a winning list ?

Not sure what your going for here, alot of reccomendations can be made to make the list better, but do you have other models, and or are willing to buy things, or is it just the models in the list here.

I am willing to buy other stuff, and yes that is all the stuff i have at the moment. What i'm asking is how can i improve on this list? What would i need ? And what should i change about the stuff i have ? Thanks for replying though

tophit101 wrote:
Winning 1500 pts Tau list!

Non-existent buddy

This makes me happy, because Tau always wins around here. Good to see that they can actually lose.

The problem here is you don't have 3 riptides.

If you fell you are missing too much I would add more marker lights, probably from the pathfinders. Pathfinders have 2 modes. Markerlight machines or tricky commando types. You have them tricked out as commandos, but I think they are better as pure markerlighters. I would drop darkstrider and split the pathfinders into 2 squads of 5 or 6, and just use them for markerlights.

You hit the nail on the head: the weakness of the tau is the difficulty their troops have claiming objectives, since they are great in a gun line but are terrible at moving out from cover. The way to Deal with this is either a, bring devilfish, b. outflank kroot after everything is dead, c. Ally farsight and use suits as troops.

I would drop the bomber and the tank for a sky ray and another riptide. The riptide does what the tank does, but better, and sky ray will cover anti air and boost marker lights.

tophit101 wrote:
3 nurglings camping on the highest value objective, and i lost

Maybe you're losing because your opponents cheat or forget rules?

And this is a dice game, as you know.. Even the most competitive Tau can roll badly sometimes. Keep playing your list and keep using models you enjoy. Copying a list from the internet will not improve you as a player. Master what you own and know it in-and-out, then when they roll good you'll have an advantage because you know your army list better than the other guy knows his.

So it'd look like this:

Commander Shas'o: 2× Gun Drone; plasma rifle; plasma rifle; drone controller; target lock.

XV104 Riptide: ion accelerator; stimulant injector.
XV104 Riptide: ion accelerator; stimulant injector.
3 Crisis Shas'ui: 6× Gun Drone; plasma rifle; plasma rifle; missile pod; missile pod; missile pod; missile pod; target lock; target lock; target lock.

10 Kroot
10 Kroot
12 Shas'la Fire Warriors
12 Shas'la Fire Warriors

6 Shas'la Pathfinders
6 Shas'la Pathfinders

Sky Ray Missile Defence Gunship

1,418 points

Commander goes with the suits. This gives you a good number of marker lights, and a mix of weapon types. The fire warriors and pathfinders hold the backfield. Suits move out to contest objectives, the Kroot outflank to take objectives last minute.

EMP grenades aren't really too good IMO. Make the Pathfinders pure markerlights.

Bring more riptides.MOAR RIPTIDES!

You have a lot of shiny toys, but they aren't doing much. Tau come with quality built in, you don't really need to add onto that, what you should be doing is taking quantity. Those Shas'ui upgrades on the Fire warriors are less than worthless, you could get two pathfinders for the cost of that Markerlight and target lock and you the two Fire Warriors you could have in place of those drones would have longer range and a higher BS. The bonding knife Ritual is open to debate but I feel like it has the wrong mindset, you shouldn't be gearing up to get back in the fight you should be gearing up to wipe out the opponent. I can however see how it can be useful. The XV8 have the same problem though, if you are going to take drones then they are either ablative wounds or extra Markerlights, for the cost of those six gun drones you could get two more XV8s with burst cannons, which have higher BS and more shots. Factor in the drone controllers and you could probably put a plasma rifle on one. The Riptide and the Hammer head are fine the way they are kitted out. The problem is that you have one of each. The Piranha and the Sun Shark both feel superfluous when an extra Riptide or Hammerhead would do the job better. Basically in this case what I am saying is more units, less useless junk for them to carry around. And with Vehicles go with the rule of two, when you take a tank, before taking a different type of vehicle take another tank. Then when you have two, look at other vehicles.

Some general thoughts.

Break up your pathfinders. A 10 man blob defeats their purpose. Trim them down to marker lights to begin with. Personally I'm not opposed to taking the special weapon in the squad, but get used to them as what they are, marker lighters. You are trying to do to many things with the squad.

Change your fire warriors around. Four squads of six, could be three squads of 8. It would make each squad more effective and cut down on kill points. EMP grenades are pretty much wasted on them as foot sloggers. Also, I wouldn't take the shas'ui/ml/2x gun drones myself.

Riptide - I would beware the missile drones. They'll make you take leadership tests when you loose them

Crisis Team - I'd have to check again, but I think you mean two Shas'ui and one Shas'vre right. Otherwise you've done that wrong and are loosing points there. You only need 1 drone controller, not 2 as well.

That should net you quite a few points back to play with.

Pathfinders should go bare bones. Because they are a reliable source of markerlights they are going to die. With the weak armor its best to make them cheap.
I have not found success with EMP grenades, I don't find them reliable. Besides your troops should be engaging other troops not tank hunting.
Having the Shas'ui and bonding knifes is over kill(I too made that mistake recently)
Shield Drones on the crisis team will help keep them in the fight longer. I don't much care for the gun drones on the suits.
If you cut the fighter and the EMP grenades you can afford another Hammerhead. With the riptide having sky fire you don't need a flyer to control airspace.

 BladeTX wrote:
The problem here is you don't have 3 riptides.

This.

when ever I look at list, I think, can they beat my orks? I go from here, I could have roughly 90 shoota boyz, 45 lootas, and a bike warboss against you, which would pretty much kill you dead, I know I cant go up against 3 riptides though so...as much as I have loath to give my once favorite snack advice, get another one, especially if you ally with eldar and bring eldrad with a riptide (cause he can join that) and give him reroll saves and shooting, which makes me dead-er, and keeps you alive-er.

I only play nids and know very little about tau. The only thing i can say for sure is knowing how squishy fire warriors are the groups seem a little small. 6 fire warriors under a pie plate could be a easy first blood/kill point i think.

How long have you been playing Tau for? When I first started playing I lost every. single. game...miserably.

I'm no Tau expert so I can't really make any informed/educated recommendations. However, what I can say is that eventually something will click, something will happen that makes you realise you have been doing something wrong.

Maybe sit down, re-read the codex and really try and figure out what works with what, what gives a benefit to what and what situations those should be used in.

You mentioned you struggle to capture the objective(s) but you manage to get linebreaker and occasionally the the odd first blood point etc. gaining those points early on is a massive advantage and can sometimes really help to turn the tide psychologically. Maybe focus on those early on, move your troops around in a transport slowly but steadily moving towards objectives and unload them at the right time.

The most important tip I could give is not to give up. I know how frustrating it is losing constantly as I nearly quit the hobby due to constantly loosing but it does make you a better player. Anyway, the first rule of the game is to have fun, if you are playing matches where all you do is turn take and there isn't any banter or decent chat going on between you and your opponent this saps the fun out of it. Just enjoy and revel in your in-game successes and eventually it'll click.

AngryHoneyBadger28 wrote:
How long have you been playing Tau for? When I first started playing I lost every. single. game...miserably.

I'm no Tau expert so I can't really make any informed/educated recommendations. However, what I can say is that eventually something will click, something will happen that makes you realise you have been doing something wrong.

Maybe sit down, re-read the codex and really try and figure out what works with what, what gives a benefit to what and what situations those should be used in.

You mentioned you struggle to capture the objective(s) but you manage to get linebreaker and occasionally the the odd first blood point etc. gaining those points early on is a massive advantage and can sometimes really help to turn the tide psychologically. Maybe focus on those early on, move your troops around in a transport slowly but steadily moving towards objectives and unload them at the right time.

The most important tip I could give is not to give up. I know how frustrating it is losing constantly as I nearly quit the hobby due to constantly loosing but it does make you a better player. Anyway, the first rule of the game is to have fun, if you are playing matches where all you do is turn take and there isn't any banter or decent chat going on between you and your opponent this saps the fun out of it. Just enjoy and revel in your in-game successes and eventually it'll click.

Thanks for that. At the time of playing i was annoyed at the losses, but at the time i wasn't angry. I don't reckon i would quit, our meetings are monthly and my brother goes so even if ihadnt been playing for a while the meeting would get me back into it. Thanks for all your tips guys, saying that xv8's can be taken as troops when playing farsight led me to find out more, i've only just realised that i forgot about the Farsight Enclaves Codex. That will solve my issues with weak troops, plus i could, in reality, field 3 riptides alongside xv8 troops ! Looks like i know what im getting for christmas after all Thanks again for you're ideas guys, i've taken all the stuff into account. No wasteful fw upgrades, split the pathfinders, no emp's, more riptides, got it all.

tophit101 wrote:
I can't seem to win with my Tau army !

wha........
Tau not winning?
WOOOOOHOOOOOOO

no offenece lol. just dont see that often.

Marker Drones are better than pathfinders; especially when joined by the HQ units with Wargear that makes them BS 5.

Nurglings are swarms. Swarms can't score or deny.

My friend plays Tau. He is a huge fan of missile pods, and I hate hearing them. SMS, HYMP, all of them. He usually does very well with them.

Trust me your not the only one upset with their tau. Its gotten to the point that I only play my orks and have started a nurgle army. I would almost trade my tau for IG if it weren't for the fact I worked so hard on them and want to do the painting myself. Sometimes it just just comes down to your dice hating that particular army....take 40 shots, hit with 12 and wound four, o your opponent has 3+ saves and made them all. I have a list very similar to other ppls at our local tournaments and while they steamroll my army flies off the board similar to units flying off the screen in advanced wars games. For me its so frustrating that I won't even finish the few units I have left (a riptide and a broadside). I switched o orks and my nobz just won't die, I fail maybe 5 outta 40 saves on them. If I could do it again I would got with my gut and grab IG (I liked so many armies, but ultimately chose tau cuz I like the greater good, the codex supposedly being good didn't hurt either).

HQ
Commander: stimulant injector; missile pod; missile pod; XV8-02 Crisis 'Iridium' Battlesuit. 155

Elites
XV104 Riptide: Riptide stimulant injector; early warning override; ion accelerator. 225

3 XV8 Crisis Team: (plasma rifle; plasma rifle). + 2 shield drones 180

2 XV8 Crisis Team:(missile pod; missile pod) + 2 shield drones 128

Troops
8 Fire Warriors
• Devilfish: disruption pod; twin-linked smart missile system. 177

8 Fire Warriors
• Devilfish: disruption pod; twin-linked smart missile system. 177

8 Fire Warriors
• Devilfish: disruption pod; twin-linked smart missile system. 177

Fast Attack
6 Pathfinders 66
6 Pathfinders 66

Heavy Support
Hammerhead Gunship: disruption pod; blacksun filter; twin-linked smart missile system. 141

1,492 points

This is my typical 1500 point list. It works well for me. Take advantage of your pathfinder's scout move and get them into cover. They die in the open.

Keep your firewarriors in the transports AV12 and a 4+ cover save on the move is pretty sturdy to all but dedicated anti tank. Get them close to a threat and then have them hop out and rapid fire the enemy to death. Support with the Devilfish to finish off the squad, or flat out the devil fish to move it in front of the fire warrior squad to prevent return fire or assaults. Smart missile systems are good for fire support they ignore cover don't need line of sight and are Twinlinked with a 30" range.... Sweet

Use your crisis suit plasma squad for trouble shooting threats and join the HQ to the missile squad for long range support.

Flyers will give you trouble. I suggest marker lights followed by the missile suits to make short work of all but the sturdiest flyers.

If you need any more help our have any more questions about tactics shoot me a PM

1) Drop Darkstrider; since you have a bunch of FWs get an ethereal. FnP is awesome and if you don't use that the extra shot is awesome too. Plus you have a 12" bubble of Ld 10.

2) Riptides are naturally tough as hell and don't overcharge your shots for infantry just if you're killing vehicles. Use it to get 3++ and drop the stims for an EWO. Get another one at least and drop the drones off them

3) crisis suits are good but lose effectiveness if you mix weapons especially at 2 different ranges, pick either the missile pods or plasma rifles and in my experience drones with them reduce their effectivness since it's harder to keep the whole squad in cover and then forces Ld rolls

4)I love fire warriors; they are the main reason I chose tau. That being said if their in a squad of anything less than 10 their usefulness drops significantly esoecislly without ethereal assistance. The shas'vre is wasted points everytime as well as all bonding knives. And drop the emp, if your opponent uses a lot of vehicles give your crisis suits fusion blasters

5) pathfinders should be split in 2 squads. Ideally you should have 3 squads of around 7 or 8 giving you an average if 4 MLs from each squad drop the drones from them as well; they're a lot of points for minimal benefit

6) hammerhead should have longstrike

7) drop piranha and sunshark

that should be a good start

As said above don't get down about losing, just learn from each game.

You need to decide what you want your commander to be, either Mark'o or Buffmander.

I take two units of kroot with sniper rounds and 2 units of 6 man firewarrior squads at 1500pts. Yes 6 man FW squads may be an easy first blood, but to me that means you aren't deploying them well enough and don't upgrade them with anything. Outflank the kroot for late game distraction and objective taking.

Riptides are the new crisis suits. At present I only have one. I run it pretty standard with IA Stim and EWO. I also run a two man crisis unit with two FBs for deepstriking anti tank and again another distraction.

I take a max unit of Misslesides, the amount of firepower these guys have is insane. If you give them VT and attach a buffmander your opponents air force will not be getting any jink saves.

I also run one sky ray and one hammerhead usually with longstrike. I know that HH's aren't the best right now but I like to have that Str 10 weapon as there are a lot of LR's in the local meta. BS5, two dice for armour pen and plus 2 for damage chart is about the most effective thing tau have against AV14.

I used to run FW tetras until they got nerferd to H2 instead of H4 and I am still undecided whether I like pathfinders. At 1500pts there is not really room for a Mark'o and a Buffmander so you are probably wise going with two small units of pathfinders.

That is pretty much my 1500pt list. If you do go with the Buffmander make sure to move him around between your units to make sure the best unit is benefiting from his craziness each turn!

Let us know your new list and how you get on!

ATO

How does the HH get 2 dice for pen?

Its two dice and you pick the highest for the pen roll, as per tank hunter.

Unless I have been told this rule wrong (apologies if I have got it wrong)

ATO

I've never used it... there's been more than a few games that would have been handy :( longstrike gives it that right?

Yer Longstrike gives you tank hunter (roll two dice for armour pen and pick the highest) and also makes your HH BS5, blacksun filter included, enables the HH to snapfire! and give it the supporting fire special rule. I believe that includes the drones too (may be wrong)

But that is a nice little added extra, str 10 ap 1 snap shot lol and throw in some twinlinked SMS for some nice anti charge.

ATO

i didnt win a game at all last year, not one i used my crons solely but start of this year i built up my daemons what i only had 600pts of and re did my crons completely and now my wins to loss ratio is really good even including last years losses. (note i play on average 2 days a week) so yea dont give up coz i amost did but im glad i didnt