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Movement.
Both sides move at the same time in order of ascending leadership. Alternating moving one unit at a time for fairness. The highest leadership units are moved last indicating tactical experience and foresight on the battlefield.

Shooting.
Both sides shoot at the same time in descending initiative order. If a model with a lower initiative is slain, that model is removed from play. Models slain with the with the same initiative are placed in their side and are still allowed to return fire, then removed from play.

Assault.
You do not declare all charges at the beginning of the Assault phase only your highest leadership units and then once they've been resolved on both sides. You go to the next leadership level. If one side has higher leadership units, then these units will assault first before the second player can assault back.

If two units with the same leadership assault each other, both receive charging bonuses.

Units with the same leadership are considered to be charging at the same time. So unit A could charge unit B however B charges unit C. As such unit A does not make contact with B.

If a higher leadership unit assaults another unit with a lower leadership the defending unit does not get the option to assault another unit and receives no charging bonuses.

If a higher leadership unit assaults another unit but does not make it. The lower leadership unit will be able to assault and receive the charging bonus if they make it.


I wanted to remove the advantage of first turn especially against fast armies.

so basically using a system similar to FFG's star wars miniatures pilot skill system only converted using 40k stats?


Its definately appealing as an idea, could cause some headaches in some areas though so would need some real lookover on details.

I think it would be tricky to actually use this, especially that shooting phase rule.

 shamikebab wrote:
I think it would be tricky to actually use this, especially that shooting phase rule.

Originally I was thinking all units get to shoot regardless of initiative. Maybe that would be simpler than working out who gets to shoot in order of initiativ, especially with ICs joined to units.

Seeing as the initiative stat is more or less set for entire armies across the board, this system pretty much means that every turn, the army with the higher base initiative (ie Eldar, Dark Eldar) will get all its shots off while the army of lower base initiative (ie Necrons, Orks and Tau) will only ever be able to shoot after being ravaged by enemy fire.

Likewise, base leadership is a standard value for most armies. So the Necrons, Daemons and Eldar of all kinds are going to consistently be able to counter the moves of other armies while the Imperial Guard and Tau will pretty much always find their opponents being able to move out of the line of fire or prepare charges against vulnerable units. This is compounded by the fact that the Higher LD units will also be far ore effective in the assault phase.

Being consistently last to shoot and not being able to react to enemy moves would mean that a unit or army would be considerably less effective and would require a significant points deduction. On the flip side, being consistently able to shoot first and counter your opponents plans (and in the case of Eldar/Dark Eldar doing both) would be a significant advantage requiring certain armies see points increases.

Also, most vehicles have neither Initiative or Leadership scores.

Jefffar wrote:
Seeing as the initiative stat is more or less set for entire armies across the board, this system pretty much means that every turn, the army with the higher base initiative (ie Eldar, Dark Eldar) will get all its shots off while the army of lower base initiative (ie Necrons, Orks and Tau) will only ever be able to shoot after being ravaged by enemy fire.

True, if you are using that system then maybe going in base BS order would make more sense or D3+BS or something. I think alternate activation would be more fun than turn based (the way 40k is now) but it would require deep thought on balance and implementation.

I like the Bolt Action system where you have 1 token per living unit in your army that you put into a bag along with 1 per opponent unit. You then blind pull 1 token, the side whose token it is picks a unit to move, shoot, assault etc with (after which it is expended and cannot act until the beginning of the next turn). You could still incorporate leadership e.g. when you pulled a token you could nominate a unit to act and take a leadership test, failing would mean you had to pick a different unit to act (obviously you would have to automatically pass the last available unit per token).

@Jefffar You are right but I like wtnind solution to the problem.

wtnind wrote:True, if you are using that system then maybe going in base BS order would make more sense or D3+BS or something.

And probably better to use BS with a D3.

Alternating activation works fine in 40k.
The simple rolling off at the start of the turn to see which side acts first ,(with modifiers if preferred,) gives enough variation without making it too complicated.

My high leadership dudes want to run into some cover.

His low leadership dudes get to move first because they're dumb as bricks. They move into the cover and it's tough titties for me.

I'm all for changing the IGOUGO but there are some issues here.

The Hobbit does it interestingly. Roll off for "priority". Player with Priority moves all of his models, including charge moves . Then player two can move all of his models and charge etc. Then P1 shoots anything not in an assault, and then P2 does the same. Then assaults are resolved. Next turn priority is rolled again, with any draws going to the guy who didn't get it last turn.

Interestingly enough Priority isn't a blanket benefit, there are advantages to moving or shooting first *or* second. I plan on trying out this modification sometime soon