Ymgarls and the Skyshield

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**HiveGuard**

So I've been looking for the answer to this question on the net but can't seem to find it. Since the Skyshield Landing Pad is a piece of terrain, can a group of Ymgarls be dormant on or under one to start the game? This would seriously put a damper on my opponents if they could.

**easysauce**

some people call underneath it, impassible, some call it clear, some call it terrain, maybe ask your opponent what you both think it is.

I know the top is considered "open terrain" in the book but it is a piece of terrain, im not sure if the ymargl requirement is that it be difficult or just any terrain will do,

but i think its any piece of terrain, so go for it on top for sure.

**hyv3mynd**

Ymgarls require area terrain correct? Sky shield isn't area terrain.

**Bloodhorror**

Its not area terrain. Its open ground underneath it, and open ground on top.

Simple as that i'd say.

**PrinceRaven**

hyv3mynd wrote:
Ymgarls require area terrain correct? Sky shield isn't area terrain.

Technically they don't, but most people consider that just bad rules-writing than intentional, I've yet to meet someone who plays Dormant the way it's written.

**rigeld2**

PrinceRaven wrote:
hyv3mynd wrote:
Ymgarls require area terrain correct? Sky shield isn't area terrain.

Technically they don't, but most people consider that just bad rules-writing than intentional, I've yet to meet someone who plays Dormant the way it's written.

Contextually it refers to area terrain. You have to ignore part of the rule to assume it means anything but area terrain.

**PrinceRaven**

Exactly, the "provided there is at least one piece of are terrain large enough to accommodate the entire unit" requirement on deploying via Dormant clearly indicates they intend for you to only be able to deploy Ymgarls in area terrain. What I'm saying is that when it comes to going over how to deploy them it just says "terrain" not "area terrain", which goes to show you how terrible quality control is when it comes to the rules.

**DarknessEternal**

If something refers to "area terrain" and "terrain" and it's talking about the same thing, you always have to have that terrain be "area terrain". When two things apply simultaneously, and one is more restrictive, that one has priority. Otherwise you're ignoring the restriction with the other option.

This is the most fundamentally misunderstood aspect of 40k rules and is always a problem with the player and not the rules.

It's not poor writing, it's poor reading comprehension.

**ductvader**

Simple question but one I have not considered until now.

Is the top of the skyshield area terrain.

It may have no bearing but as it gives the entire area a single save I thought it was worth mentioning.

I have no books on me currently to check.

**nosferatu1001**

No, it is not area terrain

Ruleswise, like the other fortifications, it is a bit of a mess.

**Unholyllama**

Skyshield is probably one of the worst in terms of poorly written rules.

The top is open terrain - this is clearly stated.

Moving onto and off of the top platform is treated as moving through difficult terrain.

Nothing is explicit for below it but it causes issues with blast templates and the links. Since it is not a multi-floor ruins, many people rule that you can't target models under the landing pad with barrage and other weapons (it'd get stop by the top, open terrain is the argument).

Regardless though - let's look at fortifications as a whole. Fortifications all have a "terrain type" rule associated with them which would denote them as a piece of terrain. Depending on the rules associated with Ymgarls, fortifications may be eligible targets for their dormant mode. I dont' play nids so I can't say 100% how such reads.

**deviantduck**

The skyshield would be and enemy fortification, and you can't start deployed in an enemy fortification. Just like deploying on top of a bastion.

**ductvader**

deviantduck wrote:
The skyshield would be and enemy fortification, and you can't start deployed in an enemy fortification. Just like deploying on top of a bastion.

Ymgarls can never start deployed anyways...

**DeathReaper**

deviantduck wrote:
The skyshield would be and enemy fortification, and you can't start deployed in an enemy fortification. Just like deploying on top of a bastion.

This is not 100% accurate.

Being on top of a Skyshield is not starting "deployed in an enemy fortification" you deploy on top of a Skyshield not in it...

You could have a unit with infiltrate deploy on top of an enemy Skyshield if they meet the other requirements (Outside of 18 inches Etc...).

**rigeld2**

ductvader wrote:
deviantduck wrote:
The skyshield would be and enemy fortification, and you can't start deployed in an enemy fortification. Just like deploying on top of a bastion.

Ymgarls can never start deployed anyways...

Not true at all. It's silly to deploy them, but Dormant is an optional rule.

**ductvader**

rigeld2 wrote:
ductvader wrote:
deviantduck wrote:
The skyshield would be and enemy fortification, and you can't start deployed in an enemy fortification. Just like deploying on top of a bastion.

Ymgarls can never start deployed anyways...

Not true at all. It's silly to deploy them, but Dormant is an optional rule.

My bad, I thought they were written like Lictors.