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I had a game last night with a good friend of mine who wanted to try out some Drop Pod spam and Dreadnaughts.

Turn 1 he did the obvious, places 1/2 his drop pods on the table, but my concern was the fact he was literally placing them next to my models. Now, from my understanding of drop pod rules, if you scatter into units (friend or foe) you have to reduce your scatter the minimum distance so as to not land on them. Minimum distance being 1" correct? Does it not state that if you land within 1" of impassible terrain / enemy units you mishap?

He was literally placing drop pods next to units.. I feel like this is simply wrong.. I don't usually come up against drop pod armies, because of Purge the Alien mission types tend to be, unpleasant for said Drop Pod army... But this seems like it is rather cheesy if not a blatant disregard for the rules... Unless I'm missing something...

If he places them so that they would mishap on a "hit" then they will mishap if they do "hit" If they scatter away, then he is ok.

Yeah he'd have to put them outside of 1 inch away from any of your units, or they'd likely mishap unless he rolled a lucky scatter.

Drop pods' special rules only 'reduce' the amount a unit can scatter by, never 'increase' it. It's not a 'get out of mishap free' card that some players tend to think it is, it simply means you will likely never scatter 'onto' an enemy unit. (Unless you deliberately place your model there)

 Neorealist wrote:
Yeah he'd have to put them outside of 1 inch away from any of your units, or they'd likely mishap unless he rolled a lucky scatter.

Drop pods' special rules only 'reduce' the amount a unit can scatter by, never 'increase' it. It's not a 'get out of mishap free' card that some players tend to think it is, it simply means you will likely never scatter 'onto' an enemy unit. (Unless you deliberately place your model there)

The original placement of the model can be within 1" of the enemy model. If he hits, he mishaps. If he scatters, he is ok.

But to reduce your scatter to a minimum distance of 1" still lands you 1" away from units and terrain... Don't you still mishap RAW?

GoliothOnline wrote:
But to reduce your scatter to a minimum distance of 1" still lands you 1" away from units and terrain... Don't you still mishap RAW?

If you reduce your scatter to avoid the obstacle, and still mishap, then you haven't reduced your scatter by enough to avoid the obstacle...

You only mishap if you can't reduce your scatter enough to avoid the obstacle.

If he wants the closest safe effect he needs to place his DP just over 1" away. Dropping "on" a unit is legal, it just creates a mishap on a hit or a short scatter, as others have said.

Given how generous disembarking is, kind of a silly risk. He should just move them 1"+ then roll.

Avoid obstacle =/= avoid mishap

If you are placing your model to avoid an obstacle, you are placing it, in legality, 1" away from all other models.

If you are placing your model to avoid a mishap, RAW you should have to be MORE than 1" away...no?

Yeah, more than 1" away...
1.00000000000000000001" away is fine though

GoliothOnline wrote:
Avoid obstacle =/= avoid mishap

If you are placing your model to avoid an obstacle, you are placing it, in legality, 1" away from all other models.

If you are placing your model to avoid a mishap, RAW you should have to be MORE than 1" away...no?

Avoiding an obstacle is avoiding the mishap (really?, you think no one in years of tournament play would have noticed what you're looking for if it was there?).

No need to get snide Lobu, I'm looking for an understanding of general consensus.

To answer the question, if he rolled a hit, he would mishap.
if he rolled a miss, he could reduce the scatter to avoid the mishap.
now if he rolled an arrow and it went onto your unit, it could still mishap as by reducing the scatter all the way to a zero, he might still be within 1".
Safest bet is to warn him of this as it might be he honestly was playing it wrong. Chances are, he would then just aim an inch away instead of less. Chances are, he just want paying attention and was trying to get closer to you in case he scattered in the other direction.

Yeah, that's what we ended up doing the second game EVIL INC. We really weren't sure, but we knew that if you were at least more than 1" you were safe.

The scenario was basically that he wanted to group a bunch of Flame Dreads in a tight area, and it became VERY crowded.. the whole 1" thing was basically weather or not he was placing them too close for his pods to even land, or if he had to move them elsewhere.

Now a nice trick is to use drop pods to box in drop pods. Send down more expendable units first (like tacticals) and have them make a scatter fire wall with the drop pods that will prevent a more vital unit (like sternguard) from being able to scatter too far away from the intended drop site.

Just remember, reducing scatter does not mean altering scatter.

When he places the drop pod on the table he can place it anywhere, including withing 1 inch of your units. Where the drop pod is placed is 'point A'. Then he rolls the scatter dice and moves the drop pod in the direction and distance indicated by the dice. Where the drop pod scatters to is 'point B'. If point B is in a location that is on the table and will cause a mishap the pod can move backwards along an imaginary line between points A and B until it is in a position it can be placed with out a mishap or it reaches point A, whichever comes first. If the pod does not scatter (because he rolled a hit for example) then the pod has already reached point A.. If the pod returns all the way to point A and is still in a position where it will mishap then the IGS rule has done all it can and the pod will mishap anyway.

By placing the pod so close to your units he is running a significant and unnecessary risk of the pod misshaping but its a risk he is allowed to take.

Fragile wrote:
The original placement of the model can be within 1" of the enemy model. If he hits, he mishaps. If he scatters, he is ok.

I'm pretty sure we both said exactly the same thing. ;-)

also remember that the unit inside has to be ableto deploy legally out of it or be destroyed. I once had a guy drop deep in my lines where there was room for his pod to land legall, but no room for his Dread inside to deploy. Of course, this was last edition but I think tht is something that has actually remained constant.

 EVIL INC wrote:
also remember that the unit inside has to be ableto deploy legally out of it or be destroyed. I once had a guy drop deep in my lines where there was room for his pod to land legall, but no room for his Dread inside to deploy. Of course, this was last edition but I think tht is something that has actually remained constant.

Yep. You must disembark upon landing in a Drop Pod. That's still the rule. Difficult and Dangerous Terrain checks are taken if required Impassable Terrain is still Impassable. There's no specific rule for what happens if you can't disembark, though, as far as I can tell…?

EVery prior ruling has been if you cannot disembark you are destroyed, when forced to disembark. Might now be specifed (too far from books to check)

A hasty glance at Deep Strike and Transports leaves me this: the only time a model is destroyed is if he must disembark due to a Wrecked result but can't be placed. A normal disembark becomes emergency if models can't be placed and that only says units can't disembark if some models can't be placed.

Must disembark due to drop pod, can't due to reasons. The penalty is remaining in your nice comfy AV12 opentopped vehicle.

Spetulhu wrote:


Must disembark due to drop pod, can't due to reasons. The penalty is remaining in your nice comfy AV12 opentopped vehicle.

Which you cannot do. So the penalty must actually be something greater. Cannot vs must is what we're faced with and looking at the rules I'd say page 80's the answer. Unit destroyed.

Spetulhu wrote:
A hasty glance at Deep Strike and Transports leaves me this: the only time a model is destroyed is if he must disembark due to a Wrecked result but can't be placed. A normal disembark becomes emergency if models can't be placed and that only says units can't disembark if some models can't be placed.

Must disembark due to drop pod, can't due to reasons. The penalty is remaining in your nice comfy AV12 opentopped vehicle.

Except you MUST disembark.

Every snigle time this has come up previously the embarked unit was destroyed. It was a similar query in 5th when a unit could take wounds inside a transport vehicle and failed a morale check - they must move, but couldnt disembark

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Every snigle time this has come up previously the embarked unit was destroyed.

Well, it's certainly a question we should forward to the FAQ writers. Right now there's nothing saying they're destroyed.

Hmm... Mishap could apply though. They are deepstriking after all - and if you can't deploy some of the unit they suffer a mishap. It doesn't make any fluff sense but it would be rules.

However, quite an amusing result if you get delayed....

"Tsk, ANOTHER demerit for missing the drop pod embarkation, Brother Sergeant Azoran"

nosferatu1001 wrote:
"Tsk, ANOTHER demerit for missing the drop pod embarkation, Brother Sergeant Azoran"

Or the servitor at the launch station heard "LAUNCH" and pressed the button before the Captain had uttered "on my command". They're not always very smart, after all.

Its not really an issue is it? I mean the drop pod has to have a 1 inch enemy free bubble around its hull or it would have misshaped and models making an emergency disembarkation don't need to be placed an inch away from the enemy. You should have plenty of room to place 10 25mm bases around the drop pod and not actually be in base contact with any enemy models

I suppose the only problem could be for dreadnoughts but in the unlikely scenario where you land in a 1 inch bubble with not enough space for the dreadnought then HIWPI he gets to stay in the pod and must disembark as soon as possible. I would also expect GW to FAQ it differently.

 DJGietzen wrote:
models making an emergency disembarkation don't need to be placed an inch away from the enemy.

Where did you find that exception? Emergency Disembark (pg 79 BRB) only lets you place the model so it's not in contact with an access point before moving as for a normal disembark - it gives no permission to ignore enemy models or terrain.

There are cases (as in the game I mentioned where the dread is unable to disembark because in all directions there are enemy modes set up. The distance limit to disembark is 6 inches.
The rules say that you HAVE to disembark and are not allowed to stay inside but you are unable to disembark.
Now look at a few other possibly relevant rules such as when your transport is destroyed but you are unable to disembark for the same reason but yet you must disembark and when you are forced to move but are unable to (overrun by a vehicle where you are forced to move but a savvy enemy can surround you preventing it.