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So here's an 1850 list based on tabling the opponent using a Revenant and the Firebase Support Cadre. Basically no scoringand all troops start in reserve.

Farseer 100

3 Jetbikes 51
3 Jetbikes 51
3 Jetbikes 51

Skyshield Landing Pad 75

Revenant 900

Riptide: HBC, FB, VT 200
3 Broadsides: HYMP, EWO 210
3 Broadsides: HYMP, EWO 210

Farseer chills with Missilesides, Revenant starts on the Landing pad. Went with the AA Riptide (which I generally do not rate at all) as the Revenant kills everything but flyers so the FBSC has to add as much AA as possible.

Its this or the stupid Vect + Coteaz I go first list. I feel this incarnation is more rounded and reliable for competitive play. It is also not entirely reliant on the Revenant for damage output.

The problem with this list is that even with the Riptide your AA is really lame. Against a Vampire Raider list you're likely going to get mauled by its Pulsar, 12 Hull Points and titan holo-fields mean you'll never realistically kill it with the Riptide. It's cheaper than the Revenant and can shield scoring units, so they might concievably be able to get a good alpha and betastrike on you without exposing scoring units to return fire.

Basically, I don't think you can consistently table flyer builds and I don't think you have the scoring to win objective games. The Skyshield isn't doing much for the super-mobile Revenant, drop it and add another unit of Jetbikes and give all the Jetbike units Shuriken Cannons so they have a shot at grounding an Aetaos'rau'keres list before it crushes you. Consider reworking the whole Firebase contigent, I don't think it's giving you enough AA to justify it's inclusion at this points level.

You seem to have missed the tank hunting intercepting Broadsides. My AA is pretty strong. The FBSC is basically all AA so I don't get your point at all on that front.

The Skyshield is an auto-include with the Revenant gives me 2 4+ invun saves and stops anyone turn 1ing it with deepstrikers.


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In fact I'd go as far to say I don't think there is anything that is better at AA that I could get for the points in an Eldar army. Unless you can suggest something? That FBSC strips on average about 12 HPs a turn from AV11 flyers, about 6 from AV12. AV10 is laughing with 15 stripped.

I saw the Broadsides. They're still hitting on sixes, that's not exactly spectacular. Against a Vampire Raider, that's 4 hits, reroll for 3.33 more, about 3.75 get through the holo-field (being generous) for maybe 3 hull points? Sure you'll do some good damage if the other 1120 points of Eldar has miraculously failed to damage your Broadsides at all but you'd need to be very lucky to down it in a couple of turns - the Riptide helps, but 8 shots, 4 hits, 2 pass the holo-field and 0.66 glance or better against AV11. You will do well against Croissants probably because you can pick them off as they come in, but against a super-heavy flyer build you will basically never have the whole FBSC live through the first turn and once the Vampire comes in the Broadsides are a priority target.

I must admit, I forgot the Broadsides are TL, which does make them better than my original estimation, but I think you might be better going with Crimson Hunters or something similar because they can't be eliminated/weakened by opposing fire turn one. They are much more difficult for it to eliminate, which may make the difference in a protracted engagement. The only worry this does give me is that it weakens you against FGC lists. Perhaps you could even go with something like,
3x Nightwing Interceptor - 435
Ethereal - 50
6 Fire Warriors - 54
Barracuda - 130
over the Skyshield and FBSC. I know why you like the Skyshield, but the Revenant's ability to jump around is really strong and I don't think it wants to sit on a landing pad half the game. Any army which can alphastrike it in one turn is going to be very telegraphed, just reserve the Revenant against those armies and leave them to shoot at Fire Warriors in cover or whatever. Turn two you'd get a titan and a bunch of flyers with which to essentially crush any resistance before it had a chance to do what it wanted to. I can definitely see the merits of both builds, but I think necronesque flyerwing is going to be a more common 'titan-counter' than Drop-pod alphastrike, so the flyer version makes more sense to me.

I apologise if I sounded confrontational in the last post I made, I had forgotten the TL on the Broadsides and I realise the way I worded it is kind of offensive looking back. That wasn't my intention at all!

You're a monster

By my initial assessment, Eldar are not TAC competitive in escalation. By this I mean you can't make an Eldar list that has a decent chance vs. all types of escalation tournament opponents. This list here tries to follow the same pattern as every jy2 Eldar list, and it only works when your enemy is completely unprepared for the new game system. There's a number of lists that outright crush you, but even if you're willing to agree on that, there's better on/off lists you can design.

Funnily enough since so many people on the 'interwebz' is thinking lists like this are good and will probably try to play with them, a GK list with a Reaver titan, despite being very one-sided, might even be able to win a GT since it curbstomps all of the armies that follow the pattern posted here. You can bring a Reaver and 10 void shields total and 5 scoring units into 1850p. It'll go first more likely than you will, and it'll pop you with 8xD (smiley) every turn, has of course AV14 and 18 HP, can get a cover save and Coteaz can cast some divination on it.

Theron you can't have a Reaver or even a Warhound in Escalation. So not sure what you're talking about. Revenant is the only Titan in Escalation, unless I'm missing something. How much more does it cost in Escalation than Apocalypse as Titans get a price hike in Escalation.

As for the Vampire I don't have all the Forge world books so I don't know all the Forge world rules but you've discounted all S5 fire in your calculations. Between explodes results and those I recon I do about 5-7 HPs against a Vampire with interceptor alone, you're also forgetting the Riptide fires 2 twin linked meltas at you or 12 S6 shots if you're out of range melta range and I can twin link him.

Crimson Hunters are not the answer the list you posted gets tabled turn 1 by my list and those flyers never arrive. If you reserve the Revenant in that list it is game over. You're suggesting giving up all board presence. Your not only does no better against flyers than mine (Vampires are tough to kill in 1 turn by anyone) but is significantly weaker against everyone else. Whilst giving me no option to start the Revenant on the board against alpha striking armies leaving mewith the choice of losing my Revenant turn 1 and thus probably the game or getting tabled turn 1...

9 Vendettas could cause me a problem but what else do you have in that list and can it survive turn 1? Same is true of a SHF list (including one with a Vampire). I can win the ground battle and simply ignore the flyer.

Forgeworld released an FAQ saying basically all their titans are esclation approved. The reaver is around 1450 points, warhound 900ish?

Cheers then yeah the Reaver is a rock to my scissors. If I go first I may kill him. If he goes first he will kill me and he's favourite to go first. The Reaver can't deal with any sort of flyers though. Cronair practically auto beats it. But hey that can happen any non-flyer LoW list gets killed by the Reaver.

OR even better is just play IG with:

Hq-ccs=50pts

Troop-vets=70pts
Troop-vets=70pts

Fast- x3 vendettas=390pts
Fast-x3 vendettas=390pts
Fast-x3 vendettas=390pts

Total =1360pts

Allies Space marine

Hq-libarian-65pts

Troop-scouts x5=55pts

Fast-x3 storm talons 2 with skyhammer ML=360pts

Total =480pts

Grand total = 1840pts And auto win vs anyone with a super heavy, or titan ( please do not try to prove me wrong, because you can't I have played it vs 4 people and I tabled every single one).

It looks like an auto lose to my list or any Revenant list. All your flyers start in reserve and I have to kill what 6 marines and 25 guardsmen in turn 1. Seems pretty much a guarantee for most LoW lists. Unless I'm missing something or you play on boards with LOTS of LoS blocking terrain. How are you not getting tabled turn 1? Particularly against a list like mine where the Broadsides don't need LoS and the Revenant moving 36"

Oh man I wish my lists were proven to auto-win when I got four victories with them! It is definitely possible to build a super-heavy list that would beat that. Take a Malcador Infernus, which is cheap and will eat your ground units alive, add a ccs, two minimum platoons of 25 and as many Sabre Platforms as will fit and just shoot everything off the board with interceptor fire as soon as it comes in. This list even has the bonus of holding its own ok against TAC lists, which the o'l 12 flyer list tends to struggle with.

It's very foolish to claim a list is unbeatable, in general or just by a particular archetype. There is always room for a direct counter.

 Arbiter wrote:
OR even better is just play IG with:

Hq-ccs=50pts

Troop-vets=70pts
Troop-vets=70pts

Fast- x3 vendettas=390pts
Fast-x3 vendettas=390pts
Fast-x3 vendettas=390pts

Total =1360pts

Allies Space marine

Hq-libarian-65pts

Troop-scouts x5=55pts

Fast-x3 storm talons 2 with skyhammer ML=360pts

Total =480pts

Grand total = 1840pts And auto win vs anyone with a super heavy, or titan ( please do not try to prove me wrong, because you can't I have played it vs 4 people and I tabled every single one).

How are you taking 3 stormtalons as an ally detachment? SM flyers can't squadron up.