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How do you guyz see the use of koptas? Let's list their advantages and disadvantages first:

(+) They're very common and cheap on real money
(+) They have awesome models
(+) They're the fastest unit orkses have

(-) They're overpriced pointwise (but i believe it'll get fixed with the new dex)
(-) They have modest statline for pointscost
(-) No bosspole
(-) No more scout-move/outflank charging

All in all, they're mediocre - not terrible but not very good also. New edition completely messed up their first-turn harrasser's and outflank tank-hunter's role. But let's think what they ARE capable of atm. Imo, they're a playable distraction if taken in squads of ones. It's often better to take 3 squads of koptas than a dakkajet cause interceptors that can shoot down a 10-10-10 flyer the moment it arrives are met quite often.
I've tried outflanking unit of 3 koptas with 2 rokkits. Appeared to be a waste in every game i tried such formation. Too expensive and when you loose even one kopta you got 50% chance to run. Also volleys of fire that are dished upon us easilly wipe squads of 4+/5+ jink guyz.
Then i decided to try out several solo squads of koptas. And it appeared to be the way to go except for missions where they give killpoints, but there are only 2 such missions. So what are my results:
Rokkits worked quite bad. Only once out of like 10 games they actually managed to destroy something. U see, most vehicles we're facing now are either av 13-14 or have jink saves, or both. So 5/9 to hit with a s8 ap3 is quite meh. Besides, to make them any good at vehicle hunting - they need a buzzsaw and a buzzsaw kopta with rokkits costs 70 pts. And if you solo it - it won't live long enough to use it. Though, i've managed to snipe out tyranid warriors and some armed devastators out of cover with rokkits thanks to kopta's good mobility.
Bigshoota koptas with bigbomms. Sadly, big bomms are too overpriced for what they can do. Also, they scatter d6 regardless of bs. And now you must place the bomms only over the models you actually flew over. That's logical but it limits it's effectiveness forcing you to flat-out instead of shooting.
Barebones bigshoota koptas. Actually, they appeared quite handy with scoutmoves. I used them as pure distraction and overwatch-eaters. Also, they have some chances of locking some firewarriors in combat for a few phases. However, firewarriors have decent chances of winning that fight cause koptas have str 3, 4+ armor and just 2 attacks.

I think you've pretty much summed it up.

Your first (two) negative points pretty much vanish, when you don't waste points on the rokkit upgrade. With big shootas they can still do most things they could do before, and T5/2W/4+ is rather a pain to remove for opponents. They completely rock at tying up shooting units like pink horrors, devastators or tau units. In units of three they force your opponent to activate their counter-charge units while being tough enough to not die to anything easily high-strength weaponry, which works pretty well in tandem with battlewagons.

The buzzsaw is more or less a waste of points in this setup. With a little luck, they are strong enough to glance a vehicle to death, while anything else requiring a buzzsaw to kill would pretty much wipe the floor with them anyways.

A friend of mine usually runs a single Deffkopta, keeps it in reserve until after first blood has been had, and then outflanks with it when it does arrive. Costing only a measly 35 points, if an unit in the game shoots at it, then it has made its points back, and probably more. Being T5 you can put it in the right combat and shut some units completely down, and with it being late game....thats awesome.

Indeed, Jidmah has a good point. Upgrades are hardly necessary. The enemy has to deal with them asap. In this way, they can disrupt enemy plans.

I plan to run a Warboss on bike with a trio of rokkit deffkoptas (that's all I have) and outflank them. This way he can get all the way into the enemy deployment zone unharmed, and then assault something the turn after. He can split from the koptas if I want to, or he can stay with them for protection. The unit is going to cost around 230 points, but it will hit hard, and can possibly kill something important and expensive in assault. If the koptas kill something with their rokkits, it's a bonus,

Does anybody have any input on this tactic? I have tried running just three shooty deffkoptas by themselves for some time now, and they have almost always been a waste of points.

They are a weird unit. The thing is, if they turbo turn one then they look very scary, especially when kitted with rokkits. With T5, 2 wounds and a 4++ cover save they can give many armies headaches as they are surprisingly hard to kill if you roll a few junk saves. The LD issue with koptas and bikes is major obviously, but Koptas are much harder to kill so I see them as bikes with a chance to be either a tank popper, MEQ sniper or just an enormous target that's difficult to remove. I've been surprised at how good they can be. Also, Bigbomms are pretty solid. Yes, it's a lot of points, but it's a surprisingly resilient, dakka-filled unit. Competitive? Probably not. But in casual games very fun.

Probably i was not lucky enough with bombs. There were a few times when they'd be great! For example, i was facing a tau gunline and outflanked 2 koptas with bommz, one of which scattered too much and didn't wound a single model it appeared to be upon and the second one killed just 1 model with their 4+ armor saves, yep he made better than average saves, like 3 out of 4 wounds and din't fail pinning test. Anywayz, i find s4 ap5 blast not worth 15 points. It forces koptas to go flat-out and not shoot, it doesn't alwayz have targets to hit. It sometimes scatters on the kopta itself...but personally i like it, it's so orky! Anywayz, bommz are fun but not very effective.

I still like a 4-copta unit. I'd out-flank with them so you don't cough up first blood though. With their speed, you should be able to find a good target to assault in their next turn. It's a threat that must be dealt with.

Outflank, enjoy 2-S8 AP3 hits (or 1-S8 AP3 hit on a flier), then assault something next turn.

1-4 s3 hammer of wrath hits, then they're T5 with 3 S4 attacks each on the charge. Great for eating up squishy things in the back field.

I take 2-3 Rokkit Deffkoptas in almost all of my lists (at at least 1500 points, which is what I usually play).

If my opponent has Predators/Hammerheads/Whirlwinds, I like to outflank them and hit them in the rear armor. With a bit of luck and Ork ingenuity, I can usually pop the tank before it does too much damage to my Boyz.

Otherwise, I scout them forward (sometimes with a Warboss on a bike to get him into the fray (I like to have him tie a unit up, especially marines, while a Battlewagon full of Slugga Boyz hits another unit)) and do my best to cripple/distract Crisis Suits/Devastators/Pathfinders (Especially Pathfinders!) and/or anything that they can handle.

 Jidmah wrote:
Your first (two) negative points pretty much vanish, when you don't waste points on the rokkit upgrade. With big shootas they can still do most things they could do before, and T5/2W/4+ is rather a pain to remove for opponents. They completely rock at tying up shooting units like pink horrors, devastators or tau units. In units of three they force your opponent to activate their counter-charge units while being tough enough to not die to anything easily high-strength weaponry, which works pretty well in tandem with battlewagons.

The buzzsaw is more or less a waste of points in this setup. With a little luck, they are strong enough to glance a vehicle to death, while anything else requiring a buzzsaw to kill would pretty much wipe the floor with them anyways.

Nailed it. I used rokkit koptas once or twice then 'downgraded' to big shooter and never looked back.

I've had some success outflanking five BS koptas with a bikerboss. Ld9 and re-rolls is far better than Ld7 with nothing

The rokkit vs big shoota argument is an interesting one - ultra-mobile TL rokkits are nice, but so is keeping a suicide unit nice and cheap. If I was building a unit now, I'd be converting the kopta fronts to allow magnetisation/swapping of weapons, especially in case the advantages/disadvantages change in the new codex (and if we do get a new kit, the choice of weapons might change too - e.g. heavy flamer koptas, anyone?).

Interesting...can they really share Scout with an indep without scout himself?

 Clang wrote:
The rokkit vs big shoota argument is an interesting one - ultra-mobile TL rokkits are nice, but so is keeping a suicide unit nice and cheap. If I was building a unit now, I'd be converting the kopta fronts to allow magnetisation/swapping of weapons, especially in case the advantages/disadvantages change in the new codex (and if we do get a new kit, the choice of weapons might change too - e.g. heavy flamer koptas, anyone?).

The issue with rokkits is that they aren't exactly guaranteed to do anything meaningful. Cover or invul saves take a heavy toll on one-shot weapons, and even penetrating hits just have a two in six chance to do something meaningful to a vehicle. All AP3 + weapons getting worse in 6th, weapon destroyed results being a lot less critial an snap shots during shaken/stunned results simply made rokkits no longer worth suiciding for.

As for magnetizing - AOBR kopaz are so cheap to get, you'd probably spend more money on magnets than on an additional trio of koptaz.

 koooaei wrote:
Interesting...can they really share Scout with an indep without scout himself?

No, but it may work the other way around.

The only way I have got them to do anything is with buzzaw, the Rokkits have been completely useless in every game as they're still not amazing AT weapons. I thought about KMB:s for that shiny AP2 but they're not really a unit you want to take random wounds with.

So I guess 1-5, big shootas, buzzaw, if I'm going to run them at all. They're so pricey they could be just meganobz or something and buggies at least could take skorchas, while Dakkajets can actually kill things.

Great looking model that works well.....some of the time!

Like all things orky they are a bit hit or miss which is why a 5 point drop would be nice or maybe more, would be better run in larger numbers than we see them

Take one with no upgrades, leave it in reserve, hide it as soon as it comes on the table and use it for last minute objective contesting.

 krootman. wrote:
Take one with no upgrades, leave it in reserve, hide it as soon as it comes on the table and use it for last minute objective contesting.

sounds like a plan! I'll have to try that.

Last time I used them they got wiped out with psychic shriek

Being how fast they are i tend to bring them in with shootaz, shoot some stuff then go eat overwatch for either choppy Nobs or choppy boys assault.

 Icculus wrote:

 krootman. wrote:
Take one with no upgrades, leave it in reserve, hide it as soon as it comes on the table and use it for last minute objective contesting.

sounds like a plan! I'll have to try that.

Last time I used them they got wiped out with psychic shriek

At 35 pts its low risk high reward. If it dies no big deal, if your opppnent ingores or forgets about it,it can win you games.