Assualty Tau for Farsight Enclaves

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**mixer86**

Ok now as much as i like the Tau Codex and the Farsight supplement, i couldn't help but feel a tiny bit upset that there was not a dedicated assault unit that Farsight could utilise and complement him so here is a theory i have been toying with and was wondering if people thought it was any good?

Not trying to break the game, i want it as fair as possible and simply as a nice house rule set to allow me to use farsight the way i would like to.

XV16 “Oppression” Battlesuit Squad….............................................55 Points
XV16 Oppression Squads are an Elite choice for a Tau: Farsight Enclaves Army.

M WS BS S T W I A LD SV
6 4 3 5 4 2 3 3 8 3+ Shas’el
6 4 3 5 4 2 3 4 8 3+ Shas’vre

Unit Type:
Jet Pack Infantry.
Jet Pack Infantry (Character) - Shas’vre only.

Unit Composition: 1 XV16 Oppression Battlesuit

Equipment
• XV16 Battlesuit
• Enclave Blade (Shas’el only)
• Enclave Executioner (Shas’vre only)
• Shield Generator
• Oppression Grenade Pack
• Bonded

Enclave Blade: Commander Farsight personally oversaw the construction of a weapon that his enclave brethren could utilise to follow in his footsteps.

The Enclave Blade uses the following profile:

Type Str AP
Specialist User 3

Enclave Executioner: the Executioner is a further development of Farsight’s original designs to forge a blade capable of comparison to Farsight’s own weapon.

The Enclave Executioner uses the following profile:

Type Str AP
Unwieldy +1 2

Oppression Grenade Pack: After observing first-hand the effectiveness of the Imperium’s Assault vehicles providing an distinct advantage to assault troop, Farsight started an initiative to mimic such a tool to his Enclaves own ends.

Models that are equipped with the Oppression Grenade Pack counts as having both assault and defensive grenades.

Options
- May add up to 4 more XV16 Oppression Battlesuits for ………....55 points per model
- May upgrade 1 XV16 Battlesuit to a Shas’vre……………………………….......15 points
- Any XV16 may take a single Flamer for ...............................................5 points per model

So thats the initial idea.

What do people think? costing OK? unit stats OK? etc.

**rohansoldier**

Interesting idea but I think that their WS and I is too high for a tau unit (I guess they have been extensively trained in combat though unlike most Tau so I can see why you have done it).

Also, movement stats are not needed as everyone moves the same in 40K (unless using jet or jump packs, bikes etc).

I think they might need to up their points a bit if they are going to have 4+ invulns as standard. Maybe 60-65pts?

**mixer86**

Interesting idea but I think that their WS and I is too high for a tau unit (I guess they have been extensively trained in combat though unlike most Tau so I can see why you have done it).

I agree it is a high WS for Tau, as you say the thoery is they have been trained by Farsight and also i felt the distinct lack of shooting offset the WS buff. perhaps WS4 is a bit high, maybe WS3 and WS4 for the Shas'vre?

Also, movement stats are not needed as everyone moves the same in 40K (unless using jet or jump packs, bikes etc).

I know, i was using a template i have used for fantasy in the past so it was just in there.

I think they might need to up their points a bit if they are going to have 4+ invulns as standard. Maybe 60-65pts?

i'm not against upping points if the general consensus is that. but bear in mind a standard suit with a shield gen is around 40 points before adding a gun.

Thanks for the reply.

**Jefffar**

But a standard suit is WS 2, I 2 and doesn't have 3 Wounds if I am reading your stat block right.

A really Tau close combat suit might have a weapon to protect itself if charged, but it would be a shooting suit built around close range weapons. The XV-9 Hazards are such suits (though somewhat over costed in their current incarnation). Even Farsight and Brightsword, arguably the most assault oriented of the Eight, still carry high powered ranged weaponry.

So I'd suggest looking at some Battlesuit Support Systems and Weapons that could turn a Crisis Suit into something a little more melee capable than trying to turn out a dedicated assault suit.

**mixer86**

Jefffar wrote:
But a standard suit is WS 2, I 2 and doesn't have 3 Wounds if I am reading your stat block right.

A really Tau close combat suit might have a weapon to protect itself if charged, but it would be a shooting suit built around close range weapons. The XV-9 Hazards are such suits (though somewhat over costed in their current incarnation). Even Farsight and Brightsword, arguably the most assault oriented of the Eight, still carry high powered ranged weaponry.

So I'd suggest looking at some Battlesuit Support Systems and Weapons that could turn a Crisis Suit into something a little more melee capable than trying to turn out a dedicated assault suit.

Opps on my part about the wounds, i have changed it back to 2 wounds and Initiative 3. i have also added the option for flamers. Better?

**Jefffar**

I think that that change is not masking a fundamental misunderstanding of the Tau and Farside's approach to close combat.

When Farsight and similarly minded Tau close with the enemy to destroy them, the primary weapon to do so is close ranged firepower that overwhelms the enemy. Specialized systems allow the Tau to deter, evade or survive combat rather than jump in with both feet.

This also carries over to table top play. For Tau, weak close combat abilities and low leadership are assets, not problems. This allows a Tau unit that does get caught in combat to quickly fold and escape (or die). This is important because it opens up that scary assault unit to being shot at immediately thereafter.

That is where the problem in this unit lies. It's expected to fight to win close combat, which means it needs to run around getting into fights instead of avoiding them. To the Tau, who need to put every point they can into shooting the enemy from the start if the game until that critical moment the enemy gets to charge range.

Farsight, Crisis Teams, Vespid, Stealth Teams and Hazard Teams contribute to this by jumping in and doing damage in the enemy's rear, causing the advancing units to have to either turn around and deal with them or continue their drive to the gunline. Kroot do something similar by coming in at the flanks or occupying key terrain that cannot be bypassed.

So I would recommend you try to make a unit that fits in existing Tau doctrine. Something that delays, distracts and blunts enemy assaults rather than charging into the slaughter like an Ork.

**koooaei**

Even orkses have put down choppas and picked up shootas in 6 ed. U want mellee tau?..

**Formosa**

Fundamentally I don't agree or like the idea, tau are good enough as it is without adding a cc tau unit thus plugging there only minor weakness, now your idea in and of itself works quite well, however the ws should be at most 3, I 3 also and ap2 should be right out completely, tau do not have cc tech at that level yet in numbers to hand out to whole units, there are prototype weapons like the gauntlet and the melta blades but not mass produced

**Swastakowey**

why not try a defensive assault unit, for example give it buffs for bracing (not moving for a turn) and counter attack, maybe make use of the flachete launchers that are on their vehicles. And as a CC weapon why not give them something similar to that movie where the ghiant robots beat up monsters (the plasma tazer fist shocker

) that way its like it moves into position, braces and is designed to stop a charge long before it gets close rather than get into assault like all the other races.

Just an idea and i can expand is you want, bear in mind i know little about tau.

the CC weapon can be a low I powerfist but give it plasma gun stats?

**lambsandlions**

Have you tried assaulting with regular crisis suits and farsight?
I like:
farsight
crisis suit, 2x plasma rifle, retrovector thrusters
crisis suit, 2x plasma rifle, flamer
crisis suit, 2x fusion blaster, target lock.

Basically you drop down next to a unit with no scatter and blast them to hell with 10 s6 ap2 shots. That should soften them up and next turn you assault them with fleet. If they try to assault you, you flame them, hit and run on I5 and shoot and assault them again next round. Obviously you can not go toe to toe with a real combat unit but anything that is not meant for combat will die to farsight. Farsights stats are enough to make sure you are winning combat most the time, if you lose his ld10 and I5 really help and you should be able to get away just fine.

**mortetvie**

I always thought it would be fun to make a farsight enclaves list with suits made from ogre kingdoms ogre models and painted to look like Mexican wrestlers... Make the suits all for close ranged combat.

The onager gauntlet could symbolize your commander's special wrestling move and everything!

If I worked at GW and had this discount I would totally make this army... Having a CC crisis suit team would only make it all the better.

**koooaei**

That'd be hilarious! Though, a comical race are basically orkses and not tau.

**Scipio Africanus**

I'll go through this quickly. My comments are in bold.

mixer86 wrote:
Ok now as much as i like the Tau Codex and the Farsight supplement, i couldn't help but feel a tiny bit upset that there was not a dedicated assault unit that Farsight could utilise and complement him so here is a theory i have been toying with and was wondering if people thought it was any good?

Farsight does not specialise in close combat. Farsight specialises in fights at close range. These are not the same thing.

Not trying to break the game, i want it as fair as possible and simply as a nice house rule set to allow me to use farsight the way i would like to.

More than riptides already do? these things are going to be competing for a slot with riptides.

XV16 “Oppression” Battlesuit Squad….............................................55 Points
XV16 Oppression Squads are an Elite choice for a Tau: Farsight Enclaves Army.

M WS BS S T W I A LD SV
6 4 3 5 4 2 3 3 8 3+ Shas’el
6 4 3 5 4 2 3 4 8 3+ Shas’vre

We don't have M values in 40k. WS4 BS3 S5 T4 W2 I2 A3/4 LD9/10 (Shas'el might as well be Shas'O.), 3+ save is cool

Unit Type:
Jet Pack Infantry.
Jet Pack Infantry (Character) - Shas’vre only.

Unit Composition: 1 XV16 Oppression Battlesuit

Equipment
• XV16 Battlesuit
• Enclave Blade (Shas’el only)
• Enclave Executioner (Shas’vre only)
• Shield Generator
• Oppression Grenade Pack
• Bonded

What constitutes an XV16 battlesuit? Is it just an XV8 battlesuit repurposed for close combat? For 55 points, you could give these guys FNP included in their battlesuit. (for a 40+15ppm price) and they would already be better

Enclave Blade: Commander Farsight personally oversaw the construction of a weapon that his enclave brethren could utilise to follow in his footsteps.

The Enclave Blade uses the following profile:

Type Str AP
Specialist User 3

There's nor real reason you don't just give them a power weapon. This is a clone of a Power Sword

Enclave Executioner: the Executioner is a further development of Farsight’s original designs to forge a blade capable of comparison to Farsight’s own weapon.

The Enclave Executioner uses the following profile:

Type Str AP
Unwieldy +1 2

This is a clone of a power axe. Seriously, just call the weapons "Enclave Blades", and say "this is a power weapon." There is nothing unique about these weapons.

Oppression Grenade Pack: After observing first-hand the effectiveness of the Imperium’s Assault vehicles providing an distinct advantage to assault troop, Farsight started an initiative to mimic such a tool to his Enclaves own ends.

Models that are equipped with the Oppression Grenade Pack counts as having both assault and defensive grenades.

Cool. This is a support system, right?

Options
- May add up to 4 more XV16 Oppression Battlesuits for ………....55 points per model
- May upgrade 1 XV16 Battlesuit to a Shas’vre……………………………….......15 points
- Any XV16 may take a single Flamer for ...............................................5 points per model

So thats the initial idea.

What do people think? costing OK? unit stats OK? etc.

The unit is not OP in anyway, and just makes better use of the Battlesuit's phenominal attack and strength stats. Just let them take a power weapon, it makes the rules much simpler.

I'd just let any XV16 take a single weapon for the prices listed in the codex, there's no point forcing an anti-MEQ fighter to use a flamer.

Also, you've reversed Shas'vre and Shas'el. Shas'el is like a step between Shas'vre and Shas'o, Shas'ui is the step you're thinking of.

**Blakman**

lambsandlions wrote:
Have you tried assaulting with regular crisis suits and farsight?
I like:
farsight
crisis suit, 2x plasma rifle, retrovector thrusters
crisis suit, 2x plasma rifle, flamer
crisis suit, 2x fusion blaster, target lock.

Basically you drop down next to a unit with no scatter and blast them to hell with 10 s6 ap2 shots. That should soften them up and next turn you assault them with fleet. If they try to assault you, you flame them, hit and run on I5 and shoot and assault them again next round. Obviously you can not go toe to toe with a real combat unit but anything that is not meant for combat will die to farsight. Farsights stats are enough to make sure you are winning combat most the time, if you lose his ld10 and I5 really help and you should be able to get away just fine.

The Fleet special rule applies to models, not units, so for the above tactic to work you would have to give every suit Vectored Retro Thrusters including Farsight (which is not possible).
You may however Hit and Run, as the whole unit can benefit from a single VRT.

**Scipio Africanus**

Blakman wrote:
lambsandlions wrote:
Have you tried assaulting with regular crisis suits and farsight?
I like:
farsight
crisis suit, 2x plasma rifle, retrovector thrusters
crisis suit, 2x plasma rifle, flamer
crisis suit, 2x fusion blaster, target lock.

Basically you drop down next to a unit with no scatter and blast them to hell with 10 s6 ap2 shots. That should soften them up and next turn you assault them with fleet. If they try to assault you, you flame them, hit and run on I5 and shoot and assault them again next round. Obviously you can not go toe to toe with a real combat unit but anything that is not meant for combat will die to farsight. Farsights stats are enough to make sure you are winning combat most the time, if you lose his ld10 and I5 really help and you should be able to get away just fine.

The Fleet special rule applies to models, not units, so for the above tactic to work you would have to give every suit Vectored Retro Thrusters including Farsight (which is not possible).
You may however Hit and Run, as the whole unit can benefit from a single VRT.

Also, one should be in the business of taking ATS if they have a free slot; Precision shots can be a game changer against the right opponent.

The number of times I've sniped out a razorwing flock, or killed a power-fist specialist in a death company...