Switch Theme:

Riptide in reserve and nova charging  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in ca
Veteran Inquisitorial Tyranid Xenokiller






It just popped into my head (and I couldn't find a relevant thread with search) to wonder if a Riptide that is in Reserve at the start of the turn can use their nova reactor. Is it just a case that reserves are at the start of the turn and so is the Nova Reactor and the rule that if 2 things occur simultaneously the player whose turn it is decides order? Or is there any other relevant rules that specifically prevent or allow use of the Nova Reactor when arriving from reserve?
   
Made in ca
Focused Fire Warrior





I think you bring it in and then nova charge, which is a yes to your question.

1500pt O'Vesa Star W: 27 D: 2 L: 1
The challenge: in a 1500pt game I will play 900pt + D6x100 pts, if I roll a 6 I reroll and -100 to that second number (down to 1000pt minimum)
W:6 D:0 L:1 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





I agree with Wings. A precedent ruling of "coming in from reserve and then doing an action" would be a Necron Monolith which has an FAQ to clarify that it can come in from reserve and then have troops "disembark" from it. 2 start of the movement phase actions, sequenced by the controlling player.

EDIT:
After reviewing the rules (see Ghaz's post next) - I stand corrected. THe Necron Monolith grants an explicit exception to the rule while there is not such an exception for riptides.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/07 21:19:12


 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

Page 125 I believe states that special rules that must be used at the start of the turn can't be used in the same turn that a unit arrives from reserve.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





 Ghaz wrote:
Page 125 I believe states that special rules that must be used at the start of the turn can't be used in the same turn that a unit arrives from reserve.


This is correct. Page 125 states that it cannot unless there is an explicit exception cited. The monolith's FAQ provides that explicit exception; however, there is not such an exception for the Riptide.

So - no. You cannot Nova Charge on the same turn you enter your riptide from reserve.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka




Vanished Completely

Page 5, I believe, informs us how to resolve rules that trigger at the same time.

Ghaz,
There is some debate when it comes to a handful of 'abilities' and the restrictions on page 125. The abilities in the spotlight of that particular debate share one thing in common: They provide a benefit at some later point in the game, as well as containing instructions for the player to follow at the start of the turn/movement phase. Frequently Asked Question's just made this area more gray, as they have given some of these abilities permission to function even though they violate page 125. The problem I have is that none of these Frequently Asked Question answers provided a reason why these abilities are being given permission to function, so we don't know for sure if it was intended for all 'Do X now, and Y later' rules to ignore page 125 or just a handful of them.

Personally, as Nova Charge is one that has yet to be Frequently Asked Questioned to work, I will not use it coming in from reserves because of page 125.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/07 21:28:39


8th made it so I can no longer sway Tau onto the side of Chaos, but they will eventually turn aside from their idea of the Greater Good to embrace the Greatest of pleasures.  
   
Made in ca
Veteran Inquisitorial Tyranid Xenokiller






My only question about the rule on pg 125 is that it restricts the use of abilities that must be used at the start of turn and the wording for Nova Reactor is at the start of Movement Phase. I am aware that these are practically the same point in time during a turn but was curious if the different wording would have any bearing?
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





 CrashCanuck wrote:
My only question about the rule on pg 125 is that it restricts the use of abilities that must be used at the start of turn and the wording for Nova Reactor is at the start of Movement Phase. I am aware that these are practically the same point in time during a turn but was curious if the different wording would have any bearing?


I asked this specific question a few months back and it turned into an unresolved debate thread between people who say they are different (that "start of turn would be before any phase begins") and those that state they are the same (that there is no evidence that there is anything prior to the movement phase in a player turn). I think the majority consensus was that since there is nothing explicitly saying there is something before the movement phase, the movement phase IS the start of the player turn. It needs to be FAQ'ed and really, I think it's probably one of the best examples of how poorly worded the rules are.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka




Vanished Completely

CrashCanuck,
Also debatable because it is technically two completely different terms.

The problem with the idea that only 'start of the turn' Special Rules are restricted stems from the fact this is not the terminology used within those Special Rules, which instead state 'Start of the Movement Phase.' I have only ever seen a Special Rule with the terminology 'start of the turn' in one or two very rare situations, and they where all found in codex's that are now well out-dated if not officially replaced at this point. The fact the restriction is talking about Special Rules by name, and then uses terminology not found within the Special Rules in question, is very unusual and a very good indicator that they had no Editor at all on this project.

At this point I think the person penning the deployment section, I might be wrong but I think that is the only section in which the terminology 'start of the turn' really appears, was mistaken. Either believed there was a start of the turn phase in which actions where being carried out or believed that was the terminology that they chose to use for 'start of the movement phase' abilities. Regardless of why it was penned that way, it still is something a good editor would of caught onto pretty quickly and corrected.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/07 22:32:17


8th made it so I can no longer sway Tau onto the side of Chaos, but they will eventually turn aside from their idea of the Greater Good to embrace the Greatest of pleasures.  
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Unholyllama wrote:
It needs to be FAQ'ed...
It is FAQ'd:
Q: Blessings are manifested ‘at the start of the Psyker’s Movement
phase’ – does this mean they happen simultaneously with Reserves
rolls, Outflanking rolls etc and if so which is resolved first? (p68)

A: They do occur simultaneously – as such, the player whose
turn it is decides in what order these things occur as per
page 9 of the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook.
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

That is in regards to Psykers already on the table casting Blessings on units coming in from reserve.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Ghaz wrote:
That is in regards to Psykers already on the table casting Blessings on units coming in from reserve.
Everything about that statement is wrong.

First off, that FAQ entry has absolutely nothing directly to do with units coming in from reserve; that timing is not mentioned at all. (It has everything to do with casting Scrier's Gaze before rolling, though.)

Second, it includes a direct statement that "start of movement phase" (e.g. Blessings) and "start of turn" (e.g. Reserve rolls) are simultaneous and interchangeable, which is very much to the point of this thread.
   
Made in gb
Tough Tyrant Guard





SHE-FI-ELD

Nb while I debated in favor of what I am assuming to be a similar situation on a thread a while ago, for my part I agree start of the turn and start of movement to be essentially the same timing. It was the nature of the ability and what constitutes a use of by the unit.

However, depending on the gaming environment I would expect some to disallow it by page 125, so as an open issue you should check with your gaming group.

It's my codex and I'll cry If I want to.

Tactical objectives are fantastic 
   
 
Forum Index » 40K You Make Da Call
Go to: