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2014/02/14 16:03:23
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
John Holcomb heard Oklahoma State guard Marcus Smart say those words last Saturday night. Holcomb heard Smart say that just moments after his now infamous contretemps with Texas Tech fan Jeff Orr. Holcomb, the radio analyst for Oklahoma State men’s basketball team, was not reading Smart’s lips. He saw Smart say it. He heard Smart say it.
Holcomb stands by that observation. Emphatically. “As I told my play-by-play partner, Dave Hunziker, ‘Dave, it was so plain,” says Holcomb, who doubles as the sports director at Tulsa’s CBS affiliate, KOTV. “That was a can’t-miss thing for me.”
To re-set the scene, the Cowboys, who had lost four of five after being ranked No. 9 in the nation just three weeks earlier, trailed Texas Tech in Lubbock, 63-61, in the waning seconds Saturday night. Oklahoma State’s Le’Bryan Nash lost the ball in the paint. The Red Raiders pushed the ball upcourt on the turnover and Smart, who had been standing on the baseline at the time of the turnover, outhustled his four teammates downcourt in an attempt to block Jaye Crockett’s layup with :06 remaining.
The shot missed but Smart, who soared into a cameraman and then landed at the foot of the front row of seats, was whistled for a foul. As two bystanders attempted to help up Smart, who was facing the court, something caused his head to whip around 180 degrees. In the next moment Smart was confronting a white, middle-aged fan, 1983 Texas Tech alumnus Jeff Orr. As Orr --forgive my amatuer lip-reading-- appears to be saying, “Sorry about that,” Smart gives him a quick, firm shove.
“Our broadcast position is right next to the Oklahoma State bench,” says Holcomb, who is in his sixth season as the team’s color analyst on the Cowboy Sports Network, “and during a game I’ll jot down significant plays. So when they turned the ball over I had my head down, writing that had happened. Then I heard the crowd noise swell.”
When Holcomb looked up, he spotted one of the officials, Doug Sirmons, approach the scorer’s table to indicate a technical foul on Smart. Holcomb heard Smart tell Oklahoma State coach Travis Ford, “I had no choice, he pushed the guy.” Having not witnessed the encounter between Smart and Orr, Holcomb at first assumed Sermons was referring to a Texas Tech player.
Holcomb, 49, was wearing his headset when an obviously upset Smart retreated to the Oklahoma State bench. Still, he is certain that he both saw and heard Smart say, “Coach, he called me a [see forum posting rules]!”
Anyone listening to the broadcast would have heard Holcomb tell Hunziker, ‘“Dave, Marcus said, ‘He just called me the N-word.’”
Within 24 hours Orr, whom Texas Tech had previously touted as its “Superfan,” publicly apologized. “I would like to take this opportunity to offer my sincere apologies to Marcus Smart,” Orr began. Later: “I regret calling Marcus Smart a ‘piece of crap’ but I want to make it known that I did not use a racial slur of any kind.”
Did Smart, who has not commented publicly on what Orr said to him, misunderstand what Orr said? “I believe that Marcus believes he was called that,” says Holcomb. “I kind of have a hard time believing, judging by Marcus’ reaction, that there wasn’t something more than ‘a piece of crap’ said.”
On Monday, the Big 12 Conference announced a three-game suspension for Smart, a sophomore who was a preseason All-American and who some experts predicted prior to this this season would be the No. 1 overall selection in the 2014 NBA draft. On Tuesday night the Cowboys, playing without Smart at No. 19 Texas, lost 87-68. For the Cowboys, who were 15-2 on January 15, it was their fifth straight loss, dropping them to 16-8.
A berth in the NCAA tournament next month is suddenly a tenuous proposition. The Cowboys’ coach, Ford, has bigger problems.
Last year comedian Louis C.K. introduced what has become a popular riff called “Of course… but maybe.” The premise is that of course there are certain standards or truths to which we all adhere, but maybe, sometimes, extenuating circumstances bear a review of those policies. In Smart’s situation, of course a player should never lay hands on a fan. Of course.
Ford appeared on ESPN with Andy Katz on Monday, who asked him what Smart had told him Orr said. “Well, I’m not going to get into all that,” said Ford. “If Marcus comes out at some point, uh, as I told him, we need to learn a lesson first. It doesn’t matter what was said. The lesson is it does not matter what was said. The lesson is do not react to whatever is said. That is the lesson. Do not react.”
Of course. Of course…
...But maybe the greater lesson is that being a 50-something man with court-side seats does not allow you to use the N-word. Particularly if the target of your assault is a college sophomore.
But maybe the world never discovers that Orr said anything abusive--no matter if it is his version or Smart’s version--unless Smart shoves him. Had Smart restrained himself, Orr would still be displaying the boorish behavior that he has displayed for years (you can spot him flipping the bird to a Texas A&M player who scored on an alley-oop just before halftime --before halftime -- of a game in 2010).
Big 12 commissioner Bob Bowlsby, in announcing Smart’s three-game suspension, said, “Mr. Smart's actions were a clear violation of the Big 12 Conference's sportsmanship and ethical conduct policy. Such behavior has no place in athletics and will not be tolerated.”
The Big 12 did not bar Orr from attending any games, although Orr has volunteered to attend no more this season.
Marcus Smart apologized on Sunday without taking questions. Pointedly, he mentioned Orr by his full name. And more pointedly, Smart never repeated what Orr apparently said to him, neither challenging Orr’s version nor confirming it. To publicly dispute Orr’s version would add oxygen to the conflagration. To endorse it? Well...
“I really don’t think you’re ever going to hear Marcus say (that he was called a piece of crap),” says Holcomb.
So now that you have the background, if you didn't already, I sorta wanna discuss three separate points:
1. As a fan, what is an 'acceptable' level of heckling you can do from the stands?
2. Is it ever "okay" for a player to enter the stands in response to something a fan says?
3. If what Orr claimed he said was true (and the video seems to support it) and Marcus Smart (and I hate using this phrase) falsely "pulled the racism card" to basically 'defend' his incredibly poor decision, how should we as a public respond to that?
My responses:
1. With college and pro athletes, I think anything except racism and bigotry is fine. Racism and bigotry, and using slurs associated with them, isn't okay anywhere, IMO, so it shoudn't be towards athletes. The other point of contention many athletes have is "involving family." Personally, I think you have to just get over it. People say gakky stuff about everyone's family. It happens. Fans are going to talk about fething your sister to get in your head. Thats sort of the point of heckling. But again, being racist or (in the future of US atheletics) homophobic shouldn't be acceptable.
2. No. Emphatically, no. Yes, these college athletes are 18-21 year old kids. But you can't do it. Ever. I think that onus has to be on the universities and coaching staffs to treat them how to deal with it.
3. I don't know exactly what to think about this, and especially so because I'm casper white. From that perspective, it can't be good for the black community at large, can it? I think it's a gakky, gakky move on Smart's behalf if he did it purposefully, but it creates a really interesting conversation about "justification."
Anyways, I was surprised no one had posted about this previously, so really eager to hear some of your thoughts....
2014/02/14 16:07:28
Subject: Re:The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
.. I adore the fact you genuinely used the word "shoot" BTW
[/hijack]
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/14 16:07:44
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2014/02/14 16:08:01
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
The player should have been thrown off the team. Never ever touch a fan, especially if you're some pissant college player.
The fan should sue him and the school for $28 gazillion dollars (and yes, use gazillion in the pleading). He should come to court in a wheelchair, full body brace and seeing eye wiener dog. The wiener dog should of course be wearing Texas Tech colors.
Alternatively Texas Tech should declare war on Oklahoma. The state, not the school. The University of Texas system would of course join in as it hates Oklahoma, and film everything (but shown only on the Longhorn Network). Once the fires abate in what was left of Oklahoma, we can plant a new school in the ruins of Oklahoma City (UT-Oklahoma) and look glaringly at Kansas, and Arkansas to do something about it.
In the south, Aggies will do pushups. Son of Frazzled will continue to isolate the variables for the perfect everclear to water combo.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2014/02/14 17:01:51
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
You do not have the right to use racist language, but by the same token you do not have the right to assault someone for it. While you are wearing your school's colours, remember that you represent them.
2014/02/14 17:11:50
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
1. As a fan, what is an 'acceptable' level of heckling you can do from the stands?
I think there are lines. Keep it about the game, his talent, or his career. Family, race, religion, stuff like that is personal and mean.
2. Is it ever "okay" for a player to enter the stands in response to something a fan says?
Is it Ok? Of course not. Is it understandable? Of course it is.
I've been a dumb 19 year old. Just because this guy has a future making millions and has been on TV constantly doesn't make him superhuman. Everybody has a breaking point. We just hope to never reach it during a basketball game.
At this point, my sympathies lie with the player. He didn't hurt the guy, he shoved him. Maybe Smart is unhinged, but I'm gonna guess he was heckled pretty badly.
3. If what Orr claimed he said was true (and the video seems to support it) and Marcus Smart (and I hate using this phrase) falsely "pulled the racism card" to basically 'defend' his incredibly poor decision, how should we as a public respond to that?
If Smart didn't actually hear him call him a slur, and then accused him of it, then sympathy should be gone. But, and this is a pretty big thing, its about what he heard, not what the guy said. Sure, what was said matters, but if he really thought he heard a slur, then he's not lying. He was just wrong.
2014/02/14 17:14:27
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Do me a giant favor and explain what you mean by this?
Mannahnin wrote:A lot of folks online (and in emails in other parts of life) use pretty mangled English. The idea is that it takes extra effort and time to write properly, and they’d rather save the time. If you can still be understood, what’s the harm? While most of the time a sloppy post CAN be understood, the use of proper grammar, punctuation, and spelling is generally seen as respectable and desirable on most forums. It demonstrates an effort made to be understood, and to make your post an easy and pleasant read. By making this effort, you can often elicit more positive responses from the community, and instantly mark yourself as someone worth talking to.
insaniak wrote: Every time someone threatens violence over the internet as a result of someone's hypothetical actions at the gaming table, the earth shakes infinitisemally in its orbit as millions of eyeballs behind millions of monitors all roll simultaneously.
2014/02/14 17:18:10
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
nothing that could get you arrested if you said it to a policeman on the streets (so no threats of violence)
other than that have at it
(If clubs fan are producing these sorts of insults regularly then they should have to play behind closed doors (if they can't identify & ban those responsible)
2. No players can't go into the crowd and attack them no matter what they say (drop them for a significant period for a first offense, any repeat should be a life ban) (the police should also arrest them for assault in many cases, but it doesn't happen too often)
3. False accusations of racist/religious attacks should be treated as racist/religious attack, so impose whatever sanction fits the bill
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/14 17:19:42
2014/02/14 17:29:32
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Do me a giant favor and explain what you mean by this?
The First Amendment says we do actually.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2014/02/14 17:36:21
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Yeah, this is the difference between 'sports heckling' and 'the world'.
Sports arenas and events can have 'rules of conduct' and enforce them. They can remove people for any reason pretty much. So It is very reasonable that they can have a zero tolerance policy on racist statements. Heck, most baseball games begin ejecting people after the 7th inning if they are too obnoxious.
As for players... You simply have to stay above it, and if someone *IS* being offensive, have a way to report it to event staff, and have them ejected from the stadium.
When you boil it down, calling someone a "piece of gak" it pretty hateful and probably uncalled for. being like "No, i didn't call you a racial term which equates you to sub-human, I called you a piece of gak which equates you to human waste, it is totally different and ok, i have standards!" I see no issue with removing that person from the stadium. Too bad.
One of the things I dislike about sporting events is people take it too far. I wish they would do more to curb offensive behavior and hecklers. I alwaays appreciate when they get thrown out and now they have ways to anonymously txt security to have them ejected.
I feel bad for athletes who have to deal with that stuff and for a sport who puts people courtside, that should be considered 'as splash zone'. Don't want to risk getting in a fight with someone? don't sit there. I always felt they need to give basketball 'more space' and keep people back more at stadiums.
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2014/02/14 17:51:23
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Yeah, this is the difference between 'sports heckling' and 'the world'.
Sports arenas and events can have 'rules of conduct' and enforce them. They can remove people for any reason pretty much. So It is very reasonable that they can have a zero tolerance policy on racist statements. Heck, most baseball games begin ejecting people after the 7th inning if they are too obnoxious.
***Agreed, and they should.
As for players... You simply have to stay above it, and if someone *IS* being offensive, have a way to report it to event staff, and have them ejected from the stadium.
***Agreed. Threatening or assaulting stadium patrons on the other hand should result in the harshest criminal and civil penalties, and immediate expulsion from the program.
When you boil it down, calling someone a "piece of gak" it pretty hateful and probably uncalled for. being like "No, i didn't call you a racial term which equates you to sub-human, I called you a piece of gak which equates you to human waste, it is totally different and ok, i have standards!" I see no issue with removing that person from the stadium. Too bad.
***Agreed.
One of the things I dislike about sporting events is people take it too far. I wish they would do more to curb offensive behavior and hecklers. I alwaays appreciate when they get thrown out and now they have ways to anonymously txt security to have them ejected.
***Works for me.
I feel bad for athletes who have to deal with that stuff and for a sport who puts people courtside, that should be considered 'as splash zone'. Don't want to risk getting in a fight with someone? don't sit there. I always felt they need to give basketball 'more space' and keep people back more at stadiums.
***They’re rich. F them.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2014/02/14 17:52:09
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Smart made a mistake, he seems genuine about his apology, Orr made an apology and the two seem to have moved on with their lives. As it has been said Smart is a college age student who made a mistake, no reason to bury him for it.
"Hi, I'am Cthulu. I tried to call, but I kept getting your stupid answering machine."
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Blood is best stirred before battle, and nothing does that better than the bagpipes.
2014/02/14 17:53:32
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
guardpiper wrote: Smart made a mistake, he seems genuine about his apology, Orr made an apology and the two seem to have moved on with their lives. As it has been said Smart is a college age student who made a mistake, no reason to bury him for it.
But this about the intersection of class and race!
Or it could be about two jerks that got into it, and moved on.
2014/02/14 17:54:54
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
I disagree. You absolutely have a right to violate those policies. What you don't have is the right to violate those policies and be free of the consequences.
Mannahnin wrote:A lot of folks online (and in emails in other parts of life) use pretty mangled English. The idea is that it takes extra effort and time to write properly, and they’d rather save the time. If you can still be understood, what’s the harm? While most of the time a sloppy post CAN be understood, the use of proper grammar, punctuation, and spelling is generally seen as respectable and desirable on most forums. It demonstrates an effort made to be understood, and to make your post an easy and pleasant read. By making this effort, you can often elicit more positive responses from the community, and instantly mark yourself as someone worth talking to.
insaniak wrote: Every time someone threatens violence over the internet as a result of someone's hypothetical actions at the gaming table, the earth shakes infinitisemally in its orbit as millions of eyeballs behind millions of monitors all roll simultaneously.
2014/02/14 18:00:12
Subject: Re:The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
I disagree. You absolutely have a right to violate those policies. What you don't have is the right to violate those policies and be free of the consequences.
I guess if you want to be pedenatic about it, but by that logic I have the right to set off a dirty bomb in my apartment building.
If the mechanism of the state will support an actor in suppressing that action, (cops pulling you out of the game), you probably don't actually have that right in any meaningful way.
2014/02/14 18:02:25
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
FREEDOM!!!
- d-usa
2014/02/14 18:04:16
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
My bigger issue with the whole thing is the "racism wolf crying" that Smart may have done. To me it's pretty akin to a false rape charge...
Hugely damaging to character.
It's not. A rape charge can get you arrested. Accusing somebody of saying a racial slur is damaging to character, I suppose, but probably not in any meaningful way.
But, we live in a society that worries more about false accusations then they do about the actual thing, so maybe you're right.
2014/02/14 18:10:34
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
I disagree. You absolutely have a right to violate those policies. What you don't have is the right to violate those policies and be free of the consequences.
I guess if you want to be pedenatic about it, but by that logic I have the right to set off a dirty bomb in my apartment building.
If the mechanism of the state will support an actor in suppressing that action, (cops pulling you out of the game), you probably don't actually have that right in any meaningful way.
What you describe as pedantry I see as a basic understanding. Much like all the overblown hype about what's his name from Duck Dynasty. The gentleman was never denied his rights; people seem to think that exercising a right absolves one of any negative repercussions.
Sorry about the mini-rant. Back to topic!
Mannahnin wrote:A lot of folks online (and in emails in other parts of life) use pretty mangled English. The idea is that it takes extra effort and time to write properly, and they’d rather save the time. If you can still be understood, what’s the harm? While most of the time a sloppy post CAN be understood, the use of proper grammar, punctuation, and spelling is generally seen as respectable and desirable on most forums. It demonstrates an effort made to be understood, and to make your post an easy and pleasant read. By making this effort, you can often elicit more positive responses from the community, and instantly mark yourself as someone worth talking to.
insaniak wrote: Every time someone threatens violence over the internet as a result of someone's hypothetical actions at the gaming table, the earth shakes infinitisemally in its orbit as millions of eyeballs behind millions of monitors all roll simultaneously.
2014/02/14 18:14:33
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
I disagree. You absolutely have a right to violate those policies. What you don't have is the right to violate those policies and be free of the consequences.
I guess if you want to be pedenatic about it, but by that logic I have the right to set off a dirty bomb in my apartment building.
If the mechanism of the state will support an actor in suppressing that action, (cops pulling you out of the game), you probably don't actually have that right in any meaningful way.
What you describe as pedantry I see as a basic understanding. Much like all the overblown hype about what's his name from Duck Dynasty. The gentleman was never denied his rights; people seem to think that exercising a right absolves one of any negative repercussions.
Sorry about the mini-rant. Back to topic!
No, I understand the difference between a legal right and any consequences.
I'm pointing out that sometimes there are barriers to even having the right, beyond later consequences.
The Duck guys had every right to say what they said. I don't have the right to start singing during movie. We both suffer consequences, but nobody is going to stop the Duck guys from talking. I will be actually stopped from my outburst.
2014/02/14 18:17:13
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Polonius - I guess it begs the question: do you think Orr or Phil Roberston would be justified in pursing a defamation of character lawsuit? I think they'd get destroyed in the media for it.
2014/02/14 18:17:29
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
I disagree. You absolutely have a right to violate those policies. What you don't have is the right to violate those policies and be free of the consequences.
I guess if you want to be pedenatic about it, but by that logic I have the right to set off a dirty bomb in my apartment building.
If the mechanism of the state will support an actor in suppressing that action, (cops pulling you out of the game), you probably don't actually have that right in any meaningful way.
What you describe as pedantry I see as a basic understanding. Much like all the overblown hype about what's his name from Duck Dynasty. The gentleman was never denied his rights; people seem to think that exercising a right absolves one of any negative repercussions.
Sorry about the mini-rant. Back to topic!
No, I understand the difference between a legal right and any consequences.
I'm pointing out that sometimes there are barriers to even having the right, beyond later consequences.
The Duck guys had every right to say what they said. I don't have the right to start singing during movie. We both suffer consequences, but nobody is going to stop the Duck guys from talking. I will be actually stopped from my outburst.
Aha!. I get it now.
Mannahnin wrote:A lot of folks online (and in emails in other parts of life) use pretty mangled English. The idea is that it takes extra effort and time to write properly, and they’d rather save the time. If you can still be understood, what’s the harm? While most of the time a sloppy post CAN be understood, the use of proper grammar, punctuation, and spelling is generally seen as respectable and desirable on most forums. It demonstrates an effort made to be understood, and to make your post an easy and pleasant read. By making this effort, you can often elicit more positive responses from the community, and instantly mark yourself as someone worth talking to.
insaniak wrote: Every time someone threatens violence over the internet as a result of someone's hypothetical actions at the gaming table, the earth shakes infinitisemally in its orbit as millions of eyeballs behind millions of monitors all roll simultaneously.
2014/02/14 18:24:26
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
cincydooley wrote: Polonius - I guess it begs the question: do you think Orr or Phil Roberston would be justified in pursing a defamation of character lawsuit? I think they'd get destroyed in the media for it.
I'm not sure what the second guy's defamation is, but Orr would have a hard time proving actual damages. Further, I'm not sure he can show his character was damaged, even in a way that can't be quantified.
You'd also have some interesting arguments that since he was sitting courtside in a televised game, he's a very limited public figure.
In short, no. I don't think he'd legally have much of a case, and I doubt very much that his reputation has been sullied by any accusations of using a racial slur.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, rant time. I hate that everybody seems to confuse using a racial slur, (or accusing somebody of using a slur) is the same as being racist.
Its not, and while there's no doubt some correlation, plenty of people that aren't racist use slurs all the time, while plenty of people are horribly racist but avoid their use. It's something that bothers me to no end.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/14 18:25:51
2014/02/14 18:26:08
Subject: The Marcus Smart Situation: Fan Behaviour and Accusing People of Racism
Do me a giant favor and explain what you mean by this?
Perhaps I should have said that societal norms have deemed racist language to to inappropriate for use. You may still of course use whatever language you so choose, and there may be consequences for said language.