Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I have an idea of a 2000 point army for orks and before i get into buying a few more boxes i wanted some opinions. It is simple and the idea is to just tar pit and fill the board. every objective will be controlled or contested. here is the list. And i am going dual force Org with Orks.

HQ X3
Big Mek
KFF
'Eavy Armor

TROOPS X5
BoyZ X29
Slugga Choppa
With Nob
Power Claw
Bosspole

TROOPSX3
BoyZ X29
3X big shootas
Shoota
With Nob
Bosspole


As you can see, the movement phase may be long but i think it will work out pretty good. Opinions???

Welcome to Dakkadakka!
Intersting list.
I feel like your opponent will be very frustrated while waiting for the movement to be over.
Consider buying magnets, and making a sortof "movement tray" thing so you just slide the whole squad forward.
I dont really have any suggestions to the list though.

Painting 200 models and then having to move them all individually 6 times each every time you play is going to suck the fun out of the game.

Welcome to Dakka mate! Seriously, painting all of em, not to mention buying and playing will suck the fun out of it. Here's just something for you to ponder on: it took me about 3 hours to do a 20 man squad of dark angels (DV pack). Don't put yourself through 15 hours of modelling, then even more painting!

Unless you are playing double force org, 6 troops is the max.

Yeah he said dual force org in the introductory statement.

That being said, games with this army will take 4-EV-AR.

Unless you just move them all by the handfuls. I think it would work, but with all those boys you should run shoota boys. Because they are assault weapons you will find yourself rolling hundreds of dice. and that should be fun in it's own right.

Actually, having played this style of army, movement gets much faster as you practice with it.

The real issue is that 6th ed will punish you horribly. I've played lists like this and you'll have a hard time getting into combat - shooting is that good and your guys will die from the front-rank. You'll have trouble maneuvering them past each other, so your opponent will be able to focus-fire on the closest units each time, and the ones further back will just get shot a turn later.


The forcefields are really not necessary - if your group allows IA, I'd take painboyz instead, as getting 5+ cover is not hard, and getting a second 5+ FNP might make the difference.

Good luck. I'd proxy it with pennies or something a few times before you commit to painting them all though, because I don't think it's something you'll have much success with until a new edition and/or codex drops.

See What is Dipping -- http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Dakka_Modeling_FAQ:_Highlighting#What_is_Dipping%3F

See The Army Painter -- http://www.thearmypainter.com/

See The Army Painter "Greenskin" color primer -- http://shop.thearmypainter.com/products.php?ProductGroupId=2#Greenskin

See The Army Painter Strong Tone "Quickshade" -- http://shop.thearmypainter.com/products.php?ProductGroupId=1

That's a nice list if u're not in for winning but for pure cinematic fun. 6 ed killed footslogging hordes. Especially mellee-oriented. So firstly, go all shootas. Sluggaboyz are worse than shootas even in wagonz not telling how useless they are as footslogas.
U can't go full-offensive with the horde cause u're too slow, have no armor and will get shot to death before you get to the enemy cause it's quite easy to ignore cover now. So if you meet any decent list - the only option is to go half-defensive, half-distracting. U sit on the points in ruins or woods and hope that the enemy is not spamming serpents cause they'll kill footslogging boyz no matter what. Than when u're thinned to 10 or lower - go to ground.
The best case scenario is when u're playing relic and get 1-st turn. Just rush in the middle with all you got, take relic turn 2-3 if the enemy is not packing enough firepower to throw you back, than retreat and tarpit-tarpit-tarpir.
Anywayz, with new 6 ed ruleset you can't hope to actually win vs any top-tier list if u're running horde. The best option is just to fight vs some fun lists - it's gona be more interesting and you won't waste time doing nothing and getting frustrated by how unballanced stuff is.

I see that the movement phase can take a while, but with practice you can learn to move them pretty fast. I really dont mind the modelling and painting portion, i have quite a few friends that already said they would help if i go through with this. the part that i am wondering is the things that can break cover saves. i see the reason for going mainly shootas, so if i flip it and have 5 units of shootas and only three units of sluggas would that make it better? the number of shooting rolls would be nice. i see this being a decent army though, will someone pull the blind fold off and let me know truly why not? the only things i can think of that take out cover are flamers, which then they will kill eight max and die on the next assault, and a few long range large blast templates. those are spread throughout armies though. One huge reason i see this being such a good list is the fact that when you think orks in 6th ed you think speed freaks and nobz or mega nobz. most lists i see now are going that way. so to counter people are coming in with low shots, high str, low AP weapons. this horde army will remind people that orks require you to shoot a lot.

With this being said, lets get the movement and painting and modeling out of the convo and talk straight tactics. why are why not tactically??? thank you for the responses so far.

Well, here's the thing. 6th ed has a lot more ways to ignore cover than you think.

All armies are getting to the point where they have some way of ignoring cover. Whether it's Torrent weapons, like a helldrake, barrage like cheap biovores or thunderfire cannons, or flat-out ignores-cover stuff like the Tau and Eldar have, cover simply isn't reliable.

Even when you have cover, it's worse in 6th than it was in 5th.

Your meks, that you're overpaying for (by current point standards), are huge easy targets for anything that allows sniping, which is quite a bit these days. Whether they get barrage sniped or hit with precision shots, they're going to be a focus.

But, putting all that aside, let's assume that your 5+ cover is available and operable all game. At the point-level that you're playing, your opponent will have more than enough firepower to kill you before you get in range, and your guys will be hard to position in order to bring the numbers that you need to bear. This was a common problem running a horde in 5th ed, but because you could take casualties from the back, you'd have the guys up-front keep advancing and then fill holes with other units. But in 6th, you're forced to lose casualties from the front, so all your opponent has to do is shoot the closest unit each turn and they can really stop you from getting to them.

You have nothing to force them to react to you, so anyone can simply make a rapid-fire gunline. They can bunch models up as much as they want to force you into bottlenecks.

And, this all ignores the issue of being tar-pitted by things cheaper than you. Your boyz have no grenades, so any walker can pretty much lock you down in place, with your only recourse being the PK nobs, who are also prime targets for sniping out or challenging out of any fight necessary.

Consider that against your 2000 point army, a tau player could field 72 firewarriors and 30 pathfinders (with 1000-odd points to spare), which can kill approximately 30 boyz/turn at 30", with no cover saves. Okay, that's just one unit/turn, but they can all bunch up and by continuously killing off the closest unit, you never get close enough to hit them back. If you do happen to get closer, their firepower doubles at the 15" range, and so you're not closer for long.


The game has simply shifted and left horde orks as a sub-optimal strategy. It's simply too easy to kill T4 models with no saves when the casualties always come from the front.

The one thing your list is missing is a Warboss to make it a true Green Tide. Also consider taking a Weird Boy or Two. Teleporting 31 Boyz to the other side of the board can cause some interesting fun. Green Tide is a Meat Shield for a Power Klaw delivery device. If you insist on taking Big Mek KFF consider giving them Power Klaws as well.

My opinion: KFF takes away your terrain advantage and allow your opponent to shoot the unit with the KFF. I only use KFF for protecting vehicles, it doesn't work as well as you want, for foot slogging. If my opponent doesn't panic when they see 200 boyz coming their way, I usually lose the battle. Template weapons of any type and rapid fire devastate green tide armies.

I've done the tray idea, but that's when we used very limited terrain and I wasn't trying to stay in range of a KFF. It takes a lot of practice (it help if you bring a friend or two with you) to move the army forward quickly, but it can be done and using a tray will get in your way. Another problem I've had is my opponent taking 45 minutes strategizing their move against me.

A suggestion to save on points, is if your Nob doesn't have a Power Klaw he's not really needed. If a unit goes under 8 members, I usually consider it lost, especially if your opponent is attacking you properly and eliminating one unit at a time and fleeing so limiting the number of Bosspole is a good idea as well. 'Eavy Armor is nice to have but not very useful.

Last, though in CC slugga/Choppa are nice, Shoota boyz are always a better option, especially if your opponent tries to engage you in CC, you'll be wishing for the two shots per (hitting on 5's and 6's).

How many people are bringing 70 fire warriors to a tourny though?

Deploy at and across your line, how many orcs at near max coherency would that be? And made up from how many mobs? Two? Three? What is the average damage output of the currently neckbeard approved eldar/tau netlist? Say they can delete 50-60 boys a turn, and I feel that may be overly generous unless you're seeing D, after the two(?) turns it takes you to amble through no-man's land, you're still at over half. That's over 100 boys to multi assault and dakka and krump through weight of dice. I think this is interesting.

The movement phase will suck though.

U're moving 6+d6. Or 2d6+d6. It usually takes 3-4 turns to get to the enemy doing nothing. If u're lucky. In 5 ed it was managebla cause you could get 4+ cover save from time to time and din't loose the closest ones + had reliable charges and could make 6+d6 charges. There were lots of anti-tank weaponry like lazcannons and lots of tanks overall that didn't put so much dakka. Nobs couldn't get sniped out or killed in challenges. Now there are lots of high rof weaponry that's effective at both killing vehicles and infantry, you got worse cover, it's easilly avoidable also, you can get charrecters sniped or challenged out, the closest models die so it takes longer to reach the enemy and with 2' pile ins you have much less models that can hit in mellee and charges are less reliable overall + you eat overwatch. Basically, footsloggas have become overall much worse cause u're slower, much more vulnerable, hit less hard, can loose key elements like pk nobz or characters. On the bright side, fearless no longer inflicts wounds in cc...but you won't get in cc with the horde. It's not unheard of greentides to be wiped off the board by turn 3 not reaching the enemy.

Yep, what they all said - green tide sucks man. You'll fight the edition as much as you will your opponent, and at the end of every game, honestly a dead pile a mile high compared to your opponents single dead riptide and five firewarriors is depressing stuff.

Put your boyz in wagons or trukks. You can still have heaps of them only now you can move 12-20 models just by pushing a single vehicle across the board!

If you want a Green Tide, like, a proper bloody green tide, go play Fantasy. If you insist that this tide take place in the future, Warpath has more horde friendly rules and Warpath 3.0 might even go back to unit bases making this type of build *very* viable

Hate to say it, but it's true. Orks get cut to ribbons if they go green tide, esp in games higher than 500 pts. Get a bunch of trukks, your life will be better.

Trukks are your best friend. remember that they don't explode

if you want to dash forward, that *might* draw fire away from the rest of your time, but by and large, boyz with tshirts can get removed from the board by the shovelfull

To put things in perspective, A guided Squad of Scatter Laser Warwalkers can reliably kill 15-20 boyz in the open, each round of shooting. 3 Scatter Walkers cost 210 points. Wave serpents with the cannon can kill around 6-10 a turn. They cost 145 points each. So lets say 5 serpents and 3 scatter walkers at 2000 points. With this shooting alone you will be losing 45-70 boyz a turn...and then there is the other half of his army. God help you if he takes a Vyper Squadron as well, because that will be another 10-12 dead boyz. Adding in anything else he might have in the list, and given slightly better than average rolls, I would not be shocked to see 100 boyz die in a single turn from this type of army.

Aside from 6th edition making this army suck (which might change from edition to edition), it seems like it would be boring for you. Orks have a lot of amazing models to assemble and paint, and while multi-part boys are perhaps my favorite single model of all time, 240 of them and nothing else get boring for me.

Even if you want to do a Green Tide (and hope for the best with a new rulebook or a new edition), 90 or so footslogger should seem like a tide, and then you could spend 1000 points on some other stuff. Some Lootas, bikers, Kans, Dreads, Battlewagons, whatever! Heck, Battlewagons can hold 20 guys! If you really wanted to do a load of orks (and not much else), you could take 3 battlewagons, load them up, and then take trukks with boys for the rest of the points.

It's not just the immense orkish vulnerability to shooting. You have very little mobility, no anti-air capacity, and almost nothing to deal with armor. On top of that, I really think you will get bored with the modeling, painting, and gameplay of 240 footsloggers.