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Grabbed a copy of the Marine Codex, wrote a list. I loved the old BT, so I just sort of gravitated to them, even if they've been nerfed a bit as people seem to say. Anyway, what do you guys think?

Helbrecht 180
Honour Guard (x5) 2 Relic Blades, Champion with TH, in Razorback w/TL Autocannon 245

Crusader Squad-10 Initiates, 5 Neophytes, HB 220
Crusader Squad-10 Initiates, Power Weapon, Sword Brother w/Lightning Claw, Rhino 215
Scouts-Sniper, Hellfire HB, Camo Cloaks 83

Sternguard (x10)-One of each combi-weapon (plasma, melta, flamer, grav) 270

Stormtalon-Skyhammer ML

Devastators-2 ML w/Flakk, 2 LC 160

Total 1498

Devastators are meh. Maybe drop them for another storm talon.

I confess I've never written an SM list, I just used it to pass time while it's owner was playing. I thought Stormtalons only having 2HP made them a bit of an issue. Perhaps something I could bring on as a reserve to make it an escort?

My BT list is troop heavy, and I just got two dev. squads with 2 heavey bolters each and then 2 las/ 2 plas divied up. Mostly play against SW, would recommend an Emp. Champ (does better than 4th champ for me). Like the Helbrecht squad, but personally never really use him much except for fluff lists. Would recommend a drop pod or two for the sake of not footslogging everything. Maybe replace your 10 man tac with sword brother for a VV squad, better than tac a bit, plus more CC options.

I read the EC, the forced stance and 2 attacks seemed very meh for 140pts. I was thinking of Helbrecht in Drop Pod, maybe the sternguard in the other. Wasn't sure that VV would help, losing troops that are already short in supply, and the Jump Packs will only cost more.

True, haven't run sternguard before/ forgot they were there. I run a 10 man VV no jump with 3 Pwr Swords and a Pwr fist and they're pretty good footslogging. EC isn't the best, but the choice for STR 6 (though swing last) or insta kill on a 6 is nice, especially with a master crafted AP2 weapon. Never used Scouts before, but so long as your not playing a SM army they will be effective (my brother's SW scout snipers have only gotten two kills in the four games we played with them in it, don't provide much in pinning either against me so far). Not sure how effective a storm talon is either, never used it, but I'm sure it would be good for providing fire for a deepstrike or foot sloggers. Other than that I think an addition of a drop pod or two would help.

So in short, swap the Crusaders in Rhino for VV in Drop Pod. I confess the scouts are for obj holding only, sneaking onto one. Might use the Stormtalon to escort with the Drop Pod that comes on second (if it's allowed). Thanks for the help

Pretty much, yeah. You could also swap the neophytes for a scout squad for obj. holding. If you get the right roll for the reserves, you can. You're welcome.

That's true, could outflank them with bolters

Devs are bad in general. Devs with ML are super terrible.

Like I said, never written an SM list, just thought that it's a safer anti-flyer mechanism that could do some other stuff. What would you recommend then?

If you want dedicated anti-flyer, you either take the AA tank with the quad gun or an aegis defence line.


or 2 stormtalons.

It wasn't dedicated. Just an all-round firepower unit. In all honesty, I wanted to get boots on the ground for one, and to get some all-round shooting, which the Stalker and Hunter don't offer, and the Stormtalon has a risk of being slow to arrive or just shot down

Stormtalons also tear up ground targets. And can't be first struck by lists with drop pods.

I didn't think of that. We don't play drop pod lists a lot, but it would help, plus it's a back up if I chose to escort