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I'm closing in on a deal for a starter Tyranid army + Codex. and I forgot to solicit feedback on the most important thing:

Is the Tyranid codex fun to play?

FenrisianStuart21 wrote:
^^ agreed. Flyrants are your bread and butter. I've recently started Nids myself and have had nothing but a blast playing them. He's right, they either do awesome, miraculous things or fail miserably. Ex. In one game I outflanked a unit of 30 termaguants. In my opponents turn he killed te Flyrant that was their synapse. On my turn they failed their synapse check and ran off the board. Very next game they came in the board and the Flyrant again got killed, except this time they passed 4 LD6 synapse checks and 2 break checks from shooting to hold a 4 point objective which won me the game.


They are tons of fun to play but sometimes they will let you down. If you can handle that you should thoroughly enjoy playing with them.

Oh yeah...to be honest, the main reason I'm looking into this deal is cause IMO the models are cool and look fun to paint! I mainly play necrons so I am used to having key dice rolls fail and lose me the game


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AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Depends on your idea of fun. The codex is so damned unbalanced if you had a particular vision for your army, there's a good chance it sucks. Wanted a Tyrant that's not flying? sucks. Wanted a Lictor? sucks. Wanted some Raveners? super sucks. Warriors? suck. Rippers? suck.

My vision for the army is the models the guy has offered me in trade . I suppose if this is an effective list of the weakest options, then there's only 1 in the bunch I'm looking at.

 jifel wrote:
What models is he offering?

I'm honestly not sure what category these models fall under (HQ, FA, HS, etc), so if this is organized bad, my apologies:

1 x Broodlord
1 x Lictor
1 x Tyranofex/Tervigon
1 x Mawloc/Trygon
1 x Hive Tyrant (not assembled so I'm assuming I can turn this into a Flyrant)
8 x Genestealers
19 x Termigants
11 x Hormogaunts

FenrisianStuart21 wrote:
That's actually not a bad start because you get some good MC and a Flying Hive tyrant. You definitely need to invest in more Guants though. It's almost impossible to play Nids without them. Your Tervigon can actually spawn Guants and if you don't have the models then they are auto-destroyed.

Overall, not a bad start.

Cool...I got the same advice from over at the Army Lists forum.

I don't want to spend much more money on the army (at least right away), but part of the plan would be to score a bunch of gaunts.

When it comes to Troops, you guys are lucky! The retail on them is cheap relative to most other armies, which hopefully means that they could be found on ebay for "actually" (vs. relatively) cheap.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Double check the Tyrant is a plastic one, the metal and finecast ones prior to the plastic ones don't come with wings to make them flying.

Can you tell by looking? I'm calling the guy this afternoon, so I'll ask.

P.S. the guy says he has all of the kit from the original box to complete the model out.

 eskimo wrote:
Feel proud you don't have crutches like Quad Guns and ADLs.

Oh hell no. If this deal goes through, I'll eventually pick up one of these puppies, or convert something similar.

Unless, of course, the Codex prohibits you from brining fortifications...in which case I will ignore that rule, and eventually pick up one of these puppies, or convert something similar.

 Arrias117 wrote:

 eskimo wrote:

Paint Nids, play Nids, have fun!

+1 for that! This is how you know if you'll enjoy Tyranids. If that line warms your toxin sacs you'll do just fine.

Yep. I love the Tyranid models, love the fact that they seem very open-ended to paint color-scheme-wise, and I always try to and so far have had fun, whether its 500 or 5000 points, and whether my army is outclassed or not.


Correction: I have always had fun against everything but IG (or whatever GI Joe is called nowadays).

 SHUPPET wrote:
Further still is the fact that dataslates exist. Not only do they cost more than actually just buying an iPad to bring the pirated .pdfs along to games, but they are also important to making your army strong. They ignore FOC , and give some really good bonuses, at the cost of taking something crap. It sucks spending points on crap like harpies and warriors just because of how awesome a T6 MC with a twin linked S7 AP2 large blast that no longer takes up one of your vital HS slots anymore is. Might be strong, but not fun.

This is actually my biggest concern. My local meta does not respect rules from Dataslates, and to be quite honest, I agree with the consensus.

 SHUPPET wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:

 SHUPPET wrote:
Further still is the fact that dataslates exist. Not only do they cost more than actually just buying an iPad to bring the pirated .pdfs along to games, but they are also important to making your army strong. They ignore FOC , and give some really good bonuses, at the cost of taking something crap. It sucks spending points on crap like harpies and warriors just because of how awesome a T6 MC with a twin linked S7 AP2 large blast that no longer takes up one of your vital HS slots anymore is. Might be strong, but not fun.

This is actually my biggest concern. My local meta does not respect rules from Dataslates, and to be quite honest, I agree with the consensus.

In that case, I'd probably advise against it. You are very low on options for builds without dataslates, they aren't all very good but at least give you playable options other than "build best army to lumber across the board" and "build best army to keep up with Flyrants".

How does your local feel about allies?

I could force the issue...like, if you wanna play against my Nids, I built them around this particular dataslate, which I insist on using. If you don't like it, I'm happy to play a game with my Necrons.

As for Allies, its the reverse. My local meta likes playing with them. I think its cheese, so I don't do it anymore...it doesn't really bother me to the extent that I won't play a game or anything, but I just don't like it.

Trigger has been pulled. Come this Saturday, I'll be part of the Hive.

Thanks for all the feedback!

Davor wrote:
What is your play style? Do you like shooty or assaulty armies? Are you a hoardy or few elite player? Maybe a combination of all of the above?

Do you need to win? Do you play for fun? Do you plan on going to tournaments and want to win?

Also what edition of the codex is? Is it the hard cover 6th edition codex, or a soft cover previous edition? Make sure there.

*edit* Hit the reply button too soon. Looks like you bought it. My questions are still valid so when you want to continue making your fleet bigger.

Yeah man. The trade deal is done, but I'll resurrect this post if I ever get to buying stuff.

Just FYI, I mainly play Necrons, and I want to get into something different for flavors sake. This deal kinda landed on me without me looking for it. I always liked Tyranids just or the models. I don't need to win, but of course I prefer winning. I play mostly for fun in a pretty competitve environment list-wise, but I do not play tournaments, and don't have any interest in doing so (this is not anti- "tournament players" rant, its just not my cup of tea). I'll be getting 6th Edition version of the Tyranid Codex.


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Davor wrote:
The Tyranid Swarm box is awesome. You basically get the gargoyles and carnifex for free.

Yup...I'm thinking that when I can afford it, this seems like the most cost-effective way to beef up my troop choices and add a little something else to boot.

<deleted for redundancy>

 -Loki- wrote:
Something to remember is competitiveness is based on your local meta, and a meta changes by location.

The only thing I absolutely need to know right know in my local Escalation/Strongholds Meta is I need access to Haywire. Once I have it, and hopefully can put it where I want it, I am golden. From the bits and pieces I've read (today, actually ), I've gathered there is access, and pretty broad access.

davethepak wrote:
Hope the OP enjoys the nids!

I play both nids and necrons (go xenos!) and can say they do indeed offer very different play experiences.

As stated the new big nid box is indeed a good deal.

The Codex
I love my bugs, they are a ton of fun. While to not rehash the topic that has been beat to death, the new book is strong it just has a lot of issues and failed to address many concerns carried over from the last book.
Mainly to many experienced players it feels rushed, not thought out and dull (yes,these are subjective terms....hence the phrase "to many...").

Regarding the data slates.
You can play without them just fine. However, while many of them are pretty underwhelming, there are a few useful ones. Ask your friends if you can use them, considering they ARE your allies.

Models
As others pointed out magnets are your friends, especially on the big bugs.
All of my big bugs with arms have them magnitized to change weapons (talons or devourers, etc.) and any of my MC's that are dual kits (harpy/crone, trygon/mawloc, etc) are magnitized to be either one.
Do you NEED to do this? No, of course not. I just like the ability to run multiple variations without having to assemble, paint, and STORE a ton of extra models.
I don't bother to magnetize cheap/small models like termagant however.

Overall nids are a ton of fun, and while the book does not support as many diverse builds as other recent codexes, there are still a few options in there for a lot of players (well, some units are auto-include, but oh well...).

Have fun and munch as many space marines as possible!!!!

Very kind and illuminating!

For what its worth, my main source of fun hobby-wise has been taking all the extra kits and bashing it together again with necrons. You can do it really good with troops (a Necron Warrior can be turned into any kind of Immortal, Deathmark, Cryptek, etc. with the right bits. The vehicles, however, have such precision curves and lines that its more difficult to fabricate and convert stuff.

With Tyranids, it seems like everything's a xenomorph of one size or another , so maybe lots of kit bashing opportunities???

davethepak wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
Something to remember is competitiveness is based on your local meta, and a meta changes by location.

The only thing I absolutely need to know right know in my local Escalation/Strongholds Meta is I need access to Haywire. Once I have it, and hopefully can put it where I want it, I am golden. From the bits and pieces I've read (today, actually ), I've gathered there is access, and pretty broad access.

The haywire options are;

A thorax template weapon that has haywire - a few MC's can buy it.
Haywire bio-missiles on the crone. Only B3 vs ground targets, but not bad.
A haywire short ranged blast on the hive guard.

There may be something I am forgetting.

I try to put the haywire (thorax weapon called electroshock grubs) on my flying MC's and my tyrannofex.

This is most useful, thank you!

I like the word "respawn"

 -Loki- wrote:

 Kain wrote:
Tyranid GCs beside the Harridan need serious buffs though, D-strength weapons make them way too vulnerable, and the Heirodule in particular has a rubbish raw statline (scythed heirodules should not get punched out by build a beat stick Raukaan chapter masters or Lysander).

The problem isn't really the Gargantuan Creatures, it's D strength weapons. They need to be toned down against Gargantuans. That alone will make them much more viable. As it is, facing a single D weapon is going to make you worry but not decide to leave a Heirophant at home. It's when you face an army bringing multiple D weapons to the table when you might as well just not take them.

Though I'll admit the Heirodules could use a little beefing up. They're not much tougher than the new big monstrous creatures, so not really worthy of being classed as Gargantuan.

D Stregth Weapons, in my experience, are only scary against armor facing units and multiple-wound units. Against ants (signle-wound units), the worst thing that could happen is 1 hit = 1 unsaveable wound.

That's not so bad....Big Power Fists can only kill so much.....

 SHUPPET wrote:
Or how about giving all your guys +2 to their cover save the whole way across the board?.

How exactly is this done?

Aha...Venomthropes?

So I got the nids and the Codex and the paints and stuff.

I cant decide fo the life of me which way to go with the Tyranofex/Tervigon kit. The popular consensus on these forums seems to be that the Tervigon was nerferd too bad and costs too much to be a desireable option.

However, coming from someone who has never read a letter of the last codex, after reading through the new Codex, the Tervigon options seems vastly more fun than the Tyranofex option. In fact, when I read the Tervigon rules, I thought, THIS is the type of army I want to play.

I mean pooping 3D6 models onto the battlefield every turn is crazy...is there any other Codex that can do that??? (Canoptek Spyders, by contrast, poop out ONE scarab per round, and Ghost Arks poop out D3 Warriors up to the original troop size....and I thought THAT was cool)

To me, parking a Tervigon with Regen in the backfield on top of an objective behind Cover, and maybe even behind an Aegis Defense line wth a Venomthrope (2+ Cover Save, right?), and pumping out nasty little Termigaunts seems alot funner than a high strength gun that shoots 2 shots a round. It even seems to me to be the better tactical choice, even with the big Synapse Backfire and the chance to flicker out with doubles.

Of course, I'd rather have both! Maybe 1 day.

Am I horribly wrong here? Are Tyranofexes just an obvious better choice here?

Also, if someone could please advise, I'm really not sure WTF to find the dataslates on the GW website. Are they the 14.99 a pop downloads? If so, that is completely off the hook BS. The Helbrute dataslate for CSM is only like 5 bucks (and of course all this DLC should be FREE as an incentive for poeple to buy ACTUAL product).

Anyway, advice would be welcome, if you are so inclined.

BeeCee wrote:
Hey there, thought i would chime in.

I have had luck running 1 Tervigon. Are they WAY more expensive than they were? Yes! But ultimately they are a T6 6W scoring MC. I like them as a synapse anchor as well.

If you are so inclined you can always magnetize the kit so you can have the best of both worlds. If that isn't something you are inclined to do just put the kit together without the head, spawning sac and gun arms on there and try a few games with it each way. One tip though- When you are gluning the middle support legs make sure you don't have them too far spread out that they don't fit on the base very well.

Welcome to Tyranids, where even if you get frustrated by how you are doing on the table, the models will always draw you back.

Thanks! I thought about magnetizing, but I don't see how it would be done. Like the Rupture Cannon glues together to form 1 piece...if you are slightly off with the arm socket distances, isn't it a no go. Also, HTF would you magnetize the spawning sac? I should check out youtube I guess. Perhaps when I examine the kit a little closer it would also become clear.

The Tervigon model is IMO probably the coolest model in the line, which will probably seal the deal for me. The Tyranofex build seems like "OK, what else could we make out of this kit?...I know, lets ditch the egg sac and give it a big gun!!!" to me.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
Also, if someone could please advise, I'm really not sure WTF to find the dataslates on the GW website. Are they the 14.99 a pop downloads? If so, that is completely off the hook BS. The Helbrute dataslate for CSM is only like 5 bucks (and of course all this DLC should be FREE as an incentive for poeple to buy ACTUAL product).

Anyway, advice would be welcome, if you are so inclined.

Yeah, the dataslates are all $15 each

http://www.blacklibrary.com/games-workshop-digital-editions/Tyranid-Vanguard.html
http://www.blacklibrary.com/games-workshop-digital-editions/Dataslate-Tyranid-Invasion.html
http://www.blacklibrary.com/games-workshop-digital-editions/Dataslate-Tyranid-Onslaught.html

Though if you just google something like "dataslate rumours" you can find what each of them contains and (probably) all the rules that go along with them.

Yup for that. However, DLC is kind of a wierd situation in my meta. Most everyone does not like it, some people flat out refuse to play against it, and I think everyone would refuse to play against it unless I could give them a printout. So the "DLC peace treaty" is generally, if you insist on playing those BS rules, you can as long as you have the printout. I have no idea which one is the best, and I don't think any of them are worth paying $1 for, so if I end up going that route, I'll do it grudgingly, and hopefully I can find out through research which of them is the best for the direction I want to take the army, once that is decided.

Thanks AllSeeingSkink, for real. You have single-handedly de-mystified the Tyranid DLC issue for me


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 djm55 wrote:
As for magnetization, there are a number of youtube videos on it. In practice it is actually very easy. The tops of the belly sac slots into the body of the main model in such a way that only a couple magnets on the bottom of the sac to hold it together works brilliantly. All the scything talons, claws, etc. are cake too with 3-4 mm magnets. The guns on the Tyrannofex (either the Rupture cannon or the Acid Spray) are actually pretty easy too. The main reason being that the tubes that connect to the gun normally can sit on the very front of the base, thus not mattering much that the weapon slouches in the front. Additionally, with some creative basing, you can always provide a stand incorporated into the base for them.

Awesome. If I can see it done once on youtube, I'm golden.

 djm55 wrote:
Most important I think is to have fun with whatever army you run with. If you want to win every time and be a competitive gamer, then Nids aren't for you because there are only a couple builds that have any hope of beating the current top tier netlists. However, if you want to drown the board in endless Guants, bring more MCs than people thought possible, and have endless conversion opportunties, well my friend you have found your home in the Hive!

Cheers!

Yup, I always have fun (or try to), whether my army is outclassed or not. Fortunately in my meta, the Space Faeries and Robotech Hippos are pretty rare to see.

I am asmuch into the hobby aspect of the game, if not moreso, than the game itself.

Not sure if it comes through in my posts, but I'm at about pee-your-pants level of looking forward to modeling and painting these guys. These models are, quite simply, badass...for looks alone, but especially since eveything of the same size seems to fit everthing else of the same size. From a modeling perspective, this seems like an incredibly well thought-out and executed product line. I wasn't even looking to start out Nids! I was originally looking for a trade for some more CSM stuff. But I'm glad this deal found me!

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Yeah if you google them you can find out what's in them. There's only a few sentences of rules in each one, so you can pretty easily find the rules. All you need to know is what each formation consists of and then what special rule the formation gets (which is typically only a sentence to a paragraph for each formation). Hell, if you find the tyranid dataslate rumour thread in the news and rumours section of this site, you can probably piece together all the rules from the dataslates and then if you want just buy the one you need (or *coughs* pirate them... not something I normally condone... but I have no real issue with people pirating a $15 book for the sake of a couple of paragraphs of rules ).

I checked out reviews for these dataslates. All in all it seems like the only good ones are intended to sell FMCs (LOTS of FMCs, ka-ching $$$), a buncha of Biovores and Exocrines, and lots and lots and lots of gants.

I'm a couple units shy of some meh formations with the Carnifexes. Didn't see anything that inspired me to spend hundreds of dollars on the required models.