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I'm just working on my AM list and am debating the best size blob to go for. I was initially going to go for a max-sized fifty man blob with five lascannons, coteaz, and a priest as the backbone of my army, but I'm wondering if that might be overkill. That's forty lasguns base and five lascannons firing with divination psyker support, fearless and hatred.

My other troop would be two barebones meltavets squads in chimeras.

What would you consider the optimum sized infantry blob to be in your list? I'd really like to hear how everyone else is using them.

I think it depends on how much you buff them. The more buffs you put in the more the 50 are worth it.

I don't think we've quite figured this out, yet.

The buff thing mentioned is applicable, but it also matters how many infantry models you're bringing as well. Having 6 squads of 50 infantry is good, but having 2 squads of 50 is less so - they should probably be broken up to get some of the advantages of multiple units back in there.

It's also going to depend on your enemy's killing power. For example I played a game with a SoB army against a Khan + CM + bike command squad deathstar where his death star was wiping out one of my units each turn. Luckily I had 10-12 units. St. Celestine wiped out everything of his but one drop pod unit and the deathstar single handedly working up the other side the board.

In this situation, if you're playing against a guy who can wipe out 20 guardsmen at a time with his massive murder unit, having squads of 10 is great. If you're fighting an opponent with many small squads, each capable of taking out 4-5 guys at once, making the many small squads of 10 fearless is a lot harder than making a few large blobs fearless. This will depend in part on your local meta.

But keep in mind that with infantry platoons you don't really have to choose between large blobs and small squads. You can buy up to 3 special weapons squads with sniper rifles for 36 points each, which gives you small scoring units that can hide in the back. You can also take your 50 guys in 5 squads and still buy a full conscript blob.

I'm thinking, if you expect your blob to kill things, take the infantry squad blob. If you just want them to be ablative wounds and bubblewrap things, conscripts are cheaper and you weren't really counting on them to do anything other than die gloriously for the Emperor!

themadlbb wrote:
I'm just working on my AM list and am debating the best size blob to go for. I was initially going to go for a max-sized fifty man blob with five lascannons, coteaz, and a priest as the backbone of my army, but I'm wondering if that might be overkill. That's forty lasguns base and five lascannons firing with divination psyker support, fearless and hatred.

My other troop would be two barebones meltavets squads in chimeras.

What would you consider the optimum sized infantry blob to be in your list? I'd really like to hear how everyone else is using them.

I ended up deciding to go with a 40 and a 30 man blob squad setup and its been tremendously successful to date. I also use Lascannons in mine, as well as Power Axes.

Blobs are NOT a good idea against Daemon Flying Circus's I found out. Its the only list that's beaten my current IG list thus far. But I am VERY happy with the blob sizes.

I agree with Mavnus. Having opponents overkilling smaller units is a large advantage. Furthermore, having smaller units leads to easier zoning of the opponent and more flexibility of capturing objectives.

However, having more units than orders is a downside. So having roughly the same amount of squads as orders can be good. Larger squads are also good in kill point scenarios.

I'd try and avoid the 50-man buffed-to-the-max 'deathstars' and go for an attempt at MBU. Multiple Big Units. It works on the same principles as MSU (target overload, damage mitigation, manoeuvrability, flexibility) but you're talking in units of 30 guys.

I've always found 30 to be the sweet spot for blobs, as it's not as easy to get them bogged down in/around terrain, you still get a good return on Orders and other buffs, and you can far more easily fit 3-4 30-man units into a list, all of equal value. A 50-man blobstar is less likely to have more in the way of supporting infantry thanks to its size and cost.

Here's a list I drew up in the AM tactics thread that illustrates this principle:

 Paradigm wrote:


Foot Guard, 1500:

HQ:

CCS, Carapace, Lascannon: 90

Priest x3: 75

Primaris: 50
Primaris: 50

Troops

Platoon 1:
PCS, 4 Flamers: 50

PIS, melta: 60
PIS, melta: 60
PIS, melta: 60

40 Conscripts: 120

SWS, 3x Sniper: 36
SWS, 3x Sniper: 36


Platoon 2:
PCS, 4 Flamers: 50
Commissar

PIS, Lascannon: 70
PIS, Lascannon: 70
PIS, Lascannon: 70

40 Conscripts: 120

SWS, 3x Sniper: 36
SWS, 3x Sniper: 36


Veterans, Carapace, 3x Plasma: 115

Veterans, Carapace, 3x Plasma: 115

ADL, Quad Gun: 100
1494



The general plan:
The Commissar attached to the Lascannon blob. which sit behind the ADL with the Veterans. The Conscripts move up side-by-side, in front on the Melta blob, with priests attached to each. The SWS move up on the flanks for vantage points or hide as needed. Psykers go in the Lascannon and Melta blobs.

It's not as many bodies as some lists throw down, but every unit is capable of doing damage, while none are a pivotal enough to scream ''shoot me!'. Small and big units give a balance between target overload and return on buffs.

50 blokes with azrael and a priest, primaris psykers to suit is still a very valid tactic.

Why do you run SWS with snipers, Paradigm? is it because it's so cheap? You don't seem to need SWS for vendettas or anything

The Sniper SWS were actually the product of another discussion in the AM general tactics thread, about how 36 points gets you a cheap, easily hidden, and potentially dangerous scoring unit. The idea is, you mix them in among the back lines or on the flanks and then the enemy is faced with a choice: Hit the blobs and leave half a dozen (SWS+PCS) small scoring units untouched, or hit the small units and leave the blobs to advance. Essentially, it adds an MSU scoring element to this list while keeping the blobs intact.

Also, less relevant here, it also give you the option to simply flood the board with scoring small units. At 1500 you have a minimum of 12, 4 of them 30 men or larger, or If you split everything, you can have separate 16 scoring units, more than a lot of armies can deal with within 6 turns.

 Paradigm wrote:
The Sniper SWS were actually the product of another discussion in the AM general tactics thread, about how 36 points gets you a cheap, easily hidden, and potentially dangerous scoring unit. The idea is, you mix them in among the back lines or on the flanks and then the enemy is faced with a choice: Hit the blobs and leave half a dozen (SWS+PCS) small scoring units untouched, or hit the small units and leave the blobs to advance. Essentially, it adds an MSU scoring element to this list while keeping the blobs intact.

Also, less relevant here, it also give you the option to simply flood the board with scoring small units. At 1500 you have a minimum of 12, 4 of them 30 men or larger, or If you split everything, you can have separate 16 scoring units, more than a lot of armies can deal with within 6 turns.

Interesting. I like the idea - I have 2 squads of 5 ratlings as irritants in my list, I'd never considered having SWS (mostly since my list is veterans only) but if I were running platoons, I'd definitely do this.

So I played a tournament yesterday and kept this question in mind, even though I had to use the old codex. I took 3 Leman Russ tanks, 2 40-man platoons, 2 Inquisitors, and some stormtroopers. I usually had one platoon blobbed and one split into 4 squads. I think in the future, I'd rather have 3 30 man platoons, or one 50 and one 30, so I could get 3 30 man blobs or a 30-20-30 setup. The two 40-man option didn't feel flexible enough in missions. I either had one center of power and a bunch of small units or two centers of power. I would have liked the chance to get three tougher units.

Other thoughts:

I think in the fuure I'd really like to use 2 level 2 Primaris Psykers over the two Inquisitors. The Primaris aren't as tough, don't have Ld 10 stubborn, and don't have the cool force multiplying wargear options, but the extra powers are more useful, I think. The Inquisitors are probably better for big deathstar-like blobs. For the 20-30 man blobs, the flexibility of the extra power is better, I think. Maybe 1 and 1, so I can keep servo skulls.

Ive tried using the bigger blobs but I usually find myself staying at about 30.

Its less guys and isnt to big of a foot print. Specialized armies like marines and what not can have a small force drop in and take of not even a quarter of the area and still knock out a good chunk of the blob and then because the blob is so large it would be rather difficult to get other units over to help deal with the target. But guard has never been great at being a fast reaction force.

In a game I played about a week ago I tried using creed again and then used 2 platoons, each platoon had 2 squads of 20 man blobs or technically 18 because the heavy weapons count as 1 model. It worked very well as there was plenty of scoring units.

As paradigm said mixing in the small scoring units makes it difficult for your opponent to focus on the larger 18man squads. I would put a 18man squad right behind the line, then put a PCS behind that unit, then another 18man squad behind the PCS. I had both platoons liked that stacked next 2 each other so it was like 2 18 man squads upfront then both PCS's then 2 more 18 man squads and the CCS was in the rear as Creed got the trait to give him 18" orders which was wonderful.

I also use blobs of 30 troops, I'm thinking of this edition putting Lascannons on the Infantry squad blobs, and rushing forward with a cheap unit 30 Conscripts w/ priest for each platoon.