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Hi guys
I am in real need of advice here…
I am playing this weekend for my first big tournament and the first round has just been annouced.
I am going to face the following list :
- Sorcerer lvl 2
- 2*10 cultists
- 3 helldrakes
- LoC (lvl 3)
- DP (lvl 3, wings, armor)
- 10 pink horrors
- 10 slaaneesh deamons
- 8 screamers

My list is a kind of alpha strike GK/WS list with
- Coteaz
- 2 * 3 henchmen in rhino
- 3 DK with teleporter and heavy incinerator
- Chapter master on bike (with usual shield…)
- 2 * 5 bikes with 2 grav and combi grav
- 4 bikes with 2 meltaguns
- Thunderfire
- Ironclad (heavy flamer, melta, 2 missiles) in pod

So obviously I don’t like the 3 helldrakes. Furthermore my opponent is a very good player while I must admit I am not used at all to very competitive play…
I am now wondering how to play it, if I go normal way (everything on the table except for henchmen, ironclad and Coteaz), I might hurt him on T1 but then I risk being wiped off the table in a few turns.
So I was wondering if you had any tips (I thought about leaving a lot of bikes in reserve to keep some troops alive as long as possible while I focus his).
Or does anyone have good tips on how to use my mobility to limit the effectiveness of his helldrakes (I don’t play a lot with flyers in my club, one, two at most usually)

Thanks a lot guys


Automatically Appended Next Post:
noone has any good advice?

Are you stuck with this list? Or can you change it to include some kind of air defense?

I've got a feeling his list is locked since he knows what he's up against.

You literally have 0 anti air. Spread your bikes out, they look to be your only twinlinked shooting, and have them take pot shots at the rear of the drake and hope for glances.

Tripling up on Heavy Incinerators really limits your shooting on the Dreadknights as well

If you can get to his deployment zone before the drakes come in you make it somewhat more difficult for him to target you effectively, though drakes mitigate this compared to other fliers since the bale flamer has a 360 degree arc. If you win the roll off I'd go first. You have a really good chance to get a 2nd turn charge, thus hiding your bikes from the drakes before they come on. Just focus on killing his troops. 3 shunting DK's with incinerators should do this nicely.

yeah as this is a tournament i am stuck with the list.
To give more information the scenario is with 5 objectives (each worth 3pts) and with HS scoring (so my thunderfire and 3 DK and his DP).
Deployment will be in table quarters (5th Edition mode).

I think this might just give me a chance with the scoring DKs.

His drakes won't do much to your DK, focus on secondary objectives, FB/STW/LB and take objectives with DK, or if he has a lot in reserves try to table him.

He doesn't have a lot in the way of troops. Shunt up the DKs and flame all his troops. Just put the hurt on his troops and you should be alright.

your going to have to ignore them. Try to work invulns and get bikers into ruins or boosting to milk that 4++ if it looks like they are going to be flamed next turn.

Dont waste shots trying to glance something with IWND and a 5++. Hammer the troops and grab first blood + line breaker (shunting should make that a breeze).

Reserve as many bikes as is feasable. (Turns on the board) = (turns marines die in droves). Race out on T4-5 if possible to contest/cap. Drakes are designed to waste 3+ armies, and bikes are 3+ with even fewer models, so you are best served by NOT letting him shoot you with those things as much as possible. As a fun experiment, go watch battle reports for what happens to bike list the turn a single Heldrake enters play. Joking aside, go watch a few of these, it'll basically provide evidence for all the claims I'm making here.

Next tourney, find 100pts for some AA; a quad gun, firestorm, even a psyfleman or two would work. You'd struggle with Necron airforce, flying circus of either type, or any flyer based list.

Finally, he has 5 flyers, a unit of jetbikes, and a ML2 IC. You have no AA. You are going to lose. It's not a knock on your skill, but this isn't a zero sum game, and you aren't in a position to damage ~80% of his points. Avoid any conflict, play like an Eldar Seerstar list. Wreck what you can hit, spend all game not getting shot, then run out in the last few turns to grab what you can then hold on and try to survive.

a couple heldrakes are just a drop in the bucket compared to the other shenanigans at tournaments these days...

Kill everything on the table and watch as his heldrakes do nothing to your scoring DK and chapter master.

yeah a couple helldrakes are not the most competitive build around, i know but given my list and with 2 other FMC, they are a difficult match up (i think i would even prefer OVesa Star as if i can get in in CC with the DKs, they will get hurt a lot!!!)

Here i think i will reserve Coteaz and the henchmen in rhinos as well as the 2 big biker squads and only put on the table the 3 DKs, the thunderfire and the CM with melta bikes.
The Ironclad will arrive T1 anyway.
Thus the aim will be to kill as much as possible T1 (screamers, troops, bastion) and then keep killing the troops that arrive when they arrive and last till the end with my scoring DKs.