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I'm looking to start a Cyriss army with Iron Mother as my Warcaster.
Any advice, units to avoid or get? Styles of play? Anything else?
I'm looking at Iron Mother and Clockwork angels, but what else should I be looking at?

(Relatively new to Cyriss too, and I don't have Mom, so theorycrafting here)

Iron Mother wants stuff that can shoot. She's tied for highest base RAT in faction (with Syntherion) and also has the lowest base MAT in faction. Her feat really enables a good turn of shooting, or of melee. I think people recommend assimilators, Monitors, and maybe the Prime Axiom, as well as standard stuff (Corollary, Diffuser) for her vectors. If you're not taking PA or Attunement Servitors, you should also probably take a Cipher for flare.

Infantry-wise, her support is Tactical supremacy and the damage buff from her servitors. Angels are a nice skirmish force, but I might also want something that can keep your guns from getting engaged, like Reciprocators or something. This seems a lot more up to taste and to complement the rest of the list.

If you're only running Iron Mother, you don't need an ADO (Algorithmic Dispersion Optifex) 'cause of her Field Marshal, but he's useful for everyone else in faction (except maybe Axis). OD (Optifex directive) are good, and solve the magical weapon problem.

Overall, I see Iron Mother as being great against stuff like Cryx: assimilator ground pounder and arced shrapnel swarm do wonders against Banes, and Monitors shoot Tartarus. The same stuff makes her good against other dudespam armies. I'm unsure as to whether her servitor damage buff makes her list capable enough against armor, especially with her sub-par MAT outside of feat turn. You'll have to find that out through play.

I would advise against starting with Cyriss.

1) As 1-off release, They're not getting expansions in future anthology books, other players will have fun new toys to look forward to every year. You won't.
2) They're still kind of new and so it is still something of a wild-west in terms of their meta. There is probably little in the way of truly reliable guidance people can give you.
3) They're a bit more fiddly and interactive than other factions and will be hard adjustment coming from other games.
4) See point #1.
5) The lineup is almost entirely plastic. This may sound like a good thing coming from other games but trust me - PP Plastics are garbage. Having metal alternatives is a must for the WM/H lineup imo.
6) See Point #1.

 Chongara wrote:
I would advise against starting with Cyriss.

1) As 1-off release, They're not getting expansions in future anthology books, other players will have fun new toys to look forward to every year. You won't.
2) They're still kind of new and so it is still something of a wild-west in terms of their meta. There is probably little in the way of truly reliable guidance people can give you.
3) They're a bit more fiddly and interactive than other factions and will be hard adjustment coming from other games.
4) See point #1.
5) The lineup is almost entirely plastic. This may sound like a good thing coming from other games but trust me - PP Plastics are garbage. Having metal alternatives is a must for the WM/H lineup imo.
6) See Point #1.

Plastic? I just bought a metal Iron Mother and clockwork angels today.

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Chongara wrote:
I would advise against starting with Cyriss.

1) As 1-off release, They're not getting expansions in future anthology books, other players will have fun new toys to look forward to every year. You won't.
2) They're still kind of new and so it is still something of a wild-west in terms of their meta. There is probably little in the way of truly reliable guidance people can give you.
3) They're a bit more fiddly and interactive than other factions and will be hard adjustment coming from other games.
4) See point #1.
5) The lineup is almost entirely plastic. This may sound like a good thing coming from other games but trust me - PP Plastics are garbage. Having metal alternatives is a must for the WM/H lineup imo.
6) See Point #1.

Plastic? I just bought a metal Iron Mother and clockwork angels today.

Obviously you didn't notice that every main Warjack and unit is in plastic.

Also, I would personally add the factions heavy contrast to the Ik setting and inferior sculpts to the above list

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Chongara wrote:
I would advise against starting with Cyriss.

1) As 1-off release, They're not getting expansions in future anthology books, other players will have fun new toys to look forward to every year. You won't.
2) They're still kind of new and so it is still something of a wild-west in terms of their meta. There is probably little in the way of truly reliable guidance people can give you.
3) They're a bit more fiddly and interactive than other factions and will be hard adjustment coming from other games.
4) See point #1.
5) The lineup is almost entirely plastic. This may sound like a good thing coming from other games but trust me - PP Plastics are garbage. Having metal alternatives is a must for the WM/H lineup imo.
6) See Point #1.

Plastic? I just bought a metal Iron Mother and clockwork angels today.

Casters, and I think solos are in metal due to economics of scale around those kind of things. Every mainline fighting model in the army is plastic though. The Cyriss Kits in particular are notorious for being of poor quality, even by the standard of PP plastics. It's been a very serious problem for the company, so much so they've been looking to hire new staff to deal with QA and their overseas production partners.

Those changes haven't really permeated through the lineup yet though, and it's probably going to be a good year or two before anything stands a chance of being ready for prime time. PP does a lot of things brilliantly. Sadly the production quality of the plastics is far from one of them.

At any rate, if you've got your heart set and have already bought in your best bet for solid Cyriss advice is probably the the PP forums. The faction is just too new for the good tech to have permeated out to tertiary sources like Dakka.

I haven't had any issues with their plastic models. My friend and I just put together some infantry units and we did not have a single issue. In fact we were having some problems assembling
the metal miniatures whereas the plastic ones went together really well. The metal models has nicer fine details and it seems
like they have less lines to trim but that's hardly a reason to deter a new player from playing the faction that they want.

 sing your life wrote:


Obviously you didn't notice that every main Warjack and unit is in plastic.

Also, I would personally add the factions heavy contrast to the Ik setting and inferior sculpts to the above list

Still tilting at that windmill I see....?

You've been told multiple times why CoC fit into the IK, not least to mention that they've been an integral part of it since the D20 RPG over a decade ago. Don't make statements like that that are based on your own personal aesthetics (we get it, you don't like the CoC line) and not the actual facts based on the imagery presented within the setting.

 Chongara wrote:

Casters, and I think solos are in metal due to economics of scale around those kind of things. Every mainline fighting model in the army is plastic though. The Cyriss Kits in particular are notorious for being of poor quality, even by the standard of PP plastics. It's been a very serious problem for the company, so much so they've been looking to hire new staff to deal with QA and their overseas production partners.

Those changes haven't really permeated through the lineup yet though, and it's probably going to be a good year or two before anything stands a chance of being ready for prime time. PP does a lot of things brilliantly. Sadly the production quality of the plastics is far from one of them.

I have heard they have corrected the issues that were with the first batch of the CoC battlebox. Though whether you'll get one of the later batches is a bit of a crap shoot. The floaty Vectors, from what I've seen are perfectly fine.

I'll admit, I'm a little in the same boat, as I've been very reluctant to buy any more of the CoC plastics and I've pretty much been hoarding all the metals.

I have no issues with the plastic. It is fine. I prefer the plastic models to metal ones.

But it seems like whatever process PP uses to make the plastic models takes a month or two to work out the kinks. It seems like the first ones are always a bit more finicky than the ones that come out down the road.

I'm not sure I'd recommend them as a first faction. But if you are already into the game then by all means, pick them up. I don't know much about what units to combo together, but it seems like a lot of people have been S**tting their pants worrying about Father Lucant. Not sure if he is out yet or not.

I've heard good things about Iron Mother's Carrier Swarm, which is her tier list loaded with the Servitors. It has it's weaknesses, but elimination servitors (auto 1 point damage bots) can be hell against infantry.

I'd look at getting the Axiom with her, she can make the Accelerspiker (3 shots per attack, ROF2) seriously mean.

I've seen her use Monitors to great effect as well.

In terms of models, any of the 4 legged jacks and the typical support are great (Optifex Directive, servitors, corollary, etc). I would definitely invest in the light jacks as well (they make great shooty arc nodes).

As a starter army? You'll definitely get your order of operations down quick, as it is a requirement for the army. You may take a swift beating until you find your groove (pretty standard for any new player). The plastics are okay, the new floating heavy kit is much better, the axiom is great, and my troop boxes have been solid. My starter box was a bit mangled, but nothing some hot water, sharp knife, and some patience couldn't fix (YMMV)

 sing your life wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Chongara wrote:
I would advise against starting with Cyriss.

1) As 1-off release, They're not getting expansions in future anthology books, other players will have fun new toys to look forward to every year. You won't.
2) They're still kind of new and so it is still something of a wild-west in terms of their meta. There is probably little in the way of truly reliable guidance people can give you.
3) They're a bit more fiddly and interactive than other factions and will be hard adjustment coming from other games.
4) See point #1.
5) The lineup is almost entirely plastic. This may sound like a good thing coming from other games but trust me - PP Plastics are garbage. Having metal alternatives is a must for the WM/H lineup imo.
6) See Point #1.

Plastic? I just bought a metal Iron Mother and clockwork angels today.

Obviously you didn't notice that every main Warjack and unit is in plastic.

Also, I would personally add the factions heavy contrast to the Ik setting and inferior sculpts to the above list

Obviously you didn't notice that the main Warjacks aren't the entirety of the lineup. If you're going to be rude, at least be right.

 Chongara wrote:
I would advise against starting with Cyriss.

1) As 1-off release, They're not getting expansions in future anthology books, other players will have fun new toys to look forward to every year. You won't.

Wrong. http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?156712-Convergence-of-Cyriss-to-be-a-one-time-only-release&p=1987816&viewfull=1#post1987816

PPS_Simon wrote:Right now we don't plan for the Convergence of Cyriss to be added to the regular rotation of updated armies in our WARMACHINE anthology books (Cygnar, Khador, the Protectorate of Menoth, Cryx, and the Retribution of Scyrah), but we will likely add new models to their ranks from time to time.

Also, http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?156712-Convergence-of-Cyriss-to-be-a-one-time-only-release&p=1987875#post1987875

PPS_Simon wrote:They would likely be included in the anthology books when we do release new models, they just won't be an assumed inclusion like our main factions.

To the OP, I don't have any personal experience with Directrix, but it appears to me that she's a gunline caster. Fire Group for increased range, RAT 5 on all her jacks, and an impressive gun of her own all give her advantages in ranged combat.

She does not do much for infantry, but that doesn't mean she doesn't want any. Angels fill a role as support/solo hunters and can be useful for all Convergence casters. Optifex Directive gives you good support or your own. If you want a good meat shield (metal shield?) unit, Obstructors or Reciprocators are your options, and neither are bad. Back either up with Enigma Foundries and they'll keep coming back to fight. Throw in some Reductors, and they'll spray to death whatever just charged your front line.

She has one notable synergy with infantry and that's with Elimination Servitors. If Directrix lands Backlash on an enemy warjack, you can then use anything with Puncture to land auto damage on said warjack that will carry over to the enemy warcaster. Elimination Servitors are easiest way to get a high volume of Puncture shots. It's not great against every opponent, but it'll be fun to bring every so often. In fact, this highlights one of IM's weaknesses. She is weaker against Hordes because two of her spells are flat out useless, and even against certain WM lists, those spells don't carry as much weight as they could.

If I were starting from scratch with Directrix, I would start with getting some gunjacks (Some combination of Monitors, Assimilators, and Ciphers), then I'd throw in the support I knew I wanted (a unit of OD at the very least, maybe some Attunement Servitors), and fill in the rest with infantry (metal shield unit, Angels to hunt solos, etc.)

How in the world can you call me wrong and then directly quote:

Right now we don't plan for the Convergence of Cyriss to be added to the regular rotation of updated armies in our WARMACHINE anthology books (Cygnar, Khador, the Protectorate of Menoth, Cryx, and the Retribution of Scyrah), but we will likely add new models to their ranks from time to time.

Anthology books for each game system are once per year. Right now it's only "likely" that they're ever going to get updates at all. They're certainly not going to be get updates every year, like every other faction. Right now there is no honest way to tell a new player that they're going to be seeing updates on anything that even resembles a regular schedule. For all we know right now it could be like waiting for a GW Codex.

 Chongara wrote:
How in the world can you call me wrong and then directly quote:

Right now we don't plan for the Convergence of Cyriss to be added to the regular rotation of updated armies in our WARMACHINE anthology books (Cygnar, Khador, the Protectorate of Menoth, Cryx, and the Retribution of Scyrah), but we will likely add new models to their ranks from time to time.

Anthology books for each game system are once per year. Right now it's only "likely" that they're ever going to get updates at all. They're certainly not going to be get updates every year, like every other faction. Right now there is no honest way to tell a new player that they're going to be seeing updates on anything that even resembles a regular schedule. For all we know right now it could be like waiting for a GW Codex.

It seems pretty clear PP has plans to add models to their range. You called them a 1-off. There has been no indication from developers or sales of the line to indicate that to be at all likely.

Yes we could be waiting a while, but that still doesn't make the faction a "1-off".

Speaking as a very new Warmachine player but long time general wargamer. I love the Convergence of Cyriss. Partly due to the limited release, I can limit my spending on various models and be challenged to make what I have work. That, besides the wonderful art and designs, the locals talked me into it as they had no CoC players.

 valthonis wrote:
Speaking as a very new Warmachine player but long time general wargamer. I love the Convergence of Cyriss. Partly due to the limited release, I can limit my spending on various models and be challenged to make what I have work. That, besides the wonderful art and designs, the locals talked me into it as they had no CoC players.

Been talking to some long time players and getting a lot of good advice. This going to be good. On the side I'm also collecting Khador, but CoC is going to be my main army.

Where do I start?

 MWHistorian wrote:

Obviously you didn't notice that the main Warjacks aren't the entirety of the lineup. If you're going to be rude, at least be right.

That's why I also said the units for COC were in plastic as well.

 Grimtuff wrote:


Still tilting at that windmill I see....?

I have literally no idea what you are talking about

You've been told multiple times why CoC fit into the IK,

Nope, you tried ["tried" is a key word here] to explain why COC fit, then I clearly explained why your arguments were terrible

not least to mention that they've been an integral part of it since the D20 RPG over a decade ago

If Vulcan miniguns had been mentioned in NES Zelda would that mean that they fitted in with the franchise's setting? [hint: no]

Don't make statements like that that are based on your own personal aesthetics (we get it, you don't like the CoC line) and not the actual facts based on the imagery presented within the setting.

Alright, we all get it, you're a fanboi of Convergance, It's just that the faction is a hippy dippy missed opportunity of astronomical proportions

I've really been thinking of dumping Cygnar and starting COC to see if my Cargo Cult conversion ideas can fix this mess

Replies in bold.

Was that good enough for you kiddies?

I love me some Convergence. Something I really want to try sometime is Iron Mother and tons of elimination servitors, then just cast backlash on a promising warjack, domination to walk it into range, and put ~10 damage on their caster with puncture. Also you might strongly want to look at a unit of perforators. The Harm ability on her servitors can make them be POW 10 armor piercing guns. That's pretty dang good if you ask me. There are many thigns in this game that will roll over dead to 5 of those shots (plus you can cast tactical supremacy on them and walk them backwards 3" after they get into weapon range).

On a more serious note I think I will be using Axis quite a bit. I haven't really seen anybody talking about him, but all the jam he can shove into his list (obstructors with reductors behind them, and enigma foundries to bring it all back), razor wall and his feat to deny first strike to a lot of enemies, field martial counter charge combined with the inverter to knock models down on your opponent's turn. All these things interest me.

 sing your life wrote:



Was that good enough for you kiddies?

Nope.

I'm ignoring you from this point on because you don't know what you're talking about. Oh, the windmill part is a reference to Don Quixote. I'll leave you to figure out how that's applicable.

Anyway, I'm loving CoC. A friend who now writes fluff for Warmachine got me interested in the game and its universe but I couldn't do anything about it because I went off to Japan. Now that I'm back in the US of A I'm finally getting started. Here's my progress so far. I also bought the Iron Kingdoms RPG and am furiously reading up on everything.
(Yes, I know I have to base it.)

Very nice! Though I think the white on the Directx could have a pattern of edging to it of some kind. The pure white all by itself is a bit bold for my tastes and pulls the eye away from the awesome paintjob. But it could also just be the photo and the angle as well.

 Mordekiem wrote:
Very nice! Though I think the white on the Directx could have a pattern of edging to it of some kind. The pure white all by itself is a bit bold for my tastes and pulls the eye away from the awesome paintjob. But it could also just be the photo and the angle as well.

Excellent point. Hmmm....what kind of pattern would a machine worshiping cult use?

If you can, a freehand gear would look really cool. Or even the COC gear/face symbol. And then maybe some sort of border, even a simple line along the bottom. Or maybe a border that looks like cog wheels. I know there is a name for it, but I cannot think of it.

Not sure if you have a color palette in mind, but I think a blue could be really cool.

But overall they are beautiful models. I really like them.

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Mordekiem wrote:
Very nice! Though I think the white on the Directx could have a pattern of edging to it of some kind. The pure white all by itself is a bit bold for my tastes and pulls the eye away from the awesome paintjob. But it could also just be the photo and the angle as well.

Excellent point. Hmmm....what kind of pattern would a machine worshiping cult use?

I'd go with anything that simply looks good. CoC seem to have this whole "art deco" influence about them, with things on their clockwork bodies that are there to simply look good rather that immediate functionality.

A cog pattern might seem the obvious choice, but it might also be a little on the nose with certain AdMech comparisons.

BTW, how did you find Directrix's assembly? For me she was only one of a handful of models I've had to paint incomplete as there were certain unreachable areas. Lovely model (on the wrong size base too if you ask me, her and Lucant should swap) but a pain to paint up to a certain stage.

Also, a good piece of CoC fiction is "Through the Darkness" on PP's Skull Island site, it might still be free to download.

 Grimtuff wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:

 Mordekiem wrote:
Very nice! Though I think the white on the Directx could have a pattern of edging to it of some kind. The pure white all by itself is a bit bold for my tastes and pulls the eye away from the awesome paintjob. But it could also just be the photo and the angle as well.

Excellent point. Hmmm....what kind of pattern would a machine worshiping cult use?

I'd go with anything that simply looks good. CoC seem to have this whole "art deco" influence about them, with things on their clockwork bodies that are there to simply look good rather that immediate functionality.

A cog pattern might seem the obvious choice, but it might also be a little on the nose with certain AdMech comparisons.

BTW, how did you find Directrix's assembly? For me she was only one of a handful of models I've had to paint incomplete as there were certain unreachable areas. Lovely model (on the wrong size base too if you ask me, her and Lucant should swap) but a pain to paint up to a certain stage.

Also, a good piece of CoC fiction is "Through the Darkness" on PP's Skull Island site, it might still be free to download.

Very good points! Thanks for the heads up on the story. I'll definitely look at that!