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Ok so I am in a progressive league and I played my first set of games (ever im a new player) yesterday and just got wrecked. I think the majority of it was that I was playing Dark Angels and couldn't roll 3+.

I played with the following list and just got wrecked by Orcs/Cultists. For Reference this is a 500 pt list.

QA - Librarian W/PFG
Troop 1 - Tac Squad(5) W/Plasma Gun
Troop 2 - Tac Squad(5) W/Plasma Cannon
Fast Attack 1 - Ravenwing Attack Squad(3) W/Plasma Gun
Heavy 1 - Predator W/Twin Las and Las Sides.

The problem I had was that:
1. The Plasma Cannon was very poor for crowds and not as good as I would have liked. (That and the scatter was not my friend as well as it got hot on me twice.)
2. The Ravenwings got pummeled by crowds with over-watch (also probably bad luck on dice rolls)

The changes I was considering making was to drop the plasma gun and cannon all together as well as the Plas Gun on the Ravenwing.
Then use those points to add an additional body to each of the TAC teams and give the ravenwing squad all flamers to rush in and take care of crowds.

Is this a bad idea, am I overcompensating for bad rolls? Should this list have done better against large number troops like orcs and cultists?

Thanks for any help im a new guy and would love feedback.

Will post the 750 point list once I get some good feedback, most likely I am just going to add a terminator squad.

Hey, I'm not 100% familiar with the DA codex so I'm going to assume they are semi-close to most other space marines (I play chaos : / lol)

I find there is usually two ways to run bikes.
Tank poppers (with melta) or how you listed your change and loading up with flamers and combi-flamers to smash hordes of low armour troops.
I use mine as a delivery system for my HQ to get into close combat with the meltas.

As for the Tac squad loadout, at low points I've seen missile launcher squads hold back field objectives but since you have the las pred id make them a little more mid field aggressive maybe.
Try the plasma guns again, the 24" range is awesome and rapid fire is great if you can pull it off. Don't charge, just rapid fire, let them charge you and overwatch with rapid fire again.

Going to 750 rhinos aren't horrible to get your guys where they need to go early, also, if you want the termi squad and you decide to have your bikers kitted for anti-horde, I would give them all combi-meltas and deep strike them beside a tank or walker and blow the out of it

Hope that helps!

PS. hordes like orks are really strong at low points, especially against marines since they have so many more bodies. The higher you go the more tools you'll have to deal with them, don't sweat it.

Ok, was just making sure I wasn't too crazy for the flamers.
So here is what I was thinking about for my 750.

(95) HQ - Librarian W/PFG
(70) Troop 1 - Tac Squad(5)
(70) Troop 2 - Tac Squad(5)
(100) Fast Attack 1 - Ravenwing Attack Squad(3) W/ Flamer(2) Combi-Flamer(1)
(140) Heavy 1 - Predator W/ Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sides.
(274) Elite 1 - Deathwing Terminator Squad(6) W/ Heavy Flamer

This way I have the predator for anti tank, 2 TAC squads for holding objectives. The bikes for speed/crowd control/becon for the Elites.

This is 749 points, please let me know if you see anything that would be better.

I am going with these squads because that is what I currently have models for.

hmm, only criticism is that terminator squad is like 40% of your list lol
Can you run it as a 3 man squad with the heavy flamer still?

I'd buff your troops, 10 marines is pretty easy to focus on and kill then you cant score objectives at all

The squad needs to be (5) base.

I could cut the extra terminator for a couple more marines.

Do you think I would be better off forgoing the terminator squad completely and just going with a pair of 10 unit marines?

Trade librarian and a termi or two to get Belial to make 40% of your list scoring.

Terminator squad has to be 5 units, which would make Belial too expensive to fit in even if I cut the extra terminator.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
How about something like this.

(200) HQ - Sammael
(98) - Troop 1 - TAC Squad(7)
(98) - Troop 2 - TAC Squad(7)
(100) - Fast Attack 1 - Ravenwing Attack Squad(3) W/Flamer(2) Combi Flamer(1)
(107) - Fast Attack 2 - Ravenwing Attack Squad(4)
(140) - Heavy 1 - Predator W/Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sides, Storm Bolter

(748) Points.

This way everything but the tank is a scoring unit and the squads are a bit larger.

i think that's actually 743 with what you've listed point wise.

drop the storm bolter on the pred if it costs extra and put a special weapon, maybe a melta, on the larger bike squad

looks pretty good, bikes are toughness 5 which at 750, I think is better points wise than termis

Ok, turns out I am locked into my original 500 (which isn't that good cause I am new...)

So my 500 that I HAVE to have is.

(95) HQ - Librarian W/PFG
(85) Troop 1 - Tac Squad W/Plasma Cannon
(85) Troop 2 - Tac Squad W/Plasma Gun
(80) Fast Attack 1 - Ravenwing Attach Squad
(140) Heavy 1 - Predator W/ Twin Lascannon, and Side Lascannon

(485)

Upgrades I plan on taking are.
(10) Flamers for the 2 bikes
(5) Combi-flamer for the Sargent Bike
(42) +3 Marine
(200) +1 Sammael

This would put me at (742)

Its not ideal but I have to work with the mess I started with.

So my squad would be.

(200) HQ 1 - Sammael
(95) HQ 2 - Librarian W/PFG
(99) Troop 1 - Tac Squad(6) w/PC
(113) Troop 2 - Tac Squad(7) w/PG
(100) Fast Attack 1 - Ravenwing Attack Squadron W/ Flamer(2) CombiFlamer(1)
(140) Heavy 1 - Predator W/ Twin Lascannon, Side Lascannon.

(747)

Not ideal, would like to have more bikes with Sammael but I will have to wait for the next point bump to pick them up.

Still looks good

Just take the primaris in Divination on your Librarian and put him with whichever tac squad you want to be twin linked (which will greatly help all your plasma weapons)

And obviously Sammael goes with the bikes to wreck face in close combat

How does the librarian provide twin linked?

What options are available to him for psychic disciplines?

If he can roll powers on the Divination table, the primaris power gives target squad twin-linked as long as you pass your psychic test

Ill have to check that out. I know for a fact it can roll on divination but I have only played 2 games and one of them I forgot to roll on divination so I am still not sure all what is available. That is cool if that is an option then.

I see your problem right from the start. Your army is too slow to keep up with your bikes. Your bikes are great in larger numbers than a single team of three and the rest of your army is walking b (omitting your tank).

Take 6 bikes (two teams of three each with a melta)

Your two tac teams are fine

Buy a troop transport to get your infantry mobile.

Next let's talk about your 750 list. Sammy is one of the most expensive hq's we have. Leave him at home until you hit 1000 points then go full on bike fuego and bring a tidal wave of bikes and speeders (maybe even a nehpilim!)

At 750 pts heres my da list:

Librarian

1x5 tactical marines, are launcher, razorback (stock)
1x10 tac marines, drop pod, combi plasma, hb
1x6 scouts bolters, s rifles, hb
I stick veterans in a drop pod and trick them out with combi meltas, combi flamer and a flamer and if I can a mm.

This is a mostly infantry list. It's principals are simple.

My drop pod tacticals land and take the center of the map and stand there all "come at me bro" style.

Libby riding with the launcher team in the razor goes up and takes a supportive position

The scouts sit within arms reach of my back objective but far forward enough that the hb can still be of value

The veterans in the pod are my at beat stick. They fall from the sky and then proceed to melt the tank(s) that I think will cause me the most trouble. They are carrying the flamers in the event
They survive that excursion. They can now footslog to some infantry and give them the good news.

At 900pts the veterans multiply, I give them a chappy, and I add a predator with nothing on it.

This list is for everything but horde armies. I have other plans for horde armies.. They don't like me much.

Don't have access to codex for points right now, but roughly what would do is:

1. I would stick you librarian on a bike to just zip around and buff squads w/ divination. I wouldn't even let him get in combat.

2. I would max out Tactical squads and prob take meltas(2), so there's no reason not to move and shoot. Take two squads of 10 marines. Don't upgrade Sgt.

3 Devastator squad w/ 4 missile launchers.

Bike squadron way too small at 3. You can't go wrong with more basic marines and some multipurpose heavy weapons.