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I started out recently buying a few models to learn how to paint as a hobby, and felt drawn to learn how to play the game as well. I don't know when/if I'll actually get to play, but I've been buying/painting with having a functioning army in mind.

I really like the trollblood storyline/aesthetic (so many of the factions are pretty morally reprehensible to me), and I decided on Grim Angus as my warlock.


I wanted a Mage-style solo and settled on Lanyssa over Janissa or a Fell Caller. A point cheaper and I get a better looking model (+some painting variety) and a little more synergy with the other troops I wanted to take (I think). The gobbers give her stealth and she makes them a little less easy to counter. The Vanguard also benefits from Hunter's Mark. For the beasts, would hunters mark and Grim's bait the line stack for +4?

The extra points I fed into getting 3 Long Riders over a beast. They add a nice speedy flanking alternative and again seem to go well with Lanyssa. I was torn here between adding something like a Slag Troll, but I didn't want to add another 1 point unit or drop the gobbers.

This would make my 35pt list:

Grim Angus (-6)
EBDT (10)
Troll Impaler (5)

Long riders (7)

Raluk Moorclaw (2)
Vanguard (5)
Lanyssa (2)
Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew (1)
Greygore Boomhowler & Co. (9)

The goal is to be able to access a lot of different aspects of the game. Does this seem viable? Stupid? Any thoughts are appreciated.

For the beasts, would hunters mark and Grim's bait the line stack for +4?

Yes, all effects stack unless they share a name like "Snipe" or otherwise call out a lack of stacking. Just an example you could stack


[Fervor] from the Kriel Warriors for +2 attack +2 damage with [War Cry] from the Fell Caller hero for +2 attack and [Carnage] from pMadrak (the one that comes in the battle box) for +2 attack to attack rolls and [Charge of the Trolls] from the stone Scribe Chronicler for +2 Attack and Damage Rolls

Giving your Kriel Warriors +8 to Melee Attacks rolls, and +4 damage. Trolls are all about buff stacking.

As for your specific list.. it feels a bit all over the place to me but none of the individual elements are bad. I wouldn't jump right in at 35pts. Play small start with just faction models in the box and see how you feel.

Thank you for the reply. As I said, I primarily started getting figures just to paint. For that reason I avoided getting the starter box (I don't like the feel of plastic kits). That's also why some it might seem "all over the place," as you said (that and the fact I've never done this before).

I did try to build in a certain degree of synergy while satisfying my eclectic desires.

From what I have read, the Impaler and EBDT pair up nicely with Grim. Raluk was something I really wanted to use and his Vanguard gives me another beast equivalent without adding to the fury burden. The vanguard also fills a defensive role. I chose the boomhowlers over an in-faction unit for their self-reliance, while still being boosted by Grim. Lanyssa was mostly chosen for her model, and secondarily for her cost and synergy with EBDT throwing. The long riders seemed like the best/most fun use of my remaining points and also pair well with hunters mark, I think.

Lots of slamming/charging possibilities, decent range options while screening from better guns, though I see now I've moved away from the more gun-oriented original list I had and am questioning the use of the Impaler. I suppose Grim sniping to bait the line for a long range troll smash might be something to keep people on their toes?

Of course, all of this was theory crafted on my part to justify the things I felt would be fun to paint/play with and it could all fall apart on a table.


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One question would be, what are the glaring weaknesses to my proposed list? What comes to mind for me is dealing with high ARM on non-feat turns and a general lack of AoE (Long rider slam shenanigans might help with these?)

Kasiski wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
One question would be, what are the glaring weaknesses to my proposed list? What comes to mind for me is dealing with high ARM on non-feat turns and a general lack of AoE (Long rider slam shenanigans might help with these?)

Well, because it's kind of all over the place it doesn't have any one glaring weakness. It's kind chugging along at like a C- in every performance category. Yeah too much armor is going to be an issue, too many dudes are going to be an issue. The elements you have just don't form a cohesive list.

That said Long Riders, Boomhowlers, EBDT, Impaler, Grim, Swamp Gobbers - these are all individually really good models. The Vanguard/Raluk and Lanyssa are solid too, if a bit narrow for trolls. Like you've not gotten anything bad here... you've just put them together in a very strange way.

If it sounds like I'm beating around the bush about this being a "Bad List" it's because I am. I mean it is kind of like... not really good. However I hesitate to come down too hard because presumably you can start with smaller games (15pts), where just about any sub-combination of these models can serve you well. As you move towards full games (35-50pts) you'll probably need to pick up more models to be able to get good lists. However you'll be developing an understanding of the game at the same time and you'll learn what you want to put with what and why.

The EBDT is crazy good, but you probably want to pair him with an Axer rather than Impaler. Because Rush +Rough Terrain + whatever = Fast Troll.
The Impaler provides a solid support animus in Far Strike, but you'd probably want to pair it with a Bomber or another ranged beast.
The Long Riders are the best Cavarly unit in the game, but you probably want some more of the Troll support pieces to bring out their full potential.
Boomhowler is a badass, but he might be happier running in the Borka theme list to get faction-bonuses.

Stuff like that. You've got bits and bobs that are solid purchases, but It's probably better to get some hands on experience and figure out where those models are going to be happiest than just lumping them all together in one list.

Context & Synergy are a big part of this game, especially for Trollbloods.

What you say makes a lot of sense. Basically, will it work? Yes. Will it work particularly well? Probably not. Does that sound about right?

At this point it really is about learning and having fun for me, not winning tournaments, so I think I can live with a rating of "meh" for the time being as the list will at least let me experience a variety of game mechanics.

Your point about the Impaler in particular is something I might change now. He really is a hold over from my early conception of the list which was more range-focused and the idea of "must take Impaler with grim." I would have to drop the gobbers for an axer or slag, are any of the other 5 point options worth considering? I have heard bad things about storm/winter. Would a Pyre add anything valuable?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I also have a fell caller hero and unit of sluggers (which I regret) waiting in the wings.

Kasiski wrote:
What you say makes a lot of sense. Basically, will it work? Yes. Will it work particularly well? Probably not. Does that sound about right?

At this point it really is about learning and having fun for me, not winning tournaments, so I think I can live with a rating of "meh" for the time being as the list will at least let me experience a variety of game mechanics.

That's fine but be forewarned. This game is about competition at a very a basic level, it's baked into the DNA of the game. Like even the most casual of settings trends towards trying to put together the most efficient and powerful list they can. There is comparatively little of "let's have our dudes throw some dice at each other and see what happens" approach you see in other games.

What I mean is this, tournaments aren't the only setting where you'll have to actively try to win. If a player is behind an opponent in any one area (list building, game knowledge, tactics), it's not unlikely it will wind up a brutally one-sided affair. Now the rule set is fair, balanced and largely well written and clear so this works. However it's something to be mindful of as you set expectations about how to approach them game.

Your point about the Impaler in particular is something I might change now. He really is a hold over from my early conception of the list which was more range-focused and the idea of "must take Impaler with grim." I would have to drop the gobbers for an axer or slag, are any of the other 5 point options worth considering? I have heard bad things about storm/winter. Would a Pyre add anything valuable?

I personally like all of the Troll light beasts, though I will admit the storm and winter trolls are more narrow. The Axer Animus increases threat range, the Pyre Troll animus increases hitting power. Take your pick.

How smart of a change would it be to switch out the Boomhowlers for a min unit of Kriel warriors, 2 cabers and a Fell Caller?

A very good idea. Except Max instead of Min. You get more use out of other upgrades if you go max units, thus its almost never a good idea to go min unless you have no UA.

Boomies have a problem in that they don't benefit from all the troll buffs(not faction), and thus can't get all the buffs kriel warriors can.

Boomhowlers really aren't a great unit for trolls, they don't bring anything super special to the party.


As for your list, I agree with Chongara that you are a bit all over the place with the list. You have good models, but they aren't good together.

Warmachine list building is kinda like cooking. You need to make sure the ingredients work together. The list you've made is basically a flat-iron steak shake with mashed potatoes and chocolate sauce on top. You've taken nice ingredients and made something nobody would eat. And used some sub-par ingredients too.

Things I would ditch, the Boomhowlers and Raluk. Boomies I explained above. Raluk just isn't very good period. At least for trolls. Him and the Vanguard add nothing to your army, which is a serious liability.


Grim Angus is 100% a ranged warlock.

This means you should take a couple ranged beasts.

I'd go for a Impaler, Bomber, and the EBDT(or Mauler. You need a melee heavy pretty much at all times).

Then with the points from dropping Boomhowler and Raluk, get a full unit of Kriel Warriors with UA and 1 Caber thrower. If you have points, get a Fell Caller hero.

Well, max Kriel Warriors with UA and one Caber comes in at the same price as the full set of Boomhowlers. I guess I can start there and see what's what.

I really like the idea of Raluk and his pet 'jack, so I am loathe to alter that part of the list. If I stick it out and go deeper into the war gaming world I would probably stick him next to a war wagon in a bigger list. One option would be to switch the Vanguard to a Buccaneer and use those 2 points + dropping the gobbers to add a Fell Caller Hero for the warriors.