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IIRC, the chain on the chainsword is able to cut better than than the chainsaws we have now.

SaintHazard wrote:

Gwar! wrote:Could be worse, they could have a Bromance with Necrons...

You just don't understand! Their love is special! THEY HAVE A BOND THAT CANNOT BE BROKEN!

SaintHazard wrote:
"Hey, so this ancient star-god intent on destroying all life in the universe is trapped on this planet. Probably should bomb the planet so that he can't escape."

Uriel: "NO, WE NOT KILL CIVILIANS."

He then proceeds to release said ancient star-god who goes on to likely kill trillions of civilians. Which rhymes, by the way. Trillions of civilians.

And since I have mad rhymez, your argument is invalid!

thats apples to oranges my friend, I'm referring to combat discipline, not how to conduct a campaign and the best way to go about it, is Uriel Ventris an over-sympathetic dolt, who has no place commanding a company of space marines, yes. Is he a slack jawed idiot capable only of screaming blood for the blood god and running around with a chainsaw? no.

ToxicsLayer wrote:IIRC, the chain on the chainsword is able to cut better than than the chainsaws we have now.

Well, one would hope that 40,000 years in the future, household tools would be more advanced...

kronk wrote:

ToxicsLayer wrote:IIRC, the chain on the chainsword is able to cut better than than the chainsaws we have now.

Well, one would hope that 40,000 years in the future, household tools would be more advanced...

Three words: Technological dark age. In your average Imperial household, butter is churned manually, and "Cuisinart" is another way of saying "give the kids knives and let'em go wild."

I think that chainswords 'seizing' is perhaps why they have no AP value, Flak armour would do a good number on clogging up the teeth. The striking scorpion Chainsword is however, more feasible as mono filamnet teeth spinning at ultra high RPM would cut through almost anything.... And regarding the chainsword bouncing back up i would assume the engine would have an automatic kill switch... So i would suggest a chainsword even of primitive design would be able to cause horrific damage/bleeding to organic tissue but would not 'follow through' a great amount. I think this might merit a chainsword thread...

1 shot in game abstraction is not a single round of ammunition necessarily, and 1 turn is a vague amount of time. Considering the size of a bolter barrel, and the size of the ammo clip, I find it hard to believe that a clip would hold more than a half a dozen shells and that's being generous. Just how many missile reloads do you think the Imperial Guard weapons team guy is carrying? Do we need to model 7 of those long tubes onto his back just for realism? Or maybe give him a wheelbarrow just to be realistic! How do Guard heavy weapons crews actually carry their lascannon or autocannon around (about 10'-11' long scale to the figure) between setting back up the tripod, mounting te gun, and so on, while the enemy is capable of firing his automatic weapon 2 shots in their direction.

I believe this is what they call "suspension of disbelief".

Nobody really lugs around a sword that is almost as tall as them with a blade as wide as their head in one hand either, but Imperial Guard commanders seem to pull it off just fine. Powerfists may well be strong enough to move themselves with servos or hydraulics or whatever, but the shoulder on that junior guard officer must get affully tired lugging around a big metal power fist the size of his torso too.

Suspension of disbelief yall. If you wan't realism of ammo conservation and efficiency, that's what paintball fields are for. As to why many modelers don't put the ammo clip on their marines (ohh... 5 or 6 more shells!) is because they are clunky, ugly looking and awkward in an otherwise dynamic looking miniature. Since the laws of reality clearly don't apply in many aspects of 40k abstraction, there's no need to make your figure ugly just to make it seem more realistic.

But cutting the tenuous threads from which our disbelief hangs precariously is fun sometimes.

SaintHazard wrote:But cutting the tenuous threads from which our disbelief hangs precariously is fun sometimes.

Agree.

Ideally, ignoring the gakky BL writers (most of them), Marines drop in, kill everything, and leave. Their equipment is designed for exactly that, to be as deadly as they can for a short period of time. Guard is more capable of doing long-term fights, and if there is a protracted war going on, Guard is going to be the primary participant in the overwhelming majority of cases.

Guitardian wrote:1 shot in game abstraction is not a single round of ammunition necessarily, and 1 turn is a vague amount of time. Considering the size of a bolter barrel, and the size of the ammo clip, I find it hard to believe that a clip would hold more than a half a dozen shells and that's being generous.

A bolter in fluff is .75 caliber, which is about the size of a 12-guage shotgun at .73 inches. Today there are 10-round magazines for automatic shotguns that are manipulable by a normal person's hand that aren't that exceptionally long. With the super-thick width of bolter magazines they probably have two stacks of rounds, and a double-thickness magazine wouldn't be a problem for a super-human in power armor to manipulate, so 20-rounds is not that hard to fit. The longer magazines could be 30, though all of the longer mags that I've seen are much thinner.

The barrels on pretty much all 40k models are bigger than they should be in scale since it looks more impressive, but the size of a bolter in fluff is really not excessive. The barrel is only slightly larger than a 12-guage shotgun, and they're very easily handled by normal humans.

Slightly off topic, but I heard that when a guardsmen is issued a lasgun, he gets two batteries, which function as the ammo clips. These batteries can be recharged through any type of energy transfer, such as holding them close to your body for heat transfer. Is this true?

I think if they actually afixed some type of ammo packs to SM, it would just be to much.....personally im not really interested in painting ammo packs....is anyone else?

micahaphone wrote:Slightly off topic, but I heard that when a guardsmen is issued a lasgun, he gets two batteries, which function as the ammo clips. These batteries can be recharged through any type of energy transfer, such as holding them close to your body for heat transfer. Is this true?

Close to the body doesn't work, but according to fluff you can throw one in a fire to recharge it, though that hurts the battery life if you do it often. The more correct way to do it in the wild is with the issued solar panels, and in more advanced surroundings you can attach wires running pretty much any kind of current to it.

Melissia wrote:The three round bursts, if they ever used it, would be three single shots. Three boltgun shots would be overkill on all but the toughest of creatures. Like a warboss or hive tyrant.

Yes and no...

...3 bolter rounds would be overkill for many targets, but the idea of firing multiple rounds is not just to increase the chance of a kill, but also to increase the chance of hitting in the first place. In combat many times sights arent used, simply because there just isnt time to line up a shot with the sights, so a small burst is used along with rough aiming to increase the chance of a hit. Thats where training comes in, the better you know your weapon the less time you have to spend lining up a shot, it just comes natural.

The original purpose of the 3 round burst setting was to keep excited/scared troops form emptying their magazines in a single rampage, usually while scoring no hits.

A good example is the wars going on in the middle east. The western troops are well trained and use 3 round burst fire, likely scoring at least 1 hit out of the 3 rounds fired. The middle eastern forces however use full auto fire and have a tendency of doing "spray and pray" emptying the whole magazine in the general direction of the enemy and scoring few if any hits...much like Orks.


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Element206 wrote:I think if they actually afixed some type of ammo packs to SM, it would just be to much.....personally im not really interested in painting ammo packs....is anyone else?

Id say thats why most dont add them...its a mundane detail that really adds little to the model. After all, if detail and accuracy was critical, they wouldnt make things in heroic scale.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

ToxicsLayer wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:many Man portable Anti-tank/Air missiles use the 2 stage launch(to prevent the back wash from harming the User) that ejects the missile 10-15 feet forward before ignition.

Example being the Javelin Missle.

The javelin also contains a dual stage warhead...one stage to break the outer armor/layer of a target, the second to explode inside it. We make parts for the Javelin at my job.

I've seen Marine models with ammo packs added and i personally find it to look much, much better than vanilla models