The Shadow wrote:
Not convinced about a fair few aspects of this.

Some of the Warlord Traits are OP. For instance the one that extents Synapse and FNP. Just one of them is enough.

The choking skies rule is also silly, and has been put in there purely because "Ahhhh! Flyers!!" Being able to destroy any flier with a single dice roll is just too hard of a counter. Play the Hive Mind. The Hive Mind would create a UNIT or Biomorph to deal with flyers. There's two easy, balanced and understandable ways to deal with Flyers: Make Harpies good and give Hive Guard the option for Skyfire.

A lot of the Biomorphs themselves are silly. Taking a combination of two to unlock an extra ability is unnecessarily complicated. Stay simple. I'd do the Biomorphs exactly like the Exarch Powers are done in the Eldar Codex, but obviously with the whole unit being able to take them.

Going to have a more in-depth read of this later.

McNinja wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Not convinced about a fair few aspects of this.

Some of the Warlord Traits are OP. For instance the one that extents Synapse and FNP. Just one of them is enough.

The choking skies rule is also silly, and has been put in there purely because "Ahhhh! Flyers!!" Being able to destroy any flier with a single dice roll is just too hard of a counter. Play the Hive Mind. The Hive Mind would create a UNIT or Biomorph to deal with flyers. There's two easy, balanced and understandable ways to deal with Flyers: Make Harpies good and give Hive Guard the option for Skyfire.

A lot of the Biomorphs themselves are silly. Taking a combination of two to unlock an extra ability is unnecessarily complicated. Stay simple. I'd do the Biomorphs exactly like the Exarch Powers are done in the Eldar Codex, but obviously with the whole unit being able to take them.

Going to have a more in-depth read of this later.

The Warlord Traits are going to be redone soon, right now they're not much more than placeholders. Choking Skies wasn't intended (by me at least) to be a knee-jerk reaction to Flyers, I just thought it was fluffy.

As for the Biomorphs, they're similar to something else I had written, so I just wanted to gauge how people would react to the the slightly increased complexity.

Kain wrote:If we wanted no depth of complexity, we'd be playing space marines.

 The Shadow wrote:

McNinja wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Not convinced about a fair few aspects of this.

Some of the Warlord Traits are OP. For instance the one that extents Synapse and FNP. Just one of them is enough.

The choking skies rule is also silly, and has been put in there purely because "Ahhhh! Flyers!!" Being able to destroy any flier with a single dice roll is just too hard of a counter. Play the Hive Mind. The Hive Mind would create a UNIT or Biomorph to deal with flyers. There's two easy, balanced and understandable ways to deal with Flyers: Make Harpies good and give Hive Guard the option for Skyfire.

A lot of the Biomorphs themselves are silly. Taking a combination of two to unlock an extra ability is unnecessarily complicated. Stay simple. I'd do the Biomorphs exactly like the Exarch Powers are done in the Eldar Codex, but obviously with the whole unit being able to take them.

Going to have a more in-depth read of this later.

The Warlord Traits are going to be redone soon, right now they're not much more than placeholders. Choking Skies wasn't intended (by me at least) to be a knee-jerk reaction to Flyers, I just thought it was fluffy.

As for the Biomorphs, they're similar to something else I had written, so I just wanted to gauge how people would react to the the slightly increased complexity.

Choking Skies is fluffy, to a certain extent and, while it may have a place in the codex, it certainly doesn't have a place as an army wide special rule. Perhaps say it applies if you take over X number of Gargoyles (30 or so). Or maybe there's a SC who makes it compulsory to take at least 1 unit of Gargoyles and also makes them troops. This SC could then also cause choking skies to come into effect. Less of a, like you say, "knee-jerk to Fliers" and more fluffy.

Kain wrote:If we wanted no depth of complexity, we'd be playing space marines.

It's not that its impossible to understand, it's just that it's more complicated than it needs to be. Saying X Biomorph gives you this, whilst Y Biomorph gives you this, oh and if you take both you also get this. Just say, for example, "this Biomorph gives the unit the Hammer of Wrath Special Rule. In addition, all of its Hammer of Wrath attacks are resolved at an AP of 5". Or something along those lines.

How about... This?

Pyrovore

WS3 BS3 S4 T5 W2 I1 A2 Ld6 Sv4+

Composition: 1-3 Pyrovores
Unit Type: Infantry


Weapons and Biomorphs:
Acid Maw
Acid Blood
Claws and Teeth
Flamespurt: Range:Template S5 AP4 Assault 1, Torrent (may fire weapon even when subject to instinctive behavior: feed)
Hardened Carapace

Special Rules:
Fearless
Banal monstrosity: Pyrovores are commonly seen lumbering into battle alongside it's fellow monstrosities shrugging off lethal shots, seemingly determined to annihilate some target that the Hive mind commanded it to. As such, at the start of each game, the player may choose to break up units of pyrovores and place them individually into any Troop Unit, pyrovores orginating from the same unit cannot be placed into the same Troop unit. To reflect their seemingly amazing durability, Pyrovores benefit from FNP against any weapon that is neither a flamer nor melta (as such weapons threaten to ignite the pyrovores volatile secretions).
Volatile: When a pyrovore is killed, it explodes into a fiery inferno consuming all those nearby. Upon the loss of a pyrovore's final wound, place a blast template centered upon where the pyrovore was. All units (friend or foe) under the blast template suffer a Strength 5 AP- hit

What does Dakka think?

 McNinja wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:

McNinja wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Not convinced about a fair few aspects of this.

Some of the Warlord Traits are OP. For instance the one that extents Synapse and FNP. Just one of them is enough.

The choking skies rule is also silly, and has been put in there purely because "Ahhhh! Flyers!!" Being able to destroy any flier with a single dice roll is just too hard of a counter. Play the Hive Mind. The Hive Mind would create a UNIT or Biomorph to deal with flyers. There's two easy, balanced and understandable ways to deal with Flyers: Make Harpies good and give Hive Guard the option for Skyfire.

A lot of the Biomorphs themselves are silly. Taking a combination of two to unlock an extra ability is unnecessarily complicated. Stay simple. I'd do the Biomorphs exactly like the Exarch Powers are done in the Eldar Codex, but obviously with the whole unit being able to take them.

Going to have a more in-depth read of this later.

The Warlord Traits are going to be redone soon, right now they're not much more than placeholders. Choking Skies wasn't intended (by me at least) to be a knee-jerk reaction to Flyers, I just thought it was fluffy.

As for the Biomorphs, they're similar to something else I had written, so I just wanted to gauge how people would react to the the slightly increased complexity.

Choking Skies is fluffy, to a certain extent and, while it may have a place in the codex, it certainly doesn't have a place as an army wide special rule. Perhaps say it applies if you take over X number of Gargoyles (30 or so). Or maybe there's a SC who makes it compulsory to take at least 1 unit of Gargoyles and also makes them troops. This SC could then also cause choking skies to come into effect. Less of a, like you say, "knee-jerk to Fliers" and more fluffy.

Kain wrote:If we wanted no depth of complexity, we'd be playing space marines.

It's not that its impossible to understand, it's just that it's more complicated than it needs to be. Saying X Biomorph gives you this, whilst Y Biomorph gives you this, oh and if you take both you also get this. Just say, for example, "this Biomorph gives the unit the Hammer of Wrath Special Rule. In addition, all of its Hammer of Wrath attacks are resolved at an AP of 5". Or something along those lines.

Well, that just adds more of a bonus to one item, instead of paying for two and getting three. For the Tusked + Adamantium Hide one, the reason was that if it's tusked, its using those in combat. If its skin is tougher than metal, and its using that for CC, its going to hurt a bit more. I think the format left something to be desired, but I feel like it gives more of a reason to take certain ones than outright bonuses.

Eldercaveman wrote:
Just a quick question, have you intentionally left out the option to take a pod from all units?

 McNinja wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:
Just a quick question, have you intentionally left out the option to take a pod from all units?

No, I just haven't added it in. Don't worry, things can still take pods in the new codex


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, I need you all to look at the Flamespurt Cannon, the Spore Cannon, and the Vore I have in this codex. Instead of making separate unit, I simply made a Vore-type creature and gave it access to both the Flamespurt and spore cannon to make a Pyrovore or biovore. It can also take the Acid Spray, but the cost of the weapon is more than the actual Vore itself.

I also gave it the ability to take Crushing Claws. Vores are feeders, but not agressive ones, so I think it might make sense for a unit of Vores to be armed with heavy CC weapons in order to get at tougher metals to consume.

Also, I changed the Enhanced Senses mutation, so that it also adds to any Snap Shots.

 Unyielding Hunger wrote:
Just to put in my points, you need to look over your units again, because you are making your models worse through technicalities that others probably haven't noticed, while also making literal game impossibilities. To look at the biggest offender, you have drastically nerfed the Parasite of Mortrex while making him more expensive. to explain fully everything, lets take a look under the hood.

Parasite of Mortrex

Spoiler:

170 points
.....................................WS..BS.....S...T...W...I....A...Ld...Sv
Parasite of Mortrex......5.....3......6...4....3...6...4...10...3+
Composition: 1 Parasite of Mortrex (Unique)
Unit Type: Infantry (Character)
Wargear: Rending Claws, Implant Attack, Bonded Exoskeleton, Wings, Ripper Host
Special Rules: Synapse Creature (Parasite of Mortrex), Implant Parasite, Independent Character

Synapse Creature (Parasite of Mortrex) - When friendly Ripper units are in Synaspe range of the Parasite of Mortrex, they are scoring. Other friendly Tyranid units that are within Synapse range may use the Parasite's Leadership instead of their own for any leadership tests they must take. Rippers within 24" of the Parasite of Mortrex count as being in Synapse range.

Implant Parasite - For each unsaved wound caused by the Parasite of Mortex, the model that takes those wounds must take a toughness test. If they fail, roll a D6 per failed toughness test. Then place that many Ripper bases within 6" of the Parasite of Mortrex, making sure to place them no closer than 1" to the enemy models. If a Ripper base cannot be placed due to impassable terrain or being to close to enemy models, it is not placed and instead latches itself onto the Parasite. Whenever the Parasite attacks, the Rippers may attack as if they were a separate unit that is composed of however many bases latched onto the Parasite. Make sure to keep track of how many Ripper bases are latched onto the Parasite!

"The Sarge is acting Strangely..." - Each enemy unit that outflanked may have been infected with Rippers. At the end of their movement phase, one model from each of those units that arrived from reserves using the Outflank rule must take a toughness test. If the test is failed, place a new Ripper unit consisting of D6 bases within 6" of the enemy unit.

1. Wrong Unit Type: Under the unit type, you moved him from Jump Infantry to Infantry. This means that it can only move like jump infantry, but gets none of the perks. Under it's current standing, the Parasite can re-roll it's charge distance and use Hammer of Wrath attacks, while also netting her the ability to deep strike.
2. Implant Parasite: While cool sounding, your actually setting the Parasite up for extreme death by S8. Also, the option to simply attach these extra rippers...it's just not done. Every single army in the game has to deal with the same old "If you run out of room for X models, consider them destroyed. Why should the Parasite of Mortrex be the only exception in the game?
3. Synapse (PoM): Your setting yourself up for a massive fight for any rules lawyer in the game. You say that any Ripper swarm inside is scoring. They were also scoring outside of it as well. Your setting a precedent without any grounds that could retroactively force any Ripper Swarm to not score, if outside 1 model's range.
4. No Shadow in the Warp: Should I say more? Your denying an HQ the ability to passive-aggressively kill psykers. Also, setting up a scenario where you have a synapse creature without shadows in the warp.

[Fluffy bug sounding rule]: The voracious hunger of the Tyranid swarm knows no love for anything but itself. When two hive fleets come in contact, the two will fight it out to the death, the victor consuming the biomass of the other, as well as incorporating any biomorphs its victim had developed along the way.
Any army with a primary detachment of tyranids may never select allies. However, to reflect the endless size of the swarm, it simply adds the size of a standard allied detachment to each primary detachment. This means that is most standard games, the Tyranid FOC will have 1-3 HQ, 0-4 Elite, 2-8 Troop, 0-4 Fast, and 0-4 Heavy, and 0-1 Fortification.

 McNinja wrote:

2. The Parasite is already T4 with Implant attack and Rending, so adding more CC abilities won't hurt its original purpose. Also, adding the Rippers to the attacks of the Parasite is a way to make the Parasite more viable as a unit; why would you take it over, say, a Hive Tyrant or the Swarmlord? I know that every other army has to deal with the "if it can't be placed, kill it" rule, but Rippers and the Parasite are symbiotic. The whole shtick of the Parasite is rippers, I just took it one step further.

 McNinja wrote:

1. Oops I did mean for it to be Jump Infantry, thanks for pointing that out.

2. The Parasite is already T4 with Implant attack and Rending, so adding more CC abilities won't hurt its original purpose. Also, adding the Rippers to the attacks of the Parasite is a way to make the Parasite more viable as a unit; why would you take it over, say, a Hive Tyrant or the Swarmlord? I know that every other army has to deal with the "if it can't be placed, kill it" rule, but Rippers and the Parasite are symbiotic. The whole shtick of the Parasite is rippers, I just took it one step further.

3. If the Rippers are not in Synapse range, they are not scoring. Swarms are never scoring units.

4. Shadow in the Warp is now an Army Wide ability, not a unit ability.

 Unyielding Hunger wrote:

 McNinja wrote:

1. Oops I did mean for it to be Jump Infantry, thanks for pointing that out.

2. The Parasite is already T4 with Implant attack and Rending, so adding more CC abilities won't hurt its original purpose. Also, adding the Rippers to the attacks of the Parasite is a way to make the Parasite more viable as a unit; why would you take it over, say, a Hive Tyrant or the Swarmlord? I know that every other army has to deal with the "if it can't be placed, kill it" rule, but Rippers and the Parasite are symbiotic. The whole shtick of the Parasite is rippers, I just took it one step further.

3. If the Rippers are not in Synapse range, they are not scoring. Swarms are never scoring units.

4. Shadow in the Warp is now an Army Wide ability, not a unit ability.

1. It's fine. I tend to pick up on the small things like that, and it worries me sometimes.

2. The reason people should take it is that it should not itself get better, but provide more advantages to the swarm as force multipliers. I personally toss the PoM into a couple of lists for sheer shock value. Hes cheap, reliable, and when he outperforms, he really steals the show. People will shoot a Flyrant. They almost never bother with the PoM. To put things in perspective, if you are going to allow a near infinite value "Horde Deathstar" attack character in the game, his price needs to at least be tripled.

3. I finally found the spot in the BRB. They really need to mention it under swarms, rather than scoring, or at least put a reference in on the rule. So fair point there. On a site note though, rather than making it focus solely on ripper swarms, how about you focus on a simple general 24" bubble for Rippers and Sky-Slashers. That way, your not overriding a BRB rule for scoring units, rather than adding, and you also make multiple more options for horde based army listings.

4. Fair enough, missed that in the Army Wide abilities section.

 Unyielding Hunger wrote:
Onto Another Unit!

Deathleaper

Spoiler:

150 points
...............................WS...BS...S...T...W...I....A...Ld...Sv
Deathleaper...........9.....4......6...4....3...7...4...10....5+
Composition: 1 Deathleaper (Unique)
Unit Type: Infantry
Wargear: One pair of Rending Claws, one pair of Scything Talons, Reinforced Chitin, Chameleonic Skin, Flesh Hooks
Special Rules: Hit and Run, Move Through Cover, Fleet, Instinctive Behavior - Lurk, Shrouded, Pheromone Trail, Fearless, Killing Strike, "It's After Me!", "What Was That?", Where is it?", "Where'd it go?"

"It's after me!" - Choose one enemy character to be the victim of the Deathleaper's mind games, then roll a D3. The Leadership of that character is reduced by the amount rolled.

"What was that?" - All enemy models roll one less dice (to a minimum of one) when moving through Difficult Terrain.

"Where is it?" - If a model wishes to shoot at the Deathleaper, they must first see how far away it is. If it is 0-12" away, then they may shoot normally. If it is 13" -23" away from the enemy unit, it gains +1 to its Cover save. If it is 24" to 36" away, it gains +2 to its cover save, and if it is past 36" from the enemy unit it cannot be seen at all and the enemy unit may not fire this turn.

"Where'd it go?!" - If the Deathleaper ends its movement phase more than 6" from enemy models, the owning player may elect to have the Deathleaper "disappear." The Deathleaper is removed from play and placed in Reserves. It may come in automatically in the next movement phase and can be placed as per the Pheromone Trail rule.

Killing Strike: The Deathleaper rends on a 5 or 6.

1. Overpowered Difficult Terrain Checks: So, for only 10 points more, every enemy model on the field rolls one less dice on a check. I hope there are typos involved, or we may need some price hikes. *Cough Cough* 12" bubble and infantry units.

2. Strange "Where is it?": So, under the errata, it gives Shrouded. Your giving it Shrouded for free now and coming up with a new rule. Instead of making something long and complicated, why not keep the old pre-errata rule? It's always entertaining to see a guy break down and cry when he realizes he can't shoot something pretty much point blank in front of him when hes only got half the distance.

3. No Stealth: Your removing another of it's vital inborn survival mechanics. It's got a 5+ Armor save, but a permanent 4+ Cover Save that trumps it, currently. Why remove a valuable component and raise the price?

 The Shadow wrote:

There's still no tactical flexibility in it though. You are, essential, being given a choice of 2 boosts or 3 boosts for the same price. It's an obvious choice. You're not adding anything my doing the 2 for 3, when you can just make 3 Biomorphs that will have the same effect for the same price. If the player wants that certain combination, he can then take all three.

Just read the Hive Tyrant's Biomorph options, and that dual price thing is all the more evidence that it's overcomplicated and should just be simplified. You also haven't explained which value you use if you are only take the one Biomorph.