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AegisGrimm wrote: Wonder what people today would say about the old Imperial Guard "human bombs"? They were actually a thing.
I remember those they were penal legion troopers. It was around the time the IRA were using human bombs near us and I can remember it being discussed at the school wargames club and we all felt it was a pretty sick reference. But a previous poster was right it's too soon as the IG ones were for us then. 40k is supposed to be the grimmest future you can imagine but the boys of the IRA and ISIS are sick enough to bring it to life.
DalinCriid wrote: No, there ain't no soil for ISIS based IG regiments and I will try to explain why.
Nazis, Soviets, the British Empire based Regiments are there because they all represent a nation rather than a religion movement. ISIS is religion based organisation and let's not forget that prior to the Horus Heresy the Emperor removed any formed of religion by establishing the empirical imperial truth which is based on: rationalism, atheism and etc. After the Heresy, there is only one religion - the Faith in the Emperor itself.
Now, Talaran are the only ones with similarities to ISIS, but only because they are desert based warriors who are more closer to Lawrence of Arabia rather than the ISIS jihadi and etc.
Ofc, you can always convert your IG to anythin' you wanna do and paint them pink with unicorn flags.
Why can't you make it? Its too early dude. Raw subject that does not need to be pressed.
If I played a dude with an ISIS army, I would pack up and leave.
I served in afghanistan(173rd ab). and while the dogs we went up against wer'nt ISIS, they were pretty terrible "humans".
Believe me, there is nothing worth emulating.
If I saw an ISIS themed army on the table top. I would, just to clarify, ask my opponent what it is based on. If they went out of their way to make it ISIS themed, and were proud of it. I would pack my stuff up, put it in the car and return to the store with a sledgehammer. Smash said army, spit in said player's face, pay for the table I ruined and say to the owner/employee, yes I know I am banned from the store.
Buried too many friends fighting those monsters to even think that an army based off of a terror group is cool, lighthearted or funny. There is nothing cool about terrorism and yes I know that this thread is most likely troll bait, but I don't care. I find it absolutely disrespectful to everybody who has given life and limb, so that some turd could exercise their freedom of speech just to essentially spit in their faces with an ISIS based army. Yes, you can make an ISIS based army, but the real question is why?
There are tons of ways to represent a desert fighting force without being a douche.
I you want to take a bunch of Tallarn DRs, or create a custom army of "your dudes" from the Infinity Haqqislam line, paint 'em up, and have them charge a Khornate Bloodthirster screaming "EMPRAH'U ACKBAR!!!" and guns blazing, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.
Fielding them with Islamic State symbolism/banners, or painting explosives on the chests of Valkyrie aircrew, is a bit tasteless and liable to tick people off. I know I wouldn't like it.
So I'm assuming that, since this is the internet, someone's done it somewhere.
Is anyone aware of some 40k army that uses ISIS flags, imagery and 'Jihadi' style units?
If it weren't for current events I'd consider such an army kinda interesting, actually, from an aesthetic point of view; an IG army with headwraps and a 'Jihadi' look would be pretty unique and certainly give 'another side' to the Imperial Cult...
Wow. Just wow. You are aware 'Middle Eastern Culture' does not equal 'ISIS' right? I mean surely you know that practically all culture, language, symbolism, fashion et cetera et cetera predates ISIS by a number of 'centuries' and that ISIS didn't just come up with some kind of groovy fashion fad? Yeah that nice aesthetic you like - thats not ISIS. That's Middle Eastern. Jihad? Yup - look up Salah-ad-din. He fought a Jihad in 1187 against England and the Crusader States and was regarded, by Western and Eastern Lords, as one of the greatest men of the time and a true chivalrous knight. You want a 'Jihad' army - base it off him. He was a true Muslim - not these fakes who call themselves 'Islamic State' - they are simply desperate murderers who seek wealth and power and use religion as an excuse to achieve these trappings.
Henners91 wrote: Too often do you hear statements like 'Oh the Wehrmacht were only men, the SS were the bad guys, etc.'
Nope, still wrong, you've a few screws loose if you outright model your army on the Wehrmacht directly.
Yes and no - The Werhmacht undoubtedly had a high proportion of fanatics and war criminals in it's ranks and those who erred cannot be excused of their crimes. However, do not be under the illusion that every single man in the Werhmacht was an evil 'Aryan' thug. The Afrika Corps for example, was one of the few formations which was never accused of War Crimes. Indeed the British who fought them in North Africa considered them to be generally upstanding men. Indeed Erwin Rommel, 'The Desert Fox' was highly regarded by the British public for his conduct towards allied forces and for good reason - not only did he treat allied soldiers with respect - but he also is personally responsible for the majority of French Jews being spared execution during his command in France during 1944. He even argued vehemently with Hitler about it. And there were many others like him - men who went to war simply to defend their country against the 'aggressors' their leaders pointed out. Kurt Knispel, the highest scoring Tank Ace of the Second World War (Possibly even to date) had 168 confirmed kills and a further 195 unconfirmed kills yet never rose above the rank of Sergeant and was never decorated with the customary Knights Cross as other Tank Aces were. The reason? He disagreed with higher Nazi authorities and even went as far as assaulting a superior officer who he saw mistreating Soviet POW's and hence remained an NCO for his whole career in the Wehrmacht.
The same goes for the SS. You're in Britain so I gather you've heard of the Super-biker and TV Presenter/Personality Guy Martin? His grandfather - Latvian SS. Conscripted against his will into the SS he served first in the SS Artillery. However, he was then transferred into the Infantry during 1945. The reason for wasting a trained and skilled gunner in the infantry - it's likely he attempted to desert the SS due to conflicting ideals. The Latvian and Estonian Legions of the Waffen SS numbered in excess of 75,000 men who were forcibly conscripted and hated the Germans only slightly less than the Soviets. These 75,000 SS men were acquitted at the Nuremburg Trials. Of course there were others as well. One man, to my shame I cannot remember his name, explicitly enlisted in the SS Totenkopf so he could gain access to the Death Camps in order to report back to the British on SS activities. He paid for it with his life when he was exposed and executed.
TLDR - I wouldn't do an ISIS themed army if I were you - in most peoples opinions it's crass and tactless. I'd look elsewhere for inspiration if you want a Middle Eastern/Islamic themed army.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/02/24 22:10:19
Are we still talking about little plastic toy soldiers here?
You want to build a desert-raider themed army - fine...
You want to build a WWII themed army - cool, pick a side and go for it...
You want to include current century iconography and historical references to political and religious groups guilty of mass-murder and full-on no-brained evilness... WHY, WOULD YOU?!?
...And really, if you have to ask... You know the answer already!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/02/25 10:47:22
Henners91 wrote: Well just about every horrible totalitarian ideal exists as a 40k army somewhere; Nazis, Soviets, the British Empire, etc...
So I'm assuming that, since this is the internet, someone's done it somewhere.
Is anyone aware of some 40k army that uses ISIS flags, imagery and 'Jihadi' style units?
If it weren't for current events I'd consider such an army kinda interesting, actually, from an aesthetic point of view; an IG army with headwraps and a 'Jihadi' look would be pretty unique and certainly give 'another side' to the Imperial Cult...
I'd say go for it. For fluff, I would make them extremists of the imperial cult that come from a sand planet.
In a historical or real world wargaming context I could see the justification for an Isis / Daesh / Isil army.
I probably wouldn't be comfortable playing against it just because i would think as others have pointed out it's just in bad taste right now, but as I say in a real world wargame it would have a place at least.
In 40K?
It has no place at all.
I know that they are your figures and you can paint them however you want but I don't think there is any need or justification to incorporate "real world" elements into a fictional setting.
Just to be clear that goes the same for Nazi themed 40K armies, Khemer Rouge themed armies etc etc.
If it is a nod to, a parody or incorporates themes then I don't have massive problem with it, but to openly use imagery and therefore associate ideology is too much.
Yes 40K uses a lot of fascist or historical imagery - it's in context. The Imperium is not meant to be viewed as a nice place and they certainly aren't the "good guys". It's a Dystopian future and the Imperium is a fascist organisation.
However GW do not directly use real world logos or symbols.
The Aquilla obviously has connotations and is based on Roman and German / Austrian heraldry but it is a nod to rather than a carbon copy of those images.
Death Korps of Krieg are heavily influenced by both WW Belgian, French and German trench fighters.
But GW don't use direct references and actually forbid you to do so at their organised events.
They don't have any real world colour schemes, symbols or designs, they just have things that are based on or are influenced by.
Getting back on topic it is your hobby, they are your models. However it's your opponents hobby too and I for one have certain expectations when turning up for a game.
If I turn up to play a game of 40K that's exactly what i want to play. A dystopian futuristic game with tiny plastic man barbies and have a fun couple of hours.
I want to forget abbout all the problems in the real world and let my imagination run wild playing a narrative game where nobody is really the good guy or the bad guy, where I can switch off and most importantly have fun.
I wouldn't be able to do that if my Ultramarines were fighting Isis, or Nazis, or any other real world army.
I wouldn't go to the extremes that some othets have suggested although in this context I can see why feelings would run so high.
It's just not the sort of game I would want to play, so I wouldn't play it.
I also don't think it's a vary good advert for the hobby either.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/02/25 12:29:19
AllSeeingSkink wrote: This thread was dead for 3 months, did we really have to dig it up again?
No.
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
EAT - SLEEP - FARM - REPEAT 
~2800 points 
