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2020/09/27 06:19:07
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Nitro Zeus wrote: i like the initial concept, but that list looks all over the place. Whats the point in wings if you've dedicated all those points into 4 different defensive bubbles that they want to be sitting in? Max devourers on Flyrants? Basically means you've completely wasted all the CC stats that you are paying for. And the only one with a CC weapon and Warlord trait too, you gave the -1 to be SHOT relic, when he will be the only one who should be spending time in CC.
If you want to put a defensive wall in the middle of the table and make stuff come to you, you need more wounds. You have essentially 5 MC's and none are shooting back. Scoring is more important than ever, but this list will utterly lose an attrition war in no time even if you do manage hold the midtable for first turn or even two - which I wouldn't even say is a given. I would strongly consider losing the unnecessary upgrades and trimming a couple of things, to thicken it out with a pair of Exocrine's, or something especially since you have all that defense in place for them.
I was just reading the general rulebook and apparently you cannot cast psychic powers after you ' fall back'. Thats a big deal-breaker for a flying hive tyrant, so I just might drop the whole idea anyway.
2020/10/03 09:50:19
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Option 1:
Deploy the meiotic close to the enemies frontline behind cover (outside 9 inch if possible) and if you get first turn move the first big unit (9 bombs) forward and use metabolic overdrive if needed... Second unit also moves forward and if needed I can cast onslaught on them to help them assault. Assault moves are not limited (have to move closer to the...) so the spores could assault a small unit that has been shot to pieces and use the assault move to simply move within 3 inch of another juicy unit.
The unit with 3 meiotic spores can be deployed on an objective if I really want to make sure it does not get claimed by scouts and the like.. Or I can assault a small unit and try to kill it and remove it from the objective.
If the enemy is not able to target the spore mines behind cover then even if the get first turn, the will be a great threat.
Option 2:
Facing a very fast army or an army with lots of anti-infantry indirect shooting I could put the two big units of meiotic spores in reserves and let them drop in with the lictor (stratagem). Cast synaptic lure on an enemy unit and try to get the spore mines an extra d6 for assault with the blood of baal stratagems. I need the flying hive to assault the same target of shoot down a single model with the venom cannon. Lictor can also use a stratagem for an extra +1 assault and no overwatch. This way I could lock a unit in close combat and prevent the enemy unit from overwatching the spore mines.
I might drop the flying hive and get more bodies for objective grabbing but I first got to test this... Really like the Kraken and Kronos combi but I could also go full kraken brigade and get another 4 command points....
2020/10/08 05:05:48
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Option 2:
Facing a very fast army or an army with lots of anti-infantry indirect shooting I could put the two big units of meiotic spores in reserves and let them drop in with the lictor (stratagem). Cast synaptic lure on an enemy unit and try to get the spore mines an extra d6 for assault with the blood of baal stratagems. I need the flying hive to assault the same target of shoot down a single model with the venom cannon. Lictor can also use a stratagem for an extra +1 assault and no overwatch. This way I could lock a unit in close combat and prevent the enemy unit from overwatching the spore mines.
Can't use pheromone trail on spore mines to drop them next to a lictor. It only works on infantry, which spore mines are not.
My personal experience is that meiotic spores are great for screening out infiltrators, like vanguard space marines. However treat them managing to blow up as a reward for getting first turn. If you go second, they aren't going to survive, barring very favourable terrain placement.
Ah damn, I thought it was tyranid unit... but you are right..
2020/11/01 08:12:07
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Oh god I hope you can use this in a tournament setting. Always wanted to play my Flying hives + swarmlord + Tyrant gaurd army....
Question: Adeptive Physiology states that you can take it instead of determining a warlord trait for your warlord. Can you still use the alpha leader beast stratagem (leviathan) to get an extra warlord trait? And can you switch this for another adeptive physiology?
2021/12/16 15:14:03
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
So between the sporocysts and harpies and biovores you can spawn up to 24 spore mines a turn, which all have a 5++.
The list also has a whole lotta str5 shooting at AP-1. 28 deathspitters and 4 stranglers comes out to over 100 shots on average with a whole lotta +1 to hit if you need it.
Not a huge amount of melee pressence, relying on only the warriors and the hive tyrant, but with so many spore mines on the table and the harpies and hive tyrant flying around you opponents wont have much board control.
I like weird lists! I only believe that the sporocyst cannot get detachment rules because they're fortifications, right?
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (1)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (2)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (3)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (4)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (5)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (6)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (7)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (8)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (9)
Transport: Tyrannocyte with deathspitters (10)
2021/12/19 13:12:46
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
isn't one of the best things about the new monster list rules that you actually can use the leviathan stratagem (Hive mind imperative) to make a MC objective secured, in combination with counting as an amount of models compared to the (remaining) wounds? A flying hive tyrant could count as 12 models with objective secured after flying within range of the backfield objective. That is a really powerful combo.
2021/12/21 10:35:51
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Everybody is talking about individual units but not a lot about synergy and tactics. It is all about the objectives and not (only) about killing.
What kind of list can take on ad mech (lascannon chickens), Drukhari raiders or Talos army, Ork "right in your face first turn" army, thousand sons mortal wound spam, grey knight dreadknight army and (future) Tau shooting?
2021/12/23 06:36:20
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
pinecone77 wrote:
THat is what we are talking about...just in a circular way. Nids are winning top tables by playing the mission, and maxing secondaries. So a full understanding of what has been added, and what has been taken away is needed. Nidzilla needs help for the secondaries.
You can flood the center with Carnifexen, and use your Beatstick Tyrant to pick off backfield units. But getting on all fronts is an "issue" Mawlock looks like a solution, also our "never use" flyers, might be useful
Test games must be fought to find the perfect mix, but just having Nidzilla as an option is very nice.
Not a lot of winning for the Tyranids apart from shooty Hive guard list. These new monster-list rules will make some waves but will also increase the amount of anti-tank/mc shooting. I don't believe that a bunch of carnifexes can win even when they're are a bit tougher now.
Razerous wrote:Wings on a hive tyrant? I'm guessing we have tougher faster units with the heirodule & Dima.
Hive tyrant flies 16 inch and got 4++ inv. save. So it depends...
Razerous wrote:The swarmlord does look really fun. Can you give it biomorphic carapace?
No. "Named characters such as the Swarmlord, Old One Eye, Deathleaper and the Red Terror cannot be given any of the following Bio-artefacts"
Razerous wrote:Hive Guard are still an excellent pick, right?
Yep, indirect heavy shooting is very good but you also need to have the tools to get the objectives.
What's better for mobility; Harpy, Mawloc or other?
Mobility? Harpy can be made Obj secured (leviathan stratagem) and steal objectives but can also be shot down. Mawloc can actually deepstrike within 1 inch and steal objectives right away and count as 12 models (wounds) but cannot be made obj secured in that same turn (command phase). After that the mawloc is just a distraction but now with 5++ and -1 damage harder to remove from the objective.
2021/12/24 07:36:50
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Azuza001 wrote:I mean, I have been running a brood of 9 warriors with the adaptive to give them +2 to armor in cover then run jormungunder so they are always in cover since the psycic awakening has been out. Between them just with 3w and the strat to reduce dmg by 1 to them, and a tyrand lord for +1 to bs to them that blob has never disappointed me. So yeah 1 Warrior blob is awaome.
@Azura001: Big warrior units are tough but it is a big investment and the damage output is very low. The opponent simply focus on the other tyranid units and start killing the warriors at round 3+.
I had a lot of discussion with Nilai in the past about warriors and even his confidence is crumbling now:
Niiai wrote:Melee tyrants needs wings. IMHO.
I also aquiered 6 new warriors. (I have 18 from before.) I wanted to do 3x2 scything tallons and the +1 bs. But is that really worth 66 points? I am growing unsure and loosing confidence.
Even now when there are more tyranid warrior upgrades, the don't cut it in my opinion. I would field them as cheap troops in my monster list so 3 of them with talons and nothing more (apart from synaptic link upgrade if needed). Keep them in the backfield on the objectives and let the big beasties go to town.
2021/12/24 13:09:14
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Warriors are an entirely different beast in a crusher stampede list. They loose their usual adaption (beeing on cover, or leviathan, both witch are excelent) but they gain 5++, witch does only kick in VS high ap weapons. They also gain a cp upgrade that is insane, for 1 CP they get permanent ws2+ bs3+, and this stacks with +1 to hit from a warrior synaptic lure or a prime. A blob that hits on 2+ (and can shoot again after your hive guards are dead) yes please.
They are also the only legal troop choise. And the cheapest unit you can field. But you need to match each one with a monster. And they share that tax with other potensial units: Lictors, hive guard, tyrant guard(?), neuronthropes, zonathropes and prime. With the cheapest good monster beeing the dakka carnifex at 120 points you are building and entirely different list then what we usual talk about. There is no MSU here. Troops that where our biggest strength is gone, and we might want more then 3 heavy support slots.
In addition to this you need to juggle synaptic upgrades. Warriors and malrceptor beeing the winners.
The biggest difference to warrior comparison is that all your other monsters just got hit with steroids. - 1 damage is huge for all. 5++ is huge for some.
Comparing regular warriors to crushing stampede warriors is a mistake. They are such entirely different beasts.
You don't have to list the rules... we know the rules and that doesn't say anything about if the work or not. You can increase the WS or BS but it is still not a great unit. With deatspitters and 2+ to hit they're a decent anti-infantry unit but even that is debatable if you compare them with other units. Anything you invest in them (inv save, feel no pain, reroll to hit, extra movement et cetera) is better used on other units. Apart from the warrior prime investment a full warrior unit with deathspitters and boneswords + synaptic link is about 240 points. Thats just as much as a scythed hierodule.
Give me a full armylist and make the argument how the can work with all the other tyranid units you field. Maybe it works for you in your casual vacuum bubble but I don't see how the work in any tournament setting apart from fielding cheap 3 warrior talon units with 5++ inv save in the stampede lists with possibly the synaptic link upgrade.
2021/12/26 06:45:47
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Razerous wrote: When I explored the Assassin Tyrant, I was drawn to the invulerable-ignoring bone swords. After reviewing the (admittedly costly in CP) potential of a Hive Tyrant buffed by 2D3 attacks, I realised it can take down mortarion. Which is insane.
By ignoring the invunerable save, stacking murderous size along with the +D3 WLT & psychic power and spending a fair few CP on Thunderous impact, Voracious appetite, War on all fronts (a bit tricky, granted), Relentless Flurry and.... implant attack to finish it off? Thunderous impact with the +1 damage (big) and +1 to-wound (huge!) really help.
Assuming average of +4 attacks on 2D3 and no defensive strategems from Morty. But still.. that's insane.
I'm in love. Now I need to work out how to not fail on secondaries.
Thats a big investment for a unit that can be shot down with lascannons. I would rather make it tougher so that he may actually get in close combat. -1 to wound (carapace) might be better. regular monsterous boneswords with the extra d3 attacks and other stratagem upgrades already kills a lot of units. So many good stratagems that I rather use the neural lobe relic so that i get more CP!
Nitro Zeus wrote:Hmm thx. I found the stampede rules, not sold at all. Cool addition to the game for people who wanna play like that though.
I think the 'count as a model for every wound regarding objectives' is pretty good in combination with the leviathan stratagem to make one unit objective secured. This really helps with primary objectives. I think that is going to make some waves but it is not going to win tournaments, i guess. Lot's of lascannons and melta weapons don't care about -1 damage and a 5++ save.
2021/12/27 11:07:40
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Eihnlazer wrote: Its not about the new lazcannons, its about how all the D2 and D3 weapons get affected by the -1d. There are alot of D2 and D3 in the game which get absolutely wrecked by -1d.
It also does help against meltas and lazcannons.
Lazcannons now have a 33% chance to do 1 damage and a 0% chance to do 6.
Super laz go down to D3+2 and meltas in half range are only D6+1.
Combined with the -1 to be wounded relic, our hive tyrants are alot more survivable.
Poor custodes used to poon nids that didnt spam hive guard and zoans, now a custodes player is sweating hard against the crusher stampede.
that's all true but you still got to do damage yourself or keep claiming objectives up to round 5, or else the enemy simply needs 4 turns to take them out instead of 3. Against ad mech lascannon chickens, ork mek gunz, dark lances/blasters, melta rifles, plasma redemptors et cetera, the damage output is all over the place. I once lost 3 armingers turn one because the ork player got 20+ shots with his 5 mek guns and also a high damage result. A simple 5+ inv could prevent 5 wounds so if you're lucky with your rolls that could also prevent a lot of damage. It is very swingy (is that an English word??).
I also play thousand sons and I would fear the 10 terminators with full shooting power and the +1 to wound stratagem. Storm bolters with 1 damage and -2 ap don't care about the -1 damage and 5++, apart from all the extra mortal wounds..
But back to tactics...
I'am going to try the following list because i would like to see how long this tough bubble can last:
EL: 5 tyrant guard
EL: 6 tyrant guard (procency of the hive stratagem- ignore -1 and -2ap upgrade)
EL: Maleceptor
HY: Scythed hierodule
I'am going to move them as one big bubble towards mid-field and tough them up with -1 strenght against shooting (maleceptor), 1- to hit, -1 damage for MC with stampede and other upgrades (Catalyst, 4++, cover from the broodlord synaptic link upgrade).
I should be able to take two rounds of shooting before everything attacks!
Would like to try this...
2021/12/28 08:55:01
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
This list is amazing btw, tabled another tyranid players crusher swarm on turn 4. It can start slow and needs to be careful with deployment against strong shooting armies, but will utterly out-attrition other elite builds and really mess up the movement of infantry heavy stuff. Light transports go down with no problem so its not worried about harlies and deldar either.
Very situational...
Sporocyst don't get detachment rules, right (fortifications)? So no -1 damage and 5++ for them...
You need first turn and not face a lot of enemy units that can fly because otherwise it gets tough. If an Ork player gets first turn and moves agressive then the own the mid field and you're done.
Enemy players need to sacrifice units against spore mines so that the detonate all against that specific unit or model. A smart player knows this but other players might be out of their comfort zone and don't know how to deal with this. Nothing more fun then blocking a big knight from moving forward with 3 spore mines. You shall not pass!!!!
2021/12/28 14:24:49
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Eihnlazer wrote: They do get detachment rules, since they are monsters. Your thinking about Auxillary Super Heavy detachments (which do not benefit from hive fleet rules).
Rulebook:
DETACHMENT ABILITIES
Every Codex lists a set of abilities that units in a Detachment gain if every unit in that Detachment is from a specified Faction. Units in Auxiliary Support Detachments, Super-heavy Auxiliary Detachments and Fortification Network Detachments never gain any Detachment abilities, even if every unit in that Detachment is from the Faction specified.
All the biovore spores are single man units so you cant really bait them or shoot them effectively. The 3 man units from the sporocysts will all pop at the same time, but the mortals they deal are not limited to only the models within 3" (the rule says when the spore explodes it deals damage ot the nearest enemy unit, not the one that triggered the explosion).
Oh yeah, now I remember the whole spore mine exploding discussions from the past. I don't agree with this but no reason to get into this again. It really needed a faq.
2021/12/28 18:42:48
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Niiai wrote: [spoiler]I tryed crusher stampede. 2000 VS Death Guard.
Looking for advice for better range weapons VS death guard on a general all comers list.............Suggestions are welcome.
It's not about better range weapons... you got to look at your armylist as a whole and the strategy you use to claim the objectives. What do you want to achieve at the end of turn 2 ...and 3....and 4? You cannot simply move forward and kill stuff and see where that get's you. With this armylist you simply give the opponent the oppertunity to kill stuff one by one and you just as well paint big bull's eyes on them. Having tough MC is not enough if you cannot do damage yourself, it just takes them a bit longer to kill them.
You want better shooting? Look for hive guard list that are purely focussed on getting the most out of indirect shooting. The rest is rather.. meh... I also like to have one devourer flying hive tyrant to remove cheap infantry but the tyrannofex, exocrine and hive crone are not really impressive units.
2022/01/05 16:35:29
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Niiai wrote: I am not so shure. Once you pay 1 CP for it the earliest you get it refunded is turn 2.
You roll a d6 for each CP the opponent uses and get a CP on a 5+. This can happen in turn 1 so what do you mean? Most times you profit from extra CP's. I might reconsider if I needed to pick the lobe as the third relic and pay 2 CP for that.
2022/01/06 12:25:24
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Niiai wrote: I am not so shure. Once you pay 1 CP for it the earliest you get it refunded is turn 2.
You roll a d6 for each CP the opponent uses and get a CP on a 5+. This can happen in turn 1 so what do you mean? Most times you profit from extra CP's. I might reconsider if I needed to pick the lobe as the third relic and pay 2 CP for that.
There is a cap on how much CP you can get in a round.
Yes but that can happen at turn 1. You claim that the earliest you get it refunded is turn 2.
2022/01/06 14:07:05
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Niiai wrote: I have you blocked shogun. So your posts just turn up as compromised. But I thought maiby I am to harsh and checked the remark. And you clearny understand what I am saying, you are just looking to bicker.
Most importantly you do not adress the actual argument that you are paying 1 CP for the relic, and you might not get much out of it before the important turns are over. Especially on an army that eat so much CP as tyranids.
Bicker? I simply genuinely didn't understand why you would say that the refund start at turn 2.
Adeptive neural lobe:
While the bearer is on the battlefield, each time your opponent spends a Command point to use a Stratagem, you can roll one D6: on a 5+, you gain 1 Command point.
So if the opponent uses 3 CP in the first battle round at average you already get 1 CP back. Most competitive armylist trow a lot of CP around at the first round. So if you pay 1 CP for this relic I think it is a good deal because even if you don't get to round 4 it is most likely that you profit from it in round 2 and 3. Like I said, if you pick this as a third relic (stratagem: 1extra relic = 1CP 2 extra relic = 3CP) then I might reconsider..... I rather have 2 CP then maybe 3+CP.
Niiai wrote: I rather think it will be a long time before I click on the read button on people I ignore. Apolegies to you others.
If you don't want to read my stuff than don't read it. Just don't call me rude or say that I bicker because you disagree with me.
2022/01/07 07:56:54
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
TR: 3 warriors with talons, Synaptic link bioweapon bond
TR: 3 warriors with talons, Synaptic link bioweapon bond
TR: 3 warriors with talons
EL: 3 venomthropes
FA: Dimachaeron
FA: Dimachaeron
FA: Dimachaeron
HY: Scythed Hierodule
HY: Scythed Hierodule
Big beasty list, I think I would drop the venomthropes and free some points (drop the synaptic link on the warriors and switch to a talon hive tyrant) to add a malanthrope.
2022/01/07 10:25:05
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Niiai wrote: Are you pretty shure to get it refunded by turn 1? Tyranids pretty much want to emty out quite fast. But other armies are not that CP dependent. If they use one stratagem turn one that is 33% to get it back. The same in the later turns when they start at 0 and they only get the 1 CP a turn.
My point beeing the relic is very far from a guaranteed 5 CP. And considering you often pay 1 CP to get it it is very far from a guaranteed 4 cp. If the game is over turn 2 (some games are) it is even worse. You are paying 1 CP to hope to get 2 back before the game is over.
While the relic certainly is nice it is not an autoinclude. And not nesaseraly a reason to be leviathan in a CS list.
What Niiai Fails to understand is that a stampede list really benefits from the Leviathan Hive mind Imperative stratagem apart from a few other great stratagems. So you might rather have a few extra CP at turn 3 or 4 (also because the stampede stratagems are so good!) then another second relic. If the game relies on 1 CP after the first battle round and is decided at turn 2 you already got a big win or it went really wrong.
It also depends if you just want to win the game or also want a high score, like in a tournament setting. For a high score you need to go for the objectives and might want to save the CP to keep using hive mind imperative at turn 3+. You could also do this with the +1 CP that you get in each command phase of course..
2022/01/08 06:54:35
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
TR: 3 warriors with talons, Synaptic link bioweapon bond
TR: 3 warriors with talons, Synaptic link bioweapon bond
TR: 3 warriors with talons
EL: 3 venomthropes
FA: Dimachaeron
FA: Dimachaeron
FA: Dimachaeron
HY: Scythed Hierodule
HY: Scythed Hierodule
Big beasty list, I think I would drop the venomthropes and free some points (drop the synaptic link on the warriors and switch to a talon hive tyrant) to add a malanthrope.
Is the malenthrope meta dependant? It makes your bugs harder to kill (and let's say 2-3 big bugs max, or can you squeeze more into range?) and has some slight offensive power & board presence. But you could have a third hive tyrant; or an extra harpy or mawloc?
As you're thinking about a malenthrope, how about you drop a Dima and the venomthropes for a Malenthrope & a bunch of (4) hive guard? Then spare points for some adrenal glands.
This is just a list that I found that did well in a tournament... and I think I would simply switch the venomthropes and some extra points for a malanthrope. It could be better to invest the points in more "in your face" MC's but I think I like the -1 to hit against ork shooting.
2022/01/24 07:47:54
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
To answer that question Lord Blackscale, I played a game yesterday with Stampede against Custodes and took 82-35 win. Also note, I did NOT use Hive Guard in this list. I think Tyrannofex with some Leviathan combos make him pretty deadly.
It looks like fun but I think it would not work in a competitive setting. Lists with any decent amount of shooting that get first turn can take you out. I play thousand sons with 10 terminators and in combination with mortal wounds, I can take out 4 MC each turn. Also shooty orks with waagh can really bring in the pain.
The forgeworld models work better because they're faster, ignore terrain and got toughness 8. Carnifexes and haruspex need an extra turn to get in close combat and the cannot affort that.
2022/01/25 06:36:07
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Third_Age_of_Baggz wrote: Decent shooting will work versus any army to be fair.
Don't get me wrong, I always liked the tyranid MC-lists. I'am actually looking for a way to play the 3x flying hive tyrant list and swarmlord.
But a competitive army either needs to go for the kill or don't mind what get's killed and simply win objectives. Most games are decided at the end of turn 3 and a slow moving carnifex/haruspex close combat army is just lining up to get murdered. You don't really deal any damage and cannot maintain objectives. In a casual setting? Sure go for it.
Niiai wrote:I tryed to run the numbers on the carnifex VS a dreadnought........ While a regular dreadnought does not see play, it is consievable that the 5++ is enough to justefy the carnifex as playable.
This is Niiai saying: Dreadnoughts don't see play so the suck... but the carnifex is better so that makes them playable.... great tactical insight... wow..
2022/03/16 06:43:17
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Use augmented ferocity (hunt Biomorphologie) for +1 charge.
Could use 'shard lure' stratagem for extra d6 charge against enemy unit (hit with shooting attack from a synapse creature)
Lictor pops up and unit(s) of spore mines deepstrike near...
Lictor charge juicy enemy unit with +1 and reroll charge.. (and possible extra d6 from shard lure)
Lictor gets in close combat and use the pheromon trail stratagem (other units get +2 charge against that enemy unit)
spore mines charge with +3 charge and possible extra d6 from shard lure.
Don't know how the are going to update the forgeworld meiotic spores, and how the current spore mine rules work, but could be cool...
EDIT: ah never mind... no charges anymore....
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/03/16 09:27:45
2022/03/16 15:08:56
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Spreelock wrote: Hey guys, what do you think of this build? I wanted to share it here, rather than in army list section, to discuss tactics and maybe develope it further.
Tactics:
Biovores and rippers deploy on home objectives, lictors deep strike behind enemy lines and do some action. Tervigons and termagants advance in flanks and provide firesupport. Warriors, zoanthropes, exocrine and tyrant deploy at the middle and move midfield. The parasite of mortrex is a distraction unit.
I've got psychic imperative for every turn to use, my plan is to use zoanthrope's warp shielding, if I go second, and tervigon's movement boost if I go first.
CP allocation (17 during the course of game)
- 1 for extra trait
- 5x1 for endless swarm (every turn, bring back 3+d3 gaunts)
- 5x1 for relentless flurry (every turn, exploding sixes when shooting)
- 5x1 for additional cast (every turn, zoanthropes cast hive nexus and smite)
- 1 reserved for void in the warp (deny on 4+)
- extras generated by relic can be used for rerolls
I think the damage output is pretty low. Against soft enemy armylists you could simply win the mission but any decent shooting list can take you out fairy quick. Tyranids got some tough units now but the cannot walk slowly towards the enemy for 3 turns.
2022/03/17 07:11:31
Subject: Re:Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
A blob of 2 tyrant guard units with hive tyrants, maleceptor, malanthrope and broodlord deploy mid field - deployment zone. Deploy the tyrant guard in light cover and activate broodlord synaptic imperative the got the following:
Jormungandr adaptation: count as dense cover outside 12 inch (-1 to hit)
extra adaptive: extra +1 save in cover
Broodlord synaptic imperative: light cover counts as heavy cover (+1 save in melee)
Keep them close to the malanthrope (-1 to hit)
First turn: Maleceptor possible -1 Strenght against shooting
So these tyrant guard got a 2+ save with 2 bonus saves. Who needs invulnerable saves! Don't know if the extra -1 to hit from the malanthrope is worth it but maybe it could work against Tau armies. -2 to hit with a +1 to hit from markerlights remains a -1 to hit.
First turn I can drop a Tyrannocyte with 5 tyrant guard mid field and cast the catalyst on them. The Hive tyrants fly towards these tyrant guards for protection and get ready for the next turn for an all out assault.
Possible moves:
boomerang Hive tyrant: fly towards the enemy, kill everything and use the 'Overrun stratagem' to move back towards the tyrant guard for protection.
Tyrannocyte: this is a synaptic creature and can shoot at a target. 'Shard lure' stratagem give any tyranid unit +d6 charge (pick the two highest) against that enemy unit.
The reaper of obliterax is sick!: Every wound is a +1 mortal wound and every attack allocated to a enemy unit cannot prevent wounds.
With lashwhip (reroll 1 to hit), Pincer Tail (reroll 1 hit or wound) and extra stratagem upgrades (+d3 attacks, reroll to wound, extra mortal wounds after charging...) this kills stuff!
I don't think that you can claim that the mortal wounds are also attacks/wounds that cannot get prevented. If this is the case then this model can remove 3 custodus bikes in one go!
Possible strategy: I might drop the scythes of tyran and go for the 'Dirgeheart of kharis' relic. I could pick territorial instinct adeptive and make monsterous creatures objective secured and with the relic I can switch off objective secured on a enemy unit (in close combat). This way I could keep scoring the objectives if I encounter armylist that really go for the objectives and try to ignore my units.
I have to give this a try!
EDIT: switched the WLT to another model
EDIT 2: corrected the heavy cover save bonus
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/03/17 12:01:22
2022/03/17 12:03:00
Subject: Codex Tyranids Tactica: The Shadow Falls, The Hive Fleets Gather. Worlds Devoured
Madjob wrote: Three bonus saves? You're maxing at +2 from ranged attacks when in a light cover terrain feature, and +2 from melee attacks when in light cover with the Broodlord imperative active or in actual hard cover.
Ah thats right! Never played a lot with heavy cover and always thought that it was a +1 save against shooting. But a +2 save in close combat is also good! Thanks!
Nids are winning top tables by playing the mission, and maxing secondaries. So a full understanding of what has been added, and what has been taken away is needed. Nidzilla needs help for the secondaries.
