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The TLDR response; people are stupid. It's Facebook, do you seriously think anyone cares what some random people on a facebook page say? You gotta at least be president or head of a fortune 500 company before anyone with a degree of self esteem gives a damn about opinions on social media

As you've said yourself, you might be able to find strands of thought influenced by Marxism in municipal snowploughing, but nobody sits down and titles the 'Neo-Marxist, Neo-Hegelist, Neo-Liberalist, Neo-Keynesian etcetcetcetc Theory of Municipal Snowploughing'. You'd fill ten pages with the word 'Neo' trying to describe every intellectual ancestor before you completed the first sentence.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:It's neo-Marxist in the sense that it's evolved from "classical" Marxism's focus on economic class as the centerpiece of conflict to gender class as the primary driver of societal conflicts. There's a clear line of evolution from the ideas of Marx to modern Feminism and more or less the standard accepted definition in political science.

I'd add that at this point, basically everything (including market capitalism) is neo-Marxist under the proposed definition of neo-Marxism. You'd be hard pressed to find basically anything in the modern world that hasn't derived something from Marx's work. The guy wrote a lot, theorized a lot, and influenced a lot. Even his opponents ultimately used his social modeling theories to oppose his economic theories past a certain point. The guy is basically one of the ground bed's of the modern world (seriously, history, economics, sociology, geography, statistics this guy touched everything to varying degrees) whether you like him or not*. Which is exactly why throwing "neo-Marxist" around in this discussion seems to say a lot more about the people talking than what they're talking about.

*ignoring that most people sum his entire life's work up into a very narrow collection of his economic writing, completely ignoring all of his own contributions to numerous fields.

Vaktathi wrote:Generally, anything involving a youtube personality like Sargon and phrases like "tumblr femnism" is inherently intended to be a poop throwing contest beneath a thin veneer plausible deniability against a shadow-spectre, mostly intended to milk Trevor's Axiom for financial benefit as people go apeshit and throw resources into a contrived social fight that benefits nobody. A caustic Youtube personality squaring off against a random Facebook group is the stuff that should be left to comments on those services, because they don't have any greater meaning than that.

As for how it relates to 40k, 40k is a dystopian nightmare of a universe, nothing good happens to anyone regardless of their identities. For my own part, I don't exactly see 40k embracing "tumblr feminism", their ideas and writing quality have diminished dramatically over the years, but hardly in any direction that could be pointed to in the way that is attempting to be portrayed.

Which just begs why this thread is still here (the thread title alone screams "lock it"). I knew the moment I clicked on it it was going to be someone with a piss poor understanding of feminism, confirmed in the first sentence with "3rd wave feminism or "tumblr feminism" as if somehow tumblr was some special brand instead of just some place really stupid people go to talk about ideas they poorly understand in general, playing a really stupid semantical game to argue a straw man. When a thread starts arguing a straw man from the OP we all know it isn't going to go anywhere.

 daedalus wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 daedalus wrote:
He does have a pretty reasonable argument though with regards to Catachan and Voystroyan.

Yep he does with catachan, it would work for them quite easily, he is wrong with vostroyan though, they would just lack mustaches, other than that the big hats and other gear would hide the female body and just the face would show.

take a look

Well, I was thinking specifically of the moustaches, but since you came with a picture: I feel like a lot of those chins are also exaggerated in a masculine manner.

Of course, I also have the benefit of staring at a static high resolution picture, not a 1" tall miniature from 3 feet away, so I dunno.

Catachans have the benefit of not having chest rigs or other body drama (armour), that is one of the main things that completely covers the breasts and chest, so with a female model you would not see the bewbs at all, not even a hint, unless they have massive massive bewbs (I know a couple of poor girls like this and they have to ware the same size chest rig as me... poor sods), and even then you only see a slight difference still.

so heavy fatigues, body armour, webbing etc. all hide the female form pretty well under all that equipment, the best guard I have seen are the Elysians as any one of them could be a woman.

in 28mm unless you want to exagerate the female body you are not going to see the hip difference, the smock hides it, you wont see the bewbs, the armour covers it, you wont see the hair as they should be wearing a helm (SHOULD!!!!), that basically leaves the face.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Denny wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

um... what are you talking about???

There are no plastic female Imperial Guardsmen. They are all blokes.

Someone comes along and says 'Ah this sucks. I'd like some female guardsmen. Why aren't they represented?'

Your response: 'Meh, they would look the same.'

How does this address their concern?
They never said they wanted models that look excessively female. They haven't asked for boobs or butts or any of that. They just want GW to release some female guardsmen, not to pretend the male guardsmen are female,

I mean you can pretend that all Space Marines are female (under that armour who can tell?) but this in no way refutes someone's objection that there are no female space marines.

The issue is 'why no women' not 'I like moar bewbs please'

Because they are represented, its your personal bias that claims they are not there, eldar, tau, guard, all have female models, if you CHOOSE to ignore that it is female under the armour, thats your hang up mate, not the games issue.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 LordofHats wrote:
The TLDR response; people are stupid. It's Facebook, do you seriously think anyone cares what some random people on a facebook page say? You gotta at least be president or head of a fortune 500 company before anyone with a degree of self esteem gives a damn about opinions on social media

As you've said yourself, you might be able to find strands of thought influenced by Marxism in municipal snowploughing, but nobody sits down and titles the 'Neo-Marxist, Neo-Hegelist, Neo-Liberalist, Neo-Keynesian etcetcetcetc Theory of Municipal Snowploughing'. You'd fill ten pages with the word 'Neo' trying to describe every intellectual ancestor before you completed the first sentence.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:It's neo-Marxist in the sense that it's evolved from "classical" Marxism's focus on economic class as the centerpiece of conflict to gender class as the primary driver of societal conflicts. There's a clear line of evolution from the ideas of Marx to modern Feminism and more or less the standard accepted definition in political science.

I'd add that at this point, basically everything (including market capitalism) is neo-Marxist under the proposed definition of neo-Marxism. You'd be hard pressed to find basically anything in the modern world that hasn't derived something from Marx's work. The guy wrote a lot, theorized a lot, and influenced a lot. Even his opponents ultimately used his social modeling theories to oppose his economic theories past a certain point. The guy is basically one of the ground bed's of the modern world (seriously, history, economics, sociology, geography, statistics this guy touched everything to varying degrees) whether you like him or not*. Which is exactly why throwing "neo-Marxist" around in this discussion seems to say a lot more about the people talking than what they're talking about.

*ignoring that most people sum his entire life's work up into a very narrow collection of his economic writing, completely ignoring all of his own contributions to numerous fields.

Vaktathi wrote:Generally, anything involving a youtube personality like Sargon and phrases like "tumblr femnism" is inherently intended to be a poop throwing contest beneath a thin veneer plausible deniability against a shadow-spectre, mostly intended to milk Trevor's Axiom for financial benefit as people go apeshit and throw resources into a contrived social fight that benefits nobody. A caustic Youtube personality squaring off against a random Facebook group is the stuff that should be left to comments on those services, because they don't have any greater meaning than that.

As for how it relates to 40k, 40k is a dystopian nightmare of a universe, nothing good happens to anyone regardless of their identities. For my own part, I don't exactly see 40k embracing "tumblr feminism", their ideas and writing quality have diminished dramatically over the years, but hardly in any direction that could be pointed to in the way that is attempting to be portrayed.

Which just begs why this thread is still here (the thread title alone screams "lock it"). I knew the moment I clicked on it it was going to be someone with a piss poor understanding of feminism, confirmed in the first sentence with "3rd wave feminism or "tumblr feminism" as if somehow tumblr was some special brand instead of just some place really stupid people go to talk about ideas they poorly understand in general, playing a really stupid semantical game to argue a straw man. When a thread starts arguing a straw man from the OP we all know it isn't going to go anywhere.

The thread has been mostly polite so far, I have disagreed with some people but on the whole its still quite possitive, so why lock it?

 Formosa wrote:

 daedalus wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 daedalus wrote:
He does have a pretty reasonable argument though with regards to Catachan and Voystroyan.

Yep he does with catachan, it would work for them quite easily, he is wrong with vostroyan though, they would just lack mustaches, other than that the big hats and other gear would hide the female body and just the face would show.

take a look

Well, I was thinking specifically of the moustaches, but since you came with a picture: I feel like a lot of those chins are also exaggerated in a masculine manner.

Of course, I also have the benefit of staring at a static high resolution picture, not a 1" tall miniature from 3 feet away, so I dunno.

Catachans have the benefit of not having chest rigs or other body drama (armour), that is one of the main things that completely covers the breasts and chest, so with a female model you would not see the bewbs at all, not even a hint, unless they have massive massive bewbs (I know a couple of poor girls like this and they have to ware the same size chest rig as me... poor sods), and even then you only see a slight difference still.

so heavy fatigues, body armour, webbing etc. all hide the female form pretty well under all that equipment, the best guard I have seen are the Elysians as any one of them could be a woman.

in 28mm unless you want to exagerate the female body you are not going to see the hip difference, the smock hides it, you wont see the bewbs, the armour covers it, you wont see the hair as they should be wearing a helm (SHOULD!!!!), that basically leaves the face.

Of course not those from renowned regiments like the Catachan's, Mordian, Armgeddon Ork Hunters and Tanith who don't wear body armour or helmets - but yeah plenty who do - Cadian, Steel Legion, Death Korps

To a great extent it is a duplicate of the thread over in 40D Discussions, which I've already had to lock because it was all getting off topic.

This thread is getting On Topic (of pict of small plastic soldier models) so I'm going to lock this one too.

If people want to discuss the benefits of different styles of male and female "future soldier" figures, you can make a new thread in Dakka Discussions.