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 Huron black heart wrote:

 JamesY wrote:
Had a massive game once and it was awful. It was a great social get together, but the game was dire, and I'd never do it again.

Exactly my experience. Took an age to set up, let alone the time to play each turn, people lost interest, didn't care, absolutely no tactics to speak of. Waste of a day.

a good apoc games absolutely requires strict time limits and a agreed upon official who everybody agrees to just follow thier ruling and move on. strict schedule for set up, turn time limits etc. I enjoy them but not adhering to time limits makes for sides losing interest. In the last one I participated in we did the gathering storm the fall of Cadia. 8' x 48' table, 16 players, started at 8:00 Am. Lists built and approved before the event. models hit the table at 8:30, Turn 1 9:00, 1 hour turns per side for round 1 and 2, 45 min for 3, 30 min 4 and 5. 30 min lunch break at 1 (after turn 2)

I have attended events where there was not a schedule or much planning and those are... just awful games. you have fun with friends and talkign to fellow hobbyists but the game is unremarkable and people lose interest.

 G00fySmiley wrote:

 Huron black heart wrote:

 JamesY wrote:
Had a massive game once and it was awful. It was a great social get together, but the game was dire, and I'd never do it again.

Exactly my experience. Took an age to set up, let alone the time to play each turn, people lost interest, didn't care, absolutely no tactics to speak of. Waste of a day.

a good apoc games absolutely requires strict time limits and a agreed upon official who everybody agrees to just follow thier ruling and move on. strict schedule for set up, turn time limits etc. I enjoy them but not adhering to time limits makes for sides losing interest. In the last one I participated in we did the gathering storm the fall of Cadia. 8' x 48' table, 16 players, started at 8:00 Am. Lists built and approved before the event. models hit the table at 8:30, Turn 1 9:00, 1 hour turns per side for round 1 and 2, 45 min for 3, 30 min 4 and 5. 30 min lunch break at 1 (after turn 2)

I have attended events where there was not a schedule or much planning and those are... just awful games. you have fun with friends and talkign to fellow hobbyists but the game is unremarkable and people lose interest.

Fair response, there was some organisation but not to the extent you went to.
I'm not even that keen in going over 1500 points so I'm probably not the best judge.

 G00fySmiley wrote:


a good apoc games absolutely requires strict time limits and a agreed upon official who everybody agrees to just follow thier ruling and move on. strict schedule for set up, turn time limits etc. I enjoy them but not adhering to time limits makes for sides losing interest. In the last one I participated in we did the gathering storm the fall of Cadia. 8' x 48' table, 16 players, started at 8:00 Am. Lists built and approved before the event. models hit the table at 8:30, Turn 1 9:00, 1 hour turns per side for round 1 and 2, 45 min for 3, 30 min 4 and 5. 30 min lunch break at 1 (after turn 2)

I have attended events where there was not a schedule or much planning and those are... just awful games. you have fun with friends and talkign to fellow hobbyists but the game is unremarkable and people lose interest.

A taskmaster for the day is absolutely critical.

I've played games that are like 6000-8000 points, 1v1. Those are all-day affairs, but are a hell of a lot of fun. Haven't done that since Apocalypse was released really, but back then I had a full Baneblade company (3 Baneblades), an Armored Company (10 Leman Russes) and a Mechanized Infantry Company (~8 Chimeras with ~100 Infantry) along with a group of Grey Knights. The games took a long time, but had some awesome moments, like when I outflanked a Hellhammer into the flank of the Chaos army I was fighting, and it blew up in an apocalyptic explosion and decimated most of his army. Good fun.

I cannot imagine playing in anything more than 2v2 though, with a max of 10,000 pts per side... otherwise it would just be too messy.

I almost wonder if pre-game list sharing should be a thing, eg. everyone should get together in advance to ensure that both sides have relatively balanced lists with somewhat equal power level, ESPECIALLY with regards to the superheavies. All my more experienced friends are competitive enough to know roughly at a glance how units will perform on the tabletop for their points values. Since the goal of apoc is not to win, but to have fun, I think we could convince most people to contribute in designing lists for both sides that maximize the fun and minimize the slog.

After all, I'm sure we've all played pickup games whose outcomes are literally decided before T1. You know, the kind decided purely by unit selection or list building or even just bad lucking into the rock paper scissors aspects of the game. These games are boring for both players even at 1000 points so I can't imagine anyone wanting to risk having this happen at 20,000 points. Steamrolling your opponent with titans over 12 hours would be just as dull as getting steamrolled. No one wants that.

In the last Apoc game I ran, I gave both sides the following stratagem:

"1 CP - Return a single unit that was destroyed earlier this game to the battlefield at the end of your movement phase. Each time anyone on your team uses this stratagem, double its cost."

This, combined with strict 1 hour turn limits, really seemed to help limit the 'feels bad' moments. Yeah, your titan got alpha-struck off the board before you could fire it, but you get to bring it back.

This also incentivized people to bring the big stuff (better for apoc imo), as the stratagem gets more efficient for more expensive units.