Alternating vs IGOUGO Turn Methods

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**timebandit3077**

Mezmorki wrote:
Coming back to report the results of our game and some other feedback...

I ended up getting tabled after I made a few tactical blunders and really underestimated my opponent's staying power. I even got lucky and blew up his land raider with a haywire cannon shot But by turn 5 it was apparent that I lost too much stuff early in the game to hold the objectives and didn't quite have the right stuff in the right spot. All in all, it was a great game.

As for arhurt's turn order system - we debated it for a while afterwards. By and large, the net effect of the system is to allow for more simultaneous shooting while allowing each player to still maneuver their forces all at once in a way that doesn't break the basics structure of the game. It did work, and I really like the simultaneous shooting.

However, the "double turns" where an omega player is able to move and charge, and then next turn becomes alpha and can move, shoot, and then charge ends up with it feeling like each player's turn is much longer - and other than an combined shooting phase it is. It means you have to plan out not only your "double moves" and assaults, but also you opponent's "double moves." In a strange sort of way, while making the choices more longer term and consequential, also makes the game feel even less like a back and forth (what AA systems might be trying to achieve in the first place), since players can move so much before your opponent gets a chance to move in response.

Having played this, I think we'll stick to the original turn structure - but are curious to find ways to reintroduce the combined shooting again. It may be that a simple reaction to shooting option is all that is needed. I.E, you can already go to ground as a shooting reaction. What about just adding a "return fire" reaction that means you forego your shooting (and assaulting?) next turn but could still move normally. This could be combined with a simple "overwatch" option that allows you to preemptively place a unit on overwatch (instead of it's normal shooting/assaulting) in order to return fire and then be able to act normally next turn. Do you have to return fire on the unit

Mezmorki,

If I were to come up with a system, would you be willing to try such a game? How many players do you think would be willing to try something new? I am concerned that if I put all this effort into re-writing the basic turn structure, it would turn off a lot of players to the idea, simply because it is not important to them. I do not want to rewrite all the stats, as I believe GW did a decent job balancing them, but I would convert some stats to work with the new turn structure.

**Mezmorki**

It really depends. I have one other person I'm playing with right now and we're both pretty invested in the ProHammer thing we've been working on. I'm not likely to test anything that isn't compatible with 5th edition / ProHammer (or that I can't adapt to it). I also don't want to deal with modified codexes as a matter of principle.

That's said, maybe run your ideas by me and others here before going too far down the road? I'm interested in finding new turn structures to try out for sure - so I'm open to the idea if it fits.

**timebandit3077**

Mezmorki wrote:
It really depends. I have one other person I'm playing with right now and we're both pretty invested in the ProHammer thing we've been working on. I'm not likely to test anything that isn't compatible with 5th edition / ProHammer (or that I can't adapt to it). I also don't want to deal with modified codexes as a matter of principle.

That's said, maybe run your ideas by me and others here before going too far down the road? I'm interested in finding new turn structures to try out for sure - so I'm open to the idea if it fits.

I had no idea you had that much invested in Pro Hammer...You've probably done what I would have done anyways...Seeing that you are more experienced with the gameplay, I will have to check it out. I hope its more popular as I don't know too many people willing to play.

**kirotheavenger**

This is something that I'm really interested in, as I despise just sitting down for 45 minutes whilst my opponent blasts my models off the table.
I think a system of reactions would suit 40k best.

Alternating activations isn't really suitable because you'll have Custodians with 3 units going up against Guard with 30 units.

And, as Mezmorki said earlier, Alternating Activations presents units as individuals, whereas IGoUGo presents the army as more of a cohesive unit, which is a core of 40k now.

Reactions allows you to break up that terrible waiting for your opponent.
I don't think alternating phases is a viable thing though. I've played it in Kill Team and Aeronautica, and every time I move into position to fire on someone and they just... watch them walk away, it kills my soul.

I would potentially suggest the two reactions being;
Go To Ground - bonus to cover, can't move in your next turn, maybe a penalty if later engaged in combat.
Return Fire - shoot back, can't shoot in your next turn.

**Mezmorki**

The latest version of ProHammer (v1.7) fully incorporates a reaction mechanic alongside the overwatch mechanic it already had (overwatch being like in 2nd where you can defer shooting to shoot during your opponents turn). Reaction fire - in response to being shot or having a charge declared against your, means you skip shooting on your next turn (along side some other minor effects). You also have go to ground as normal, which is a reaction as well.

I've played a few games using this so far and it's been pretty interesting.