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Ok so I've recently finished my seer council. I'll admit it's not a full seer council, but it's a nice looking 10 man group. However, thus far, every game I've run it I've encountered issues, particularly against a very skilled demons player at my lfgs. I'd like some advice on what you might feel I'm missing:

HQ:
Farseer with spirit stone, shard of anaris, jet bike, SS
Farseer with jetbike, SS

Warlock x8 with bike and SS

Troops:
10 Storm guardians /w 2 flamers
Wave serpent with TLSL, SC, and HF

10 Guardian Defenders
Wave serpent with TLSL, SC, and HF

Fast attack:
6 Swooping hawks /w exarch running hit & run, sunrifle

6 warp spiders

Heavy:
2 Fire Prisms /w HF

3 Warwalkers using 2x SL and Star engines.




My thoughts:
Drop the fire prisms. They rarely do anything for me, and 2 lance shots, even ones as good as that, aren't worth what those tanks are worth.
Drop hit and run on the exarch.
Pick up a bright lance on the guardians, maybe give them a foot-lock.
Get a second unit of 2 war walkers with bright lances, possibly outflank them.


After that though, I'm a little lost. I love the seer council, I just have no idea what to support it with since I have so little experience with it.

Thoughts?

Well, your army needs more dakka.

I'd opt for 5 Serpents with troops, tl scatterlaser, underslung shuricannon, holofield, and 3 Warwalkers with dual scatterlasers. This would give you a decent start of less than 1200-1300 pts.

This would allow to include a Jetseer Council with 5-6 Jetlocks and 2 Jetseers. The magic phase will not win you the game. I'd concentrate on invisibilty, fortune, and shrouding.

I know this is self-handicaping, but I'd like to avoid serpent spam if possible

Good man.

Ok, revised list:

HQ:
Eldrad
Farseer /w Bike, shard

Warlock x5 /w Bike, spears

Elite:
Wrathguard /w flamers
Wave Serpent /w TL shuriken cannons, underslung cannon, Star Engines, Crystal Targeting matrix.

Troops:
Guardian Defender x20 /w 2 BL platforms
Wave Serpent with TL SC, SC

Storm Guardian x10 /w 2 flamer
Wave Serpent with TL SC, SC

Heavy:
3x War Walkers with 2x SC

Wraithknight /w 2 heavy wraithcannon


Thoughts?

In my experience, the Knight isn't that great unless you're fighting Nids for the same reason the Prism isn't that great. I'd say drop it for Spiders. Or Hawks. Or both.

I feel like the knight gives me viable anti tank weaponry as well as a threat to instant death MCs along with the added bonus of being a beast in CC though.

I have never had a game the knight isnt worth it. It attracts enough shooting power to down 1-2 of my serpents, and if its not shot down, it crashes into enemy lines like a wrecking ball. Not the song.

Agreed that the knight is almost always worth it, except fighting flyer spam but other then necrons who does that (don't you dare say space marines).

Def. Knight over two Prisms.

Any opinions on the mini-council?

Don't lower yourself to that second list, please.

I'd much rather play your first list, Wave Serpents simply ruin the game for some opponents. Unless you are playing in a tournament or a SUPER competitive environment, go with the first list. Both you and them will have more fun.

I like the mini-council plus the knight... essentially list one with the knight instead of the prisms

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Don't lower yourself to that second list, please.

I'd much rather play your first list, Wave Serpents simply ruin the game for some opponents. Unless you are playing in a tournament or a SUPER competitive environment, go with the first list. Both you and them will have more fun.

I don't really think it's lowering myself when I'm not exactly running them anywhere near normal. They don't have holofields, and they only have shuriken cannons, no scatter lasers. The Wraithguard serpent isn't even meant to survive, it's turboboosting right into the enemy face, using crystal matrix and firing everything, then disgorging the wraithguard to be an immediate threat while the guardian blob with Eldrad moves up into position.

If an opponent can't take 2/3 wave serpents at 2k points sporting ONLY shuriken cannons with no other guns, then... well...

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Don't lower yourself to that second list, please.

I'd much rather play your first list, Wave Serpents simply ruin the game for some opponents. Unless you are playing in a tournament or a SUPER competitive environment, go with the first list. Both you and them will have more fun.

Only 3 wave serpents with out even the tac load out, and people are crying cheese.

A Wraithknight is always an awesome addition, he's the wild card.

I've found that the most effective council, especially with dual force org is 2-4 farseers attached to Shining Spears. They're cheaper, come with special rules and can be tanked for by the farseers and the Baron if you're running max cheese.

Wave Serpents with Scatter Lasers are one of our only effective means of killing flyers and denying cover at range. Is it really that hard to kill a wave serpent? ...personally I'm on hyadus from them for the challenge though...

If you're taking a wave serpent to deliver Wraithguard, here's how you do it. Turbo first turn into the enemies face, good got that part. Do take Holo Fields, don't bother with CTM. Please don't fire off the shield with such precious cargo inside, especially since Eldrad can use his Warlord trait to give the thing a 2+ cover save. Then dismount and begin firing with all barrels.

Good luck

If you are already playing seers, dont worry about making other players feel bad. As the council itself is likely to draw the ire of most players.

I would say that the best supporting units for a seer council are serpents with dire avengers in them.

Farseer - Jetbike, Stones, Spear, Runes of Witnessing - 150
Farseer - Jetbike, Shard - 155
8 Warlocks - 4 Spears - 420

4x 5 Avengers w/ Wave Serpent (Scatter Laser) - 740
2x 3 Jetbikes - 102

2x 6 Hawks - 192

Wraithknight - 240

1999. Gives you 10 Objective Secured units. The Hawks are good at removing troops and harassment, they also can take out high av due to haywire grenades. Best of all they pinpoint deepstrike and can stay out of harms way.

Thanks LValx, but unfortunately I try to stay as Ulthwe as possible with my lists:

Guardian heavy
Psyker heavy

Low Aspect warrior