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Made in us
Maddening Mutant Boss of Chaos





So interesting thing happened. Playing a 7th today against long time vet.

I had 10 pink horrors and a herald of tzeentch that got charged by his Cron Chariot. End of the turn I had Herald and 1 pink horror left locked in combat.

On my turn I attempted to roll the conjuration "possession spell" with my Herald. (which i rolled for at the beginning of the game, so yes I did have it)

The argument came up I could not cast conjuration in combat.

My opponents argument: It does not work because other spells such as witch-fires specifically say they can't be cast into combat. Maledictions specifically say they can effect a unit locked in combat, blessing specifically say they can effect models locked in combat. Technically the model locked in combat is affected when casting the possession spell, as it is removed from play for casting the spell.

My Argument: The conjuration spell is not targeting the unit in combat. It is not affecting them, it is merely creating a new unit and then paying a tax/penalty. The Herald is not turning into a Bloodthirster, he is summoning one and then himself being removed from play.

I then asked my opponent, does that mean I can't use the "summoning spell" either. He seemed to think I could not because it didn't specifically say I could cast it while in combat.

I honestly think that RAW you can cast conjuration while locked in combat. But also do not want to be narrow minded just because I play daemons.

Any feedback is great, and pages or references in the book backing your call up would be even better.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2014/06/14 21:58:38


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Made in us
Fixture of Dakka



Chicago, Illinois

Let me lay this out how this is going to go, people are going to argue that yes it can be used as it's been pointed out before. Then someone will come in and argue about a "permissive" rule set, which isn't actually the definition of that wording and not actually how the game works but they'll argue it anyway and say things like " Point me to the page where it says you can't" then it'll devolve into " Well the rules don't say that I can't burn down your house, kill your dog, and steal your girlfiend" and other illogical leaps etc..

Yes, you can cast Conjuration spells in Combat. There's no restriction on it like Witchfires, in fact pretty much witchfires are the only ones that cannot for sure be cast in combat, the spells themselves usually have restrictions on using it in combat.

Now what happens with possession? That's a weird one, but there is a solution in assault. The combat would just end. There's this weird rule where if there are no combatants with in 6 inches of each other or able to get with in that due to whatever. The combat ends. I don't have my rulebook handy but there is a rule like that. It also has a rule based on "units" somehow being shot accidently in combat and being wiped out in the shooting phase as well.

So the Daemon would appear 6 inches away. the Herald would disappear, and if no one else was in combat that combat would basically have to "end".

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/06/14 23:26:09


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Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta




Being locked in combat section forbids shooting attacks into combats.

Psykers can use powers while in combat, just not witchfires.

You can resolve conjurations if you're locked in combat, because it's not a shooting attack. Blessings & maledictions can target units locked in combat because they are not shooting attacks, and GW was nice enough to clarify this.


 
   
Made in gb
Sinewy Scourge




Warrington, UK

sirlynchmob wrote:
Being locked in combat section forbids shooting attacks into combats.

Psykers can use powers while in combat, just not witchfires.

You can resolve conjurations if you're locked in combat, because it's not a shooting attack. Blessings & maledictions can target units locked in combat because they are not shooting attacks, and GW was nice enough to clarify this.



Correct...

Also note, nova spells can hit units locked in combat.

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Made in gb
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare





It is a permissive ruleset. You have permission to cast during your psychic phase. Does combat remove that permission? No it doesn't. So you can cast powers in general. What about conjuration powers? Do either the combat rules or the Conjuration rules state a restriction on you casting a Conjuration whilst engaged in combat? Again No. So you can indeed do this.

Also you are correct that the model doesn't turn into a Bloodthirster. The Bloodthirster is created and then the model is removed. This model woulf still give up VPs for being destroyed, for instance if he was your Warlord or indeed if he was the first unit to die.

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Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Also as a side note remember that you place that thirster within 6" and then scatter. Which is really risky when placed near an area of close combat.
   
 
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