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So I have mostly played 40k and have done so for a long time. I have always like the look of the minis of WHFB but the thought of starting a new game and new army was always a little over whelming. Also telling my wife I wanted to start all over was probly not going to go well, The line of we could buy diapers or minis, yeah probly not gunna win the priority list. However I got a good buddy who is sick, and always tried to get me into it, and we have a little breathing room now in the bank. So I guess here are some of my questions as I know next to nothing about the game other then what the minis look like.
1. Are empire the space marines of the Fantasy world?
2. I always liked the more obscure armys that most people don't play as much, which would that be? or is it more even then 40k?
3.What books and or dice do I need to start?
4. He has a ton of dwarves what army is a good match for them. Not trying to whalop him but merely to be a decent match
5. Is there an new book or core book coming out soon?
6. What are the best bang for my buck in getting in to the hobby?

Im sure there is more but for now I will stop there.

Sincerely thanks in advance

1) No, Warriors of Chaos are the Space Marines of Fantasy. In that they have rock-solid core (Warriors), lots of brutal back-up (Skull Crushers, Knights, Chimeras, etc) yet are sorely lacking in shooting. They are a pretty forgiving army.

2) Dogs of War are obscure, Chaos Dwarves too. Tomb Kings are rarely played as they have a pretty steep learning curve.

3) All you need is the mini-rulebook, a block of dice, and maybe scatter/artillery dice, depending on what you play. You'll need your Army Book too. Movement trays, measuring tape - the magic cards are handy but not essential.

4) Lots of armies are a good match for Dwarves

5) Bretonnia is rumored to be the next release.

6) The Ogre battalions are a great deal. Most people pick up two and a couple of other models and they're good to go!

WoC are the space marines in terms of armor and stat line. In terms of popularity fantasy does not have a space marine equivalent. Elves (all varieties) and WoC are fairly common, but not nearly as common as space marines are in 40k.

Tomb Kings and Beastmen and rarely seen at tournaments and in local clubs. They have a steeper learning curve but are by no means un-playable.

Lizardmen might be worth looking into, as similar to Ogres their battalion has a lot of bang for your buck. The battalion + a skink preist gives you a 1000 point army. It's similar with Ogres. Other armies have good battalions like Beastmen, but the battalion itself isn't worth many points.

Empire are a great starting army for beginners because they can do a bit of everything, but aren't specialists. Jack of All Trades kind of army. They can be a decent match-up for any opponent because you have so much variety.

Ogres are probably going to be a good bet for you. They're good, solid, low model count, enough variety to be interesting. WoC is also low model count, but WoC versus Dwarves is kind of boring. Dwarves is all about shooting, WoC is all about lack of shooting, so basically the first few turns are generally a shooting gallery and the last few turns are generally a close combat slaughter by what remains. Ogres would be more interesting, I think.

Empire are nothing like the SM, but they are a great starting army nonetheless.
WoC are also easy to start with, as they really don't need much in the way of tactics to win. Just move forward, absorb damage and crush.
Armies in Fantasy are much more evenly played than in 40k, where it is SM everywhere, but I don't often see Beastmen or Tomb Kings. High Elves, WoC, Skaven and Vampire Counts seem to be the most popular, but that probably depends heavily on your area.
Against, Dwarves, the best army probably would be Dark Elves.
WoC should be very effective too.

Wow guys thanks for the quick replies. I keep hearing about the magic phase. Is that completely different then 40K? Also I really like some of the Tree men for the wood elves and the cannons are pretty neat for empire. I think those two are the most appealing to me at this point. I will look more into the ogres as I haven't seen much of them yet. What should I be looking for? Also is there a new core rule set coming out anytime soon? It would be a bummer to buy in and then have the core set change again real soon. I see a ton of high elves on ebay are the the cheapest to start?

kellymatthew37 wrote:

1. Are empire the space marines of the Fantasy world?
2. I always liked the more obscure armys that most people don't play as much, which would that be? or is it more even then 40k?
3.What books and or dice do I need to start?
4. He has a ton of dwarves what army is a good match for them. Not trying to whalop him but merely to be a decent match
5. Is there an new book or core book coming out soon?
6. What are the best bang for my buck in getting in to the hobby?

1) Sort of. Similarly to Space Marines, Empire are pretty good at everything, but exceptional at nothing. This does make them a very good beginners army. However, they're not as durable nor as elite as Space Marines and don't have the same sort of "poster boy" reputation.

2) It completely depends on your area and I really think it's pretty even in general, with perhaps TK, Beastmen and Brets being slightly less popular. Check around with your local players.

3) Obviously you'll need the rulebook and the army book for the army you're using and dice-wise, the only extra dice you need that you don't use in 40k is the artillery dice. If you don't have one, then you don't really need to trouble yourself to buy one. Simply roll a normal D6 and double the result, with an unmodified roll of "6" being a "Misfire!"

4) Depends what you mean by "good match". If you mean something that can feasibly beat Dwarves, then anything goes, as Fantasy is far more balanced than 40k. The lower-tier armies, TK, Bretonnia, Beastmen and, to a lesser extent, OnG, will simply be harder. If you mean something that is an exciting matchup, you'd want an army that's polar opposite to dwarves, in which case you'll be looking at Ogres, Warriors, Beastmen and certain builds of High and Dark Elves.

5) Bretonnians are rumoured to be the next army release from GW (which is great, as Brets are sorely in need of an update). As for the core rulebook, it's anyone's guess as to when 9th edition will hit, so I wouldn't wait around for it. 8th is a fantastic edition anyway, so I'd get as many games of it in as you can!

6) Any elite army is, generally speaking, kinder on the wallet, especially Ogre Kingdoms. With two battalions and a bit of conversion (and obviously you'll need the army book) you can assemble a decent 2000pt army (a good sized game). Then, you can add in what flavour you like to take you up to 2400-2500, the points value at which most games are played. However, Warriors and all Elven armies are very elite, so won't set you back too much.

As for the Magic phase, it's fairly similar to the 40k Psychic Phase (though I should say the Psychic Phase is similar to the Magic Phase). To briefly sum up, you each generate a random number of dice for your pool and, modifiers aside, the player who is casting will have more dice than the player who is dispelling. To cast a spell (these are randomly generated similar to in 40k) you simply roll as many dice as you like (up to 6) from your pool and add the wizard level of the caster to get the total. If the total beats the casting value, the spell is cast. The opposing player can attempt to dispel however and to do so he does exactly the same and must equal or beat the value of the casting player. Obviously though, the dispelling player has less dice at his disposal, so he has to be careful where he uses his dice. It's a very tactical phase - moreso than in 40K - and many players (myself included!) are guilty of often spending far too long making decisions in the Magic Phase!

Hope this helps, if you have any more questions, feel free to ask!

kellymatthew37 wrote:
Wow guys thanks for the quick replies. I keep hearing about the magic phase. Is that completely different then 40K? Also I really like some of the Tree men for the wood elves and the cannons are pretty neat for empire. I think those two are the most appealing to me at this point. I will look more into the ogres as I haven't seen much of them yet. What should I be looking for? Also is there a new core rule set coming out anytime soon? It would be a bummer to buy in and then have the core set change again real soon. I see a ton of high elves on ebay are the the cheapest to start?

Wood Elves are tricky to start with, as warning. They're very fragile, and very finicky, especially against shooting (dwarfs!). Empire is a great starting army because it's so versatile and will let you dabble in just about any facet you want.

From what you've said, what you're looking for is a low model count 'elite' style army that will give you the full flavor of the game. High Elves had a huge wave of players when their book hit, and I suppose many of them are finding out they don't like the army as much as they thought they would. It certainly wouldn't be a bad starting army, and it's an elite army so the model count wouldn't be too intense. If they interest you that's certainly a possibility, and they definitely touch on a lot of fun points about Fantasy.

It's easier to say what you should avoid. Avoid Skaven, Orcs and Goblins, and undead if actual, real money is a concern and you want to have a nice, fully modeled army. They can start getting huge real quick, and while they're fun to play it'll be a bit harder to justify the price when you're budget-minded.

(edit)

Oh, and as for what you should be looking for in general... whatever catches your eye. Aesthetics tend to mesh pretty well with gameplay here. Just be careful about falling in love with big monsters, because cannons kill monsters. And dwarfs bring cannons like no one else. And you will be sad.

kellymatthew37 wrote:

1. Are empire the space marines of the Fantasy world?

Empire actually encompasses almost all WHFB equivalents of the Imperium's military forces. State Troops + Artillery = IG, Knightly Orders = Space Marines, Engineers = Adeptus Mechanicus, Witch Hunters = Inquisition, War Priests + Arch Lectors + Flagellants = Ecclesiarchy and so forth..

kellymatthew37 wrote:
1. Are empire the space marines of the Fantasy world?

I wouldn't say there really is a Space Marine equivalent as such. A glance over the previous starter boxes will show you that there isn't really a single army so readily pushed as Marines are. What I would say is that Empire are somewhat like Marines in there all-roundyness. They're capable of being combat or shooting oriented, whichever you prefer. Shooting is probably the stronger of the two, as combat relies on tactics rather than brute force. Though I do remember a Knightly Order deathstar being rather effective.

2. I always liked the more obscure armys that most people don't play as much, which would that be? or is it more even then 40k?

I don't recall WE being particularly popular, nor Bretonnians.

3.What books and or dice do I need to start?

Big rulebook (or starter set equivelant), army book (of whichever army you choose), no special dice are strictly needed but if you're using artillery you'll need some artillery dice.

4. He has a ton of dwarves what army is a good match for them. Not trying to whalop him but merely to be a decent match

Empire if you want to challenge him with firepower. Elves/Orcs+Goblins might also be fun from a fluff perspective.

So.... I showed my wife the full range and she said the wood elves look neat. They are very lord of the rings. So as yall stated before they are a hard starting army. I am not overly new to armies that need to synergize, in 40k Tyranids were my main army and they as well need to work together more then most. I have no idea though if that well translate well what so ever. She really likes the huge tree guys. I understand the concept that tress start on fire... I know, who knew right? Any way I was really just thinking lots of archers a huge tree and the venison with elves on its back. Could still very much use some help.

Wood elves will be a good match up for dwarfs, they have a lot of counters to the strengths of dwarfs. At the moment, like people have been saying, is all the armies are fairly evenly matched, so just choose one you like the look/fluff of and can affordably aquire. Good Luck, you will enjoy it.

So I guess I am thinking of something like
Random HQ
2 units of like 15 glade guard
1 Unit of spear men 20 stron
2 units of wild riders 6 strong

Yeah so I have no idea what so ever what I am doing. I really like the giant tree guys even though they catch on fire.
Any one have a link to some wood elve tactica?

Welcome to the woods! Asrai.org is worth a look for tactics and general Wood elfiness.

As for tactics against Dwarfs, your random HQ should definitely be a spellsinger/spellweaver (wood wizards) depending on points. For the most part wood elf fighty characters are underwhelming. Always strikes first aside they have naff all in the way of armour saves so you're never going go toe-to-toe against dwarf fighty characters and come out on top.

Shadow magic is a good place to go against dwarfs (and most things) as it can counteract pretty much any advantage their basic troops have over your: toughness and high strength shooting. Shadow can reduce their toughness (devastating combined with WE shooting), knock down their BS (which isn't all that great to start with) and their big spell can boost your spear guys to a hefty S9!

To be honest, you're best off leaving the treeman at home against the dwarfs. Too much easy access to flaming war machines and loads of great weapon units make it a massive target. Get one anyway as they're lovely models (and still handy against other stuff)!

Wild Riders are the real heavy hitters in a wood elf list- they hit like a ton of bricks! But be aware they like most wood elves they can't take a lot of punishment. Don't charge them into big blocks of enemies without support- Eternal guard work well here as they are the best thing you can rank up in a WE army and can take a charge without running (usually). Holding the enemy in place then hitting them in the flank with Riders will make a mess of most things.

On his side, target warmachines and gyrocopters first- a steam gun shot from the side can take half a unit of pretty much anything off the board with little trouble. Glade Guard with Hagsbane arrows work wonders here (luckily cannons are oddly susceptible to poison).

Hope this helps!

Az

Dude that is huge. I sincerely appreciate the info and ii will check out that link. His other army is orcs and goblins which seem completely opposite from dwarves. I really like the glade guard guys and yes I ought a giant tree well because who doesn't like a giant pissed off tree. What would you think my best bet for an anvil unit be?

With Wood Elves?

Your best bet for an Anvil unit is Glade Riders. Who then Feign Flight as soon as something charges them, leaving the enemy unit out of position so you can smash into the side of it with free-reforming Wardancers and Rangers (I guess).

Wood Elves fight in a very different manner to most fantasy armies if you go elf-heavy. Eternal Guard are out most obvious Anvil, but they're fragile individually - very fragile.

Wood Elves tend to a much softer battle style. Strike and fade, don't get pinned down in combat, and control the battlefield.

Battlefield control is, in fact, significantly more important to Wood Elves than basically any other fantasy army. You can't afford to go toe-to-toe in a hard style, you have to put weaknesses in their line and then exploit them.

I would say that the best units to take against either dwarves OR orcs would be Trueshot Scouts and Waywatchers. Anything that can keep mobile (and thus out of charge angles) while shooting lots and lots of arrows into the target.

Eternal guard will take casualties but with stubborn Ld9 they're not going break easily. Against stuff that doesn't give a lot of static combat resolution (ie from lots of ranks, banners etc) Treekin are decent anvils as they can take a hefty amount of punishment. It's also a decent role for your treeman- again Ld9 Stubborn and tough enough to weather most attacks in close combat.

Glade guard... their ambusher rule (which is apparently non negotiable) stops them from setting up with your battle line and make them more suitable for harassing your opponents back line. Warhawk riders could serve that task well though (albeit a little more expensively).

Good luck with your new army!

Glade Riders, you mean. Glade Guard aren't ambushers.

It really does seem like they are completely different from the rest. If I don't have a anvil unit what would I use to slow down some of the faster units or to step up and take a charge, Since theres not a huge difference in stats between glade guard and eternal guard. would just a large block of glade guard do anything and possible whittle down something more so when it gets closer it doesn't hit as hard?

If you really want to step up and take a charge, Eternal Guard blocks are probably your best bet.

Personally, I prefer a battle style that involves avoiding combat entirely - I use MSU glade guard for my Core choices and either Stand and Shoot if I've got some counter-chargers in place (I'll lose the Glade Guard, almost certainly, but then I can slam into that regiment from the side with my Wardancers and often break it). If I don't have a friendly counter-charge unit in place, I'll just Flee.

Ranged combat style... the idea isn't to whittle the enemy down so we can beat them when they charge. The idea is to completely shatter them before they can even touch us. That's why I like to deploy Waywatchers and Scouts on the enemy flanks from turn one.