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Kilkrazy wrote: Is it actually wrong for women to vote for a female candidate?
Of course not, but the question posed was that single issue voters are socially toxic. If that single issue for pertectin' mah shootin' irons or possessing a vagina, it's still a single issue.
The fact that Clinton is a very experienced, capable politician. diplomat, lawyer, and administrator is not irrelevant to the choice to vote for her.
Kilkrazy wrote: Is it actually wrong for women to vote for a female candidate?
Of course not, but the question posed was that single issue voters are socially toxic. If that single issue for pertectin' mah shootin' irons or possessing a vagina, it's still a single issue.
The fact that Clinton is a very experienced, capable politician. diplomat, lawyer, and administrator is not irrelevant to the choice to vote for her.
Hopefully the democratic party learned from 2016, and not put someone with so much baggage on their throne.
That or they will take a lesson from Trump, and just make wild claims to win votes!
warboss wrote: Is there a permanent stickied thread for Chaos players to complain every time someone/anyone gets models or rules besides them? If not, there should be.
warboss wrote: Is there a permanent stickied thread for Chaos players to complain every time someone/anyone gets models or rules besides them? If not, there should be.
Spicier just needs to realize that it was an epic fail and admit he flubbed it.
That's what happens when he tries to answer the questions w/o thinking...
In a lot of ways I feel bad for Spicer. I've been in jobs where the leadership above me ran in crisis mode, and left me answering questions on policies that often hadn't been thought through, or hadn't been properly explained to people at my level. Being left to wing it and try to present a half prepared, barely communicated strategy is my idea of hell.
However, the way Spicer's gone about this, particularly the aggression he's shown towards some pretty ordinary questions, but also the manipulation he's attempted by shutting out some major news orgs while bringing in a whole bunch of friendly fringe publications... well ultimately that means I'm quite enjoying Spicer have to squirm.
As to the actual seriousness of what he said... meh.
It's a nothingburger in the sense that everyone knew what he's trying to do. (Assad is really bad... like Hitlerian bad).
But he flubbed it so bad *he* became the story.
I'm more insulted by his incompetent and I don't feel bad for him one iota. Being PressSec means you have to be quick on your feet and NOT keep digging holes. He failed on those two points... until he finally apologized.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/04/12 13:43:19
The FBI obtained a secret court order last summer to monitor the communications of an adviser to presidential candidate Donald Trump, part of an investigation into possible links between Russia and the campaign, law enforcement and other U.S. officials said.
The FBI and the Justice Department obtained the warrant targeting Carter Page’s communications after convincing a Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court judge that there was probable cause to believe Page was acting as an agent of a foreign power, in this case Russia, according to the officials.
This is the clearest evidence so far that the FBI had reason to believe during the 2016 presidential campaign that a Trump campaign adviser was in touch with Russian agents. Such contacts are now at the center of an investigation into whether the campaign coordinated with the Russian government to swing the election in Trump’s favor.
Page has not been accused of any crimes, and it is unclear whether the Justice Department might later seek charges against him or others in connection with Russia’s meddling in the 2016 presidential election. The counterintelligence investigation into Russian efforts to influence U.S. elections began in July, officials have said. Most such investigations don’t result in criminal charges.
The officials spoke about the court order on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss details of a counterintelligence probe.
During an interview with the Washington Post editorial page staff in March 2016, Trump identified Page, who had previously been an investment banker in Moscow, as a foreign policy adviser to his campaign. Campaign spokeswoman Hope Hicks later described Page’s role as “informal.”
Page has repeatedly denied any wrongdoing in his dealings with the Trump campaign or Russia.
“This confirms all of my suspicions about unjustified, politically motivated government surveillance,” Page said in an interview Tuesday. “I have nothing to hide.” He compared surveillance of him to the eavesdropping that the FBI and Justice Department conducted against civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr.
The White House, FBI and Justice Department declined to comment.
FBI Director James B. Comey disclosed in public testimony to the House Intelligence Committee last month that the bureau is investigating efforts by the Russian government to interfere in the 2016 presidential election.
Comey said this includes investigating the “nature of any links between individuals associated with the Trump campaign and the Russian government and whether there was any coordination between the campaign and Russia’s efforts.”
Comey declined to comment during the hearing about any individuals, including Page, who worked in Moscow for Merrill Lynch a decade ago and who has said he invested in Russian energy giant Gazprom. In a letter to Comey in September, Page had said he had sold his Gazprom investment.
During the hearing last month, Democratic lawmakers repeatedly singled out Page’s contacts in Russia as a cause for concern.
The judges who rule on Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) requests oversee the nation’s most sensitive national security cases, and their warrants are some of the most closely guarded secrets in the world of U.S. law enforcement and intelligence gathering. Any FISA application has to be approved at the highest levels of the Justice Department and the FBI.
Applications for FISA warrants, Comey said, are often thicker than his wrists, and that thickness represents all the work Justice Department attorneys and FBI agents have to do to convince a judge that such surveillance is appropriate in an investigation.
The government’s application for the surveillance order targeting Page included a lengthy declaration that laid out investigators’ basis for believing that Page was an agent of the Russian government and knowingly engaged in clandestine intelligence activities on behalf of Moscow, officials said.
Among other things, the application cited contacts that he had with a Russian intelligence operative in New York City in 2013, officials said. Those contacts had earlier surfaced in a federal espionage case brought by the Justice Department against the intelligence operative and two other Russian agents. In addition, the application said Page had other contacts with Russian operatives that have not been publicly disclosed, officials said.
An application for electronic surveillance under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act need not show evidence of a crime. But the information obtained through the intercepts can be used to open a criminal investigation and may be used in a prosecution.
The application also showed that the FBI and the Justice Department’s national security division have been seeking since July to determine how broad a network of accomplices Russia enlisted in attempting to influence the 2016 presidential election, the officials said.
Since the 90-day warrant was first issued, it has been renewed more than once by the FISA court, the officials said.
In February, Page told “PBS NewsHour” that he was a “junior member of the [Trump] campaign’s foreign policy advisory group.”
A former Trump campaign adviser said Page submitted policy memos to the campaign and several times asked to be given a meeting with Trump, though his request was never granted. “He was one of the more active ones, in terms of being in touch,” the adviser said.
The campaign adviser said Page participated in three dinners held for the campaign’s volunteer foreign policy advisers in the spring and summer of 2016, coming from New York to Washington to meet with the group. Although Trump did not attend, Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Ala.), a top Trump confidant who became his attorney general, attended one meeting of the group with Page in late summer, the campaign adviser said.
Page’s role as an adviser to the Trump campaign drew alarm last year from more-established foreign policy experts in part because of Page’s effusive praise for Russian President Vladimir Putin and his criticism of U.S. sanctions over Moscow’s military intervention in Ukraine.
In July, Page traveled to Moscow, where he delivered a speech harshly critical of the United States’ policy toward Russia.
While there, Page allegedly met with Igor Sechin, a Putin confidant and chief executive of the energy company Rosneft, according to a dossier compiled by a former British intelligence officer and cited at a congressional hearing by Rep. Adam B. Schiff (Calif.), the ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. Officials said some of the information in the dossier has been verified by U.S. intelligence agencies, and some of it hasn’t, while other parts are unlikely to ever be proved or disproved.
On Tuesday, Page dismissed what he called “the dodgy dossier” of false allegations.
Page has denied such a meeting occurred, saying he has never met Sechin in his life and that he wants to testify before Congress to clear his name. A spokesman for Rosneft told Politico in September that the notion that Page met with Sechin was “absurd.” Page said in September that he briefly met Russian Deputy Prime Minister Arkady Dvorkovich during that trip.
Comey has declined to discuss the details of the Russia probe, but in an appearance last month, he cited the process for getting FISA warrants as proof that the government’s surveillance powers are very carefully used, with significant oversight.
“It is a pain in the neck to get permission to conduct electronic surveillance in the United States. And that’s good,’’ he told an audience at the University of Texas in Austin.
Officials have said the FBI and the Justice Department were particularly reluctant to seek FISA warrants of campaign figures during the 2016 presidential race because of concerns that agents would inadvertently eavesdrop on political talk. To obtain a FISA warrant, prosecutors must show that a significant purpose of the warrant is to obtain foreign intelligence information.
Page is the only American to have had his communications directly targeted with a FISA warrant in 2016 as part of the Russia probe, officials said.
The FBI routinely obtains FISA warrants to monitor the communications of foreign diplomats in the United States, including the Russian ambassador, Sergey Kislyak. The conversations between Kislyak and Michael Flynn, who became Trump’s first national security adviser, were recorded in December. In February, The Washington Post reported that Flynn misled Vice President-elect Mike Pence and others about his discussions with Kislyak, prompting Trump’s decision to fire him.
In March, Trump made unsubstantiated claims about U.S. surveillance of Trump Tower in New York. Later that month, Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.), chairman of the House Intelligence Committee and a Trump transition official, charged that details about people “associated with the incoming administration, details with little apparent foreign intelligence value” were “widely disseminated” in intelligence community reporting. He said none of the surveillance was related to Russia. The FISA order on Page is unrelated to either charge.
Last month, the former director of national intelligence, James R. Clapper Jr., told NBC’s “Meet the Press” that U.S. law enforcement agencies did not have any FISA orders to monitor the communications of Trump, either as a candidate or as a president-elect, or his campaign. But Clapper did not address whether there were any FISA warrants targeting Trump associates.
Three years before Page became an adviser to the Trump campaign, he came to the attention of FBI counterintelligence agents, who learned that Russian spy suspects had sought to use Page as a source for information.
In that case, one of the Russian suspects, Victor Podobnyy — who was posing as a diplomat and was later charged by federal prosecutors with acting as an unregistered agent of a foreign government — was captured on tape in 2013 discussing an effort to get information and documents from Page. That discussion was detailed in a federal complaint filed against Podobnyy and two others. The court documents in that spy case only identify Page as “Male 1.’’ Officials familiar with the case said that “Male 1’’ is Page.
In one secretly recorded conversation, detailed in the complaint, Podobnyy said Page “wrote that he is sorry, he went to Moscow and forgot to check his inbox, but he wants to meet when he gets back. I think he is an idiot and forgot who I am. Plus he writes to me in Russian [to] practice the language. He flies to Moscow more often than I do. He got hooked on Gazprom thinking that if they have a project, he could rise up. Maybe he can. I don’t know, but it’s obvious that he wants to earn lots of money.’’
The same court document says that in June 2013, Page told FBI agents that he met Podobnyy at an energy symposium in New York, where they exchanged contact information. In subsequent meetings, Page shared with the Russian his outlook on the state of the energy industry, as well as documents about the energy business, according to the court papers.
In the secret tape, Podobnyy said he liked the man’s “enthusiasm” but planned to use him to get information and give him little in return. “You promise a favor for a favor. You get the documents from him and tell him to go f--- himself,’’ Podobnyy said on the tape, according to court papers.
Page has said the information he provided to the Russians in 2013 was innocuous, describing it as “basic immaterial information and publicly available research documents.” He said he had assisted the prosecutors in their case against Evgeny Buryakov, who pleaded guilty to conspiring to act in the United States as an unregistered agent of Russian intelligence.
Obama personally ordering a wiretap of Trump is a tiny bit different than the FBI producing enough evidence to get probable cause for a Judge to order a warrant to monitor a single advisor.
The FBI obtained a secret court order last summer to monitor the communications of an adviser to presidential candidate Donald Trump, part of an investigation into possible links between Russia and the campaign, law enforcement and other U.S. officials said.
The FBI and the Justice Department obtained the warrant targeting Carter Page’s communications after convincing a Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court judge that there was probable cause to believe Page was acting as an agent of a foreign power, in this case Russia, according to the officials.
This is the clearest evidence so far that the FBI had reason to believe during the 2016 presidential campaign that a Trump campaign adviser was in touch with Russian agents. Such contacts are now at the center of an investigation into whether the campaign coordinated with the Russian government to swing the election in Trump’s favor.
Page has not been accused of any crimes, and it is unclear whether the Justice Department might later seek charges against him or others in connection with Russia’s meddling in the 2016 presidential election. The counterintelligence investigation into Russian efforts to influence U.S. elections began in July, officials have said. Most such investigations don’t result in criminal charges.
The officials spoke about the court order on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss details of a counterintelligence probe.
During an interview with the Washington Post editorial page staff in March 2016, Trump identified Page, who had previously been an investment banker in Moscow, as a foreign policy adviser to his campaign. Campaign spokeswoman Hope Hicks later described Page’s role as “informal.”
Page has repeatedly denied any wrongdoing in his dealings with the Trump campaign or Russia.
“This confirms all of my suspicions about unjustified, politically motivated government surveillance,” Page said in an interview Tuesday. “I have nothing to hide.” He compared surveillance of him to the eavesdropping that the FBI and Justice Department conducted against civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr.
The White House, FBI and Justice Department declined to comment.
FBI Director James B. Comey disclosed in public testimony to the House Intelligence Committee last month that the bureau is investigating efforts by the Russian government to interfere in the 2016 presidential election.
Comey said this includes investigating the “nature of any links between individuals associated with the Trump campaign and the Russian government and whether there was any coordination between the campaign and Russia’s efforts.”
Comey declined to comment during the hearing about any individuals, including Page, who worked in Moscow for Merrill Lynch a decade ago and who has said he invested in Russian energy giant Gazprom. In a letter to Comey in September, Page had said he had sold his Gazprom investment.
During the hearing last month, Democratic lawmakers repeatedly singled out Page’s contacts in Russia as a cause for concern.
The judges who rule on Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) requests oversee the nation’s most sensitive national security cases, and their warrants are some of the most closely guarded secrets in the world of U.S. law enforcement and intelligence gathering. Any FISA application has to be approved at the highest levels of the Justice Department and the FBI.
Applications for FISA warrants, Comey said, are often thicker than his wrists, and that thickness represents all the work Justice Department attorneys and FBI agents have to do to convince a judge that such surveillance is appropriate in an investigation.
The government’s application for the surveillance order targeting Page included a lengthy declaration that laid out investigators’ basis for believing that Page was an agent of the Russian government and knowingly engaged in clandestine intelligence activities on behalf of Moscow, officials said.
Among other things, the application cited contacts that he had with a Russian intelligence operative in New York City in 2013, officials said. Those contacts had earlier surfaced in a federal espionage case brought by the Justice Department against the intelligence operative and two other Russian agents. In addition, the application said Page had other contacts with Russian operatives that have not been publicly disclosed, officials said.
An application for electronic surveillance under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act need not show evidence of a crime. But the information obtained through the intercepts can be used to open a criminal investigation and may be used in a prosecution.
The application also showed that the FBI and the Justice Department’s national security division have been seeking since July to determine how broad a network of accomplices Russia enlisted in attempting to influence the 2016 presidential election, the officials said.
Since the 90-day warrant was first issued, it has been renewed more than once by the FISA court, the officials said.
In February, Page told “PBS NewsHour” that he was a “junior member of the [Trump] campaign’s foreign policy advisory group.”
A former Trump campaign adviser said Page submitted policy memos to the campaign and several times asked to be given a meeting with Trump, though his request was never granted. “He was one of the more active ones, in terms of being in touch,” the adviser said.
The campaign adviser said Page participated in three dinners held for the campaign’s volunteer foreign policy advisers in the spring and summer of 2016, coming from New York to Washington to meet with the group. Although Trump did not attend, Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Ala.), a top Trump confidant who became his attorney general, attended one meeting of the group with Page in late summer, the campaign adviser said.
Page’s role as an adviser to the Trump campaign drew alarm last year from more-established foreign policy experts in part because of Page’s effusive praise for Russian President Vladimir Putin and his criticism of U.S. sanctions over Moscow’s military intervention in Ukraine.
In July, Page traveled to Moscow, where he delivered a speech harshly critical of the United States’ policy toward Russia.
While there, Page allegedly met with Igor Sechin, a Putin confidant and chief executive of the energy company Rosneft, according to a dossier compiled by a former British intelligence officer and cited at a congressional hearing by Rep. Adam B. Schiff (Calif.), the ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. Officials said some of the information in the dossier has been verified by U.S. intelligence agencies, and some of it hasn’t, while other parts are unlikely to ever be proved or disproved.
On Tuesday, Page dismissed what he called “the dodgy dossier” of false allegations.
Page has denied such a meeting occurred, saying he has never met Sechin in his life and that he wants to testify before Congress to clear his name. A spokesman for Rosneft told Politico in September that the notion that Page met with Sechin was “absurd.” Page said in September that he briefly met Russian Deputy Prime Minister Arkady Dvorkovich during that trip.
Comey has declined to discuss the details of the Russia probe, but in an appearance last month, he cited the process for getting FISA warrants as proof that the government’s surveillance powers are very carefully used, with significant oversight.
“It is a pain in the neck to get permission to conduct electronic surveillance in the United States. And that’s good,’’ he told an audience at the University of Texas in Austin.
Officials have said the FBI and the Justice Department were particularly reluctant to seek FISA warrants of campaign figures during the 2016 presidential race because of concerns that agents would inadvertently eavesdrop on political talk. To obtain a FISA warrant, prosecutors must show that a significant purpose of the warrant is to obtain foreign intelligence information.
Page is the only American to have had his communications directly targeted with a FISA warrant in 2016 as part of the Russia probe, officials said.
The FBI routinely obtains FISA warrants to monitor the communications of foreign diplomats in the United States, including the Russian ambassador, Sergey Kislyak. The conversations between Kislyak and Michael Flynn, who became Trump’s first national security adviser, were recorded in December. In February, The Washington Post reported that Flynn misled Vice President-elect Mike Pence and others about his discussions with Kislyak, prompting Trump’s decision to fire him.
In March, Trump made unsubstantiated claims about U.S. surveillance of Trump Tower in New York. Later that month, Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.), chairman of the House Intelligence Committee and a Trump transition official, charged that details about people “associated with the incoming administration, details with little apparent foreign intelligence value” were “widely disseminated” in intelligence community reporting. He said none of the surveillance was related to Russia. The FISA order on Page is unrelated to either charge.
Last month, the former director of national intelligence, James R. Clapper Jr., told NBC’s “Meet the Press” that U.S. law enforcement agencies did not have any FISA orders to monitor the communications of Trump, either as a candidate or as a president-elect, or his campaign. But Clapper did not address whether there were any FISA warrants targeting Trump associates.
Three years before Page became an adviser to the Trump campaign, he came to the attention of FBI counterintelligence agents, who learned that Russian spy suspects had sought to use Page as a source for information.
In that case, one of the Russian suspects, Victor Podobnyy — who was posing as a diplomat and was later charged by federal prosecutors with acting as an unregistered agent of a foreign government — was captured on tape in 2013 discussing an effort to get information and documents from Page. That discussion was detailed in a federal complaint filed against Podobnyy and two others. The court documents in that spy case only identify Page as “Male 1.’’ Officials familiar with the case said that “Male 1’’ is Page.
In one secretly recorded conversation, detailed in the complaint, Podobnyy said Page “wrote that he is sorry, he went to Moscow and forgot to check his inbox, but he wants to meet when he gets back. I think he is an idiot and forgot who I am. Plus he writes to me in Russian [to] practice the language. He flies to Moscow more often than I do. He got hooked on Gazprom thinking that if they have a project, he could rise up. Maybe he can. I don’t know, but it’s obvious that he wants to earn lots of money.’’
The same court document says that in June 2013, Page told FBI agents that he met Podobnyy at an energy symposium in New York, where they exchanged contact information. In subsequent meetings, Page shared with the Russian his outlook on the state of the energy industry, as well as documents about the energy business, according to the court papers.
In the secret tape, Podobnyy said he liked the man’s “enthusiasm” but planned to use him to get information and give him little in return. “You promise a favor for a favor. You get the documents from him and tell him to go f--- himself,’’ Podobnyy said on the tape, according to court papers.
Page has said the information he provided to the Russians in 2013 was innocuous, describing it as “basic immaterial information and publicly available research documents.” He said he had assisted the prosecutors in their case against Evgeny Buryakov, who pleaded guilty to conspiring to act in the United States as an unregistered agent of Russian intelligence.
Sure, there would be plenty of reasons to wiretap trump and those around him. Collusion with russia and giving aid to the enemy would probably warrant a wire tap. If he was being wiretapped, there could be a very good reason for it, and not the ridiculous reason trump used. Let's see the signed warrants.
I'm getting to the stage where I really ought to give up following Western foreign policy, because it's quickly entering the realm of fantasy.
Britain made a complete ass of itself over Syria the other day, now it's Trump's turn
Putin should stop supporting Assad because he's a bad man, is Trump's latest intellectual contribution to American foreign policy
I pity the man or woman who has to write the Trump biography in a few years time...
As much as I loathe Putin and his regime, his foreign policy with regard to Syria is the only one that makes any sense
A decades old ally is threatened, so Putin sends in military and political support to shore up an old ally, much in the same way that the USA would act to defend South Korea or Japan.
And yet, this seems to cause confusion amongst Western diplomats...
It's a mad world...
"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote: I'm getting to the stage where I really ought to give up following Western foreign policy, because it's quickly entering the realm of fantasy.
Britain made a complete ass of itself over Syria the other day, now it's Trump's turn
Putin should stop supporting Assad because he's a bad man, is Trump's latest intellectual contribution to American foreign policy
Alonzo Mourning and police wait for fire dept to arrive . Sec. Ben Carson is stuck in the elevator iat the Courtside Family Apartments
... it's like the entire presidency so far encapsulated in one event.
The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all
We love our superheroes because they refuse to give up on us. We can analyze them out of existence, kill them, ban them, mock them, and still they return, patiently reminding us of who we are and what we wish we could be.
"the play's the thing wherein I'll catch the conscience of the king,
WrentheFaceless wrote: So, reports of Chinese troops massing across the NK Border to deter refugees.
Link actually? This sounds like news to me. I have a friend deployed on the demilitarized zone right now. I assumed the refugee issue was minor / a small trickle into china
WrentheFaceless wrote: So, reports of Chinese troops massing across the NK Border to deter refugees. President Cheeto sailing a carrier group up to that part.
Is this it?
China probably expects the US, South Korea and Japan to do something about North Korea sooner rather than later and that the Kim Jong Un regime isn't going to last long term so they are getting everything in place along there border with NK to minimize the impact on them but I don't think there's reason to believe that the US, SK or Japan are going to attack NK in the immediate future.
WrentheFaceless wrote: So, reports of Chinese troops massing across the NK Border to deter refugees. President Cheeto sailing a carrier group up to that part.
Is this it?
Party on Wayne!
One of my favorite barometers, the market, isn't telling me it's "go" time, but with this idiot in office, who fething knows. If he doesn't go to Mar-a-Lago this weekend, then maybe something is afoot!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/04/12 15:55:23
WrentheFaceless wrote: So, reports of Chinese troops massing across the NK Border to deter refugees. President Cheeto sailing a carrier group up to that part.
Is this it?
China probably expects the US, South Korea and Japan to do something about North Korea sooner rather than later and that the Kim Jong Un regime isn't going to last long term so they are getting everything in place along there border with NK to minimize the impact on them but I don't think there's reason to believe that the US, SK or Japan are going to attack NK in the immediate future.
Well japan recently asked for permission to do preemptive strikes, there is really only one country that comes to mind that they would want to strike. NK. There was just a thread about it, and you can see why japan would want to strike NK, as NK keeps testing it's missiles towards japan and over japan.
No one can assume what the US will do, trump doesn't even know what to do.
"Putin is backing a person that's truly an evil person, and I think it's very bad for Russia," he said. "I think it's very bad for mankind. It's very bad for this world … I really think that there's going to be a lot of pressure on Russia to make sure that peace happens, because frankly if Russia didn't go in and back this animal, you wouldn't have a problem right now."
WrentheFaceless wrote: So, reports of Chinese troops massing across the NK Border to deter refugees.
Link actually? This sounds like news to me. I have a friend deployed on the demilitarized zone right now. I assumed the refugee issue was minor / a small trickle into china
Kilkrazy wrote: Is it actually wrong for women to vote for a female candidate?
Of course not, but the question posed was that single issue voters are socially toxic. If that single issue for pertectin' mah shootin' irons or possessing a vagina, it's still a single issue.
The fact that Clinton is a very experienced, capable politician. diplomat, lawyer, and administrator is not irrelevant to the choice to vote for her.
All of what you typed is true.
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
"Putin is backing a person that's truly an evil person, and I think it's very bad for Russia," he said. "I think it's very bad for mankind. It's very bad for this world … I really think that there's going to be a lot of pressure on Russia to make sure that peace happens, because frankly if Russia didn't go in and back this animal, you wouldn't have a problem right now."
Wow, it's almost as if Trump now knows what everyone has known about Putin for years.
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
"Putin is backing a person that's truly an evil person, and I think it's very bad for Russia," he said. "I think it's very bad for mankind. It's very bad for this world … I really think that there's going to be a lot of pressure on Russia to make sure that peace happens, because frankly if Russia didn't go in and back this animal, you wouldn't have a problem right now."
Wow, it's almost as if Trump now knows what everyone has known about Putin for years.
Nah, he's just starting the process to make the just the absolute best deals with Russia. Yuge deals are his thing. You're gonna be sick of all the greatest deals he's gonna make.
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
2013: 22% of Republicans and 38% of Democrats support strikes on Syria in retaliation for chemical weapons. 2017: 86% of Republicans and 37% of Democrats support strikes on Syria in retaliation for chemical weapons
4 years apart, vastly different stances amongst Republicans on military force in Syria, nearly quadrupling the level of support, while Democrats remain unchanged.
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
2013: 22% of Republicans and 38% of Democrats support strikes on Syria in retaliation for chemical weapons. 2017: 86% of Republicans and 37% of Democrats support strikes on Syria in retaliation for chemical weapons
4 years apart, vastly different stances amongst Republicans on military force in Syria, nearly quadrupling the level of support, while Democrats remain unchanged.
But of course. For all the talk of "both parties are just as bad!", it never seems to actually be the case.
Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote: Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote: Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
BaronIveagh wrote: Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
2013: 22% of Republicans and 38% of Democrats support strikes on Syria in retaliation for chemical weapons. 2017: 86% of Republicans and 37% of Democrats support strikes on Syria in retaliation for chemical weapons
4 years apart, vastly different stances amongst Republicans on military force in Syria, nearly quadrupling the level of support, while Democrats remain unchanged.
War fatigue and partisanship play a large role here, I would guess. With Obama having done the same as Trump at this time, the percentages might easily be reversed. Maybe not. Dems don't generally want a whole lot of military posturing. They might have stayed the same either way. I guess it points to consistency. The GOP hated anything Obama would do, or could have done, but their guy is cool and can do no wrong. The Dems just don't like conflict.
What is interesting is how the party elites don't really reflect the masses here. The Dems are quite cohesive in Washington, and have been for some time, the GOP is the opposite. Not really the way their voters look at things.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/04/12 18:36:28
whembly wrote: Or, it could simply be a reflection that no one wanted the Obama Administration to "handle" this situation.
And they honestly believe *Trump* will do better?
Really?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Gordon Shumway wrote: The GOP hated anything Obama would do, or could have done, but their guy is cool and can do no wrong. The Dems just don't like conflict.
thats basically what I got out of it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/04/12 18:53:36
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
sense
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