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If Chaos wasn't a factor, which legions do you believe would still turn traitor?

Night Lords, no argument there. Just found out how insane Perturabo was even pre heresy. He was given his legion of space marines so what does he do? He had his men murder each other because he was all, son i am disappoint.

Not too sure about world eaters to be honest despite their nerd rage.

Alpha legion i think would just stay the same.

Word Bearers is tricky. The main reason they turned traitor was, Chaos. I think that maybe if they didn't have some other Gods to worship i honestly think they would be loyal.

Death guard, emperors children, i think would be loyal.

Thousand Sons is tricky because chaos was a huge factor in their fall.

I'm pretty sure Death Guard would eventually go traitor as Morty was starting to look suspicious right before the Heresy

The Thousand sons would eventually have to answer for their ignorance of the council of Niccea and whilst I doubt they'd go full traitor when confronted on it, I reckon they'd still get in trouble.

Angron and Curze would probably lead their legions into the ground and be purged.

Perhaps the Iron warriors would as well, due to Pertaubo's anger at Dorn and the fact they were treated terribly.

Iron Warriors, Night Lords, Space Wolves and Thousand Sons. That's right, the Wolves would be there too. Iron Warriors and Night Lords would go renegade I'm sure, becoming something of Corsair Legions or carving out a new empire. The Wolves and Sons are both too corrupted to fit in with the others and there would be no reason to keep psykers and mutants in when there are still 16 Legions at full strength. They would be done away with like the two missing Legions or forced to turn traitor to survive being purged.

But Space Wolves were used very similar to the Night Lords, being sent as the attack dog against targets, and then reprimanded for doing too much damage. I'm sure that they would have been cast down as renegades just like Curze was.

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Iron Warriors, Night Lords, Space Wolves and Thousand Sons. That's right, the Wolves would be there too. Iron Warriors and Night Lords would go renegade I'm sure, becoming something of Corsair Legions or carving out a new empire. The Wolves and Sons are both too corrupted to fit in with the others and there would be no reason to keep psykers and mutants in when there are still 16 Legions at full strength. They would be done away with like the two missing Legions or forced to turn traitor to survive being purged.

But Space Wolves were used very similar to the Night Lords, being sent as the attack dog against targets, and then reprimanded for doing too much damage. I'm sure that they would have been cast down as renegades just like Curze was.

It seems to me that if your going to use that argument for the Space Wolves, then the Blood Angels must surely have wound up on the chopping block eventually too. They're just as mutated, if not more so.
Also, the Dark Angels would still have had their schism, since Chaos wasn't the main contributing factor.
I'm wondering if HORUS would have still eventually turned with his legion. It doesn't seem like he would've been convinced by that vision of the future if he didn't already carry some doubt in his heart.

Only reason I'd say the Blood Angels aren't on that list is because of Sanguinus's puritanical devotion. They're mutated, but I have this inkling that the gene seed would have been recreated if Sanguinus lived. They have their issues but the issues all tend to have come from the Heresy trauma. I might be wrong since Blood Angels are a chapter I never had any interest in. I've only got vague notions about what's going on with them.

 fallinq wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Iron Warriors, Night Lords, Space Wolves and Thousand Sons. That's right, the Wolves would be there too. Iron Warriors and Night Lords would go renegade I'm sure, becoming something of Corsair Legions or carving out a new empire. The Wolves and Sons are both too corrupted to fit in with the others and there would be no reason to keep psykers and mutants in when there are still 16 Legions at full strength. They would be done away with like the two missing Legions or forced to turn traitor to survive being purged.

But Space Wolves were used very similar to the Night Lords, being sent as the attack dog against targets, and then reprimanded for doing too much damage. I'm sure that they would have been cast down as renegades just like Curze was.

It seems to me that if your going to use that argument for the Space Wolves, then the Blood Angels must surely have wound up on the chopping block eventually too. They're just as mutated, if not more so.
Also, the Dark Angels would still have had their schism, since Chaos wasn't the main contributing factor.
I'm wondering if HORUS would have still eventually turned with his legion. It doesn't seem like he would've been convinced by that vision of the future if he didn't already carry some doubt in his heart.

I think Horus would still have turned. Dark Angels is tough, I think there would still be the chism, but I think Lion El would have put it down with little resistance had Chaos not given their champion (I can't for the life of me remember his name) a boon and suped him up.

Space Wolves is tough. I don't think they would have turned but probably be on the exteriors/treated as outcasts. Blood Angels would either turn or would be heavily questioned due to their obsession. Hell, they're almost worshiping Khorne.

 jreilly89 wrote:

 fallinq wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Iron Warriors, Night Lords, Space Wolves and Thousand Sons. That's right, the Wolves would be there too. Iron Warriors and Night Lords would go renegade I'm sure, becoming something of Corsair Legions or carving out a new empire. The Wolves and Sons are both too corrupted to fit in with the others and there would be no reason to keep psykers and mutants in when there are still 16 Legions at full strength. They would be done away with like the two missing Legions or forced to turn traitor to survive being purged.

But Space Wolves were used very similar to the Night Lords, being sent as the attack dog against targets, and then reprimanded for doing too much damage. I'm sure that they would have been cast down as renegades just like Curze was.

It seems to me that if your going to use that argument for the Space Wolves, then the Blood Angels must surely have wound up on the chopping block eventually too. They're just as mutated, if not more so.
Also, the Dark Angels would still have had their schism, since Chaos wasn't the main contributing factor.
I'm wondering if HORUS would have still eventually turned with his legion. It doesn't seem like he would've been convinced by that vision of the future if he didn't already carry some doubt in his heart.

I think Horus would still have turned. Dark Angels is tough, I think there would still be the chism, but I think Lion El would have put it down with little resistance had Chaos not given their champion (I can't for the life of me remember his name) a boon and suped him up.

Space Wolves is tough. I don't think they would have turned but probably be on the exteriors/treated as outcasts. Blood Angels would either turn or would be heavily questioned due to their obsession. Hell, they're almost worshiping Khorne.

All space marines worship Khorne, whether they like it or not. The issue with the Blood Angels' geneseed would have come to a head at some point, but as long as Sanguinius lived they would never have turned traitor.

 Orblivion wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:

 fallinq wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Iron Warriors, Night Lords, Space Wolves and Thousand Sons. That's right, the Wolves would be there too. Iron Warriors and Night Lords would go renegade I'm sure, becoming something of Corsair Legions or carving out a new empire. The Wolves and Sons are both too corrupted to fit in with the others and there would be no reason to keep psykers and mutants in when there are still 16 Legions at full strength. They would be done away with like the two missing Legions or forced to turn traitor to survive being purged.

But Space Wolves were used very similar to the Night Lords, being sent as the attack dog against targets, and then reprimanded for doing too much damage. I'm sure that they would have been cast down as renegades just like Curze was.

It seems to me that if your going to use that argument for the Space Wolves, then the Blood Angels must surely have wound up on the chopping block eventually too. They're just as mutated, if not more so.
Also, the Dark Angels would still have had their schism, since Chaos wasn't the main contributing factor.
I'm wondering if HORUS would have still eventually turned with his legion. It doesn't seem like he would've been convinced by that vision of the future if he didn't already carry some doubt in his heart.

I think Horus would still have turned. Dark Angels is tough, I think there would still be the chism, but I think Lion El would have put it down with little resistance had Chaos not given their champion (I can't for the life of me remember his name) a boon and suped him up.

Space Wolves is tough. I don't think they would have turned but probably be on the exteriors/treated as outcasts. Blood Angels would either turn or would be heavily questioned due to their obsession. Hell, they're almost worshiping Khorne.

All space marines worship Khorne, whether they like it or not. The issue with the Blood Angels' geneseed would have come to a head at some point, but as long as Sanguinius lived they would never have turned traitor.

True, but I still think they would investigated.

Night Lords were already traitors before the heresy began.
Angron was on the verge of death by the time of Lorgar's shadow crusade, if Angron hadn't been princed, he would have died and someone more reasonable would have taken over.
Perturabo didn't have the motivation to go traitor on his own. Sure, he felt underappreciated, but given that the Great Crusade was coming to a close, he would've been able to return to his little knick-knacks soon enough.
Without anyone to worship, the Word Bearers may have torn themselves apart, but Lorgar would probably stay loyal.

Thousand Sons would have... mutated to death? While Magnus is forced to take control of the Golden Throne in place of the Emperor...

Those who could control the mutation might be adopted into other chapters or given another role protecting/contributing to Magnus on Terra.

World eaters, not sure but minus there primarch they may have normalised and been less crazy as he was the issue not the legion itself.

Night lords yes, they where already on list to deal with

Space wolves not sure as they despite mutation proved useful and far more controlled than world eaters on the rage implants.

Word bearers, no as chaos was main thing, but the whole worship thing maybe could have been handled better and channeled into useful atrabutes.

Thousand sons, problems, but maybe could be brought back into fold despite issues.

Iron warriors may have had issues but all knew one alone could not rebel, it took Horus and 9 to take the plunge.

Finally sons of Horus, no as despite his flaws, no chaos = no catalist to send him to chaos with word bearers etc.

I think the world eaters would have been absorbed into another legion when Angron had to be inevitably put down.

I am going to throw White Scars into the mix. Traitor is to harsh a word for some legions, besides World Eaters and Nightlords who had issues, lets use Rouge.

Khan would have gotten to upset with dad consolidating power and being tyrant, so he runs off with his legion to the end of the galaxy to continue his hunt.

Iron Warriors. With no chaos and the galaxy conquered the Imperium would have likely been divided among the Primarchs to govern. I think Pert would have fortified his region and been a real dick to everyone

Alpha Legion would go rouge as well, just to troll his brothers, having nothing else to do..

And considering the Dark Angels, it is hard to say they would have had a schism. With no Chaos their world would not have had that "chaos taint" and would not have drove people bonkers.

Also keep in mind that it was chaos that was whispering doubt into Luther's mind the whole time, helping him jump off the edge.

No Chaos = No Primarchs