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2014/08/11 17:13:27
Subject: GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
hi all, ive been drilling bolter barrels and as i didn't have any spares i used tactical marines from my collection. As you can imagine i didn't quite get it spot on for the first couple of marines, so i need to fill the small holes and re-do them. my question is which would work best, GW's LGS or Vallejo's plastic putty. Alternate materials to fix this problem are welcome
cheers
LS40k
2014/08/11 17:35:02
Subject: GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
I don't like the liquid green stuff and I prefer plastic putty for small hole and gap filling. However, you are going to be redrilling it you might to try something firmer like Milliput. I'm not sure how plastic putty would respond to drilling.
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2014/08/11 17:54:58
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
Bronzefists42 wrote: I noticed that the plastic glue label recommends wearing something akin to a hazmat suit when handling the glue. I have been using it for years and never used gloves or anything nor do I know anyone who does. ShouldI be worried for my health?
Well, there's a slight risk of gluing something together with it. Only slight, mind.
2014/08/11 18:06:47
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
Don't use LGS, it shrinks. You'll fill the hole with it then come back when it's dry and the hole will be back again. Use a putty, it probably doesn't make a hell of a lot of difference which one you use.
If you're going to redrill, I agree on the milliput. It's good if you want to do any post working. You could also fill the hole and before it cures, create a dent where you want the center of the hole to be so that it's a guide, if you get it wrong you can just fix it while the milliput is still soft (I've never tried it, just suggesting it might work... it also might not if the drill bites on something and gets pulled off target).
Is there a non 10-minute version you can post? Maybe just a one liner, what is the use of LGS? I'm not in a place where I can watch/listen to a long video, lol.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/11 18:07:29
2014/08/11 18:30:49
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
thanks for the replies, i forgot to mention about the redrilling, so its lucky your head was screwed on unlike mine lol. Ive seen that video about the real use for lgs, i think the guy said it was used for roughing up surfaces/giving a surface some texture, or something along those lines. I was just hoping the lgs was a quick solution
is milliput like ordinary green stuff ? If so that would be great as ive been meaning to get into sculpting chapter symbols for my marines.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/11 18:31:59
2014/08/11 18:42:39
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
AllSeeingSkink wrote: Don't use LGS, it shrinks. You'll fill the hole with it then come back when it's dry and the hole will be back again. Use a putty, it probably doesn't make a hell of a lot of difference which one you use.
If you're going to redrill, I agree on the milliput. It's good if you want to do any post working. You could also fill the hole and before it cures, create a dent where you want the center of the hole to be so that it's a guide, if you get it wrong you can just fix it while the milliput is still soft (I've never tried it, just suggesting it might work... it also might not if the drill bites on something and gets pulled off target).
Is there a non 10-minute version you can post? Maybe just a one liner, what is the use of LGS? I'm not in a place where I can watch/listen to a long video, lol.
It definitely doesn't need 10 minutes, but it's a very neat little trick. It basically adds grainy texture to a smooth surface, not as harshly as sand but still nice for a 'filthy' sort of look after painting.
Well, it's an epoxy putty that's activated by mixing the two parts together and then hardens over a number of hours. Otherwise, not so much. Copypasta from another topic:
I wrote:Milliput was another one developed for plumbing and DIY repairs, but ironically you're much more likely to find it in hobby, art and craft shops. (Which are exactly the three shops where I can get it in Belfast, and nowhere else offline) But if you've used green stuff before, be aware that milliput handles very differently. Rather than the elastic, chewing-gum consistency of GS, it's quite claylike, a wee bit messy (particularly on tools and fingertips) and 'tears' rather than stretching. It's slightly water-soluble, so if you use a lot of water as tool lubrication it can create a slippery layer (just like 'clay slip') that can create more mess and prevent the putty sticking to the intended surface.
Like I say, that's a word of caution, not a warning to put you off it. It does have advantages too: it's much easier to smooth, and to model sharper edges in milliput than green stuff. It cures hard rather than rubbery, and be quite easily carved and filed afterwards. In that way you can smooth over any little hiccups in your sculpting, cut extra details, and sand sharp edges even sharper. And yep, it costs as little as £2 for a 1/4 lb. It just needs a little getting used to, maybe more than some other putties, but when you know what you're doing...
Tips for general sculpting, but especially relevant for milliput:
- Wash up well after use. (especially hands and fingers after mixing)
- Get a balance between too much and too little water lube. (Personally, I use a piece of wet sponge in a shallow dish to moisten my tools, rather than have them dripping wet) Alternatively, use an oil-based lubricant like vaseline.
- Stick the putty on when it's freshly mixed, and most sticky. It'll also help if there's something on the model to give extra purchase, like a roughed-up surface, grooves or notches. Form it into rough shapes, like a 'sketch', at this point.
- Then leave the putty for a while. In the case of green stuff it's not strictly necessary, but it lets the stickiness calm down a bit and the putty firm up a bit, making it easier to work. With GS a wait of 15-20 mins in usually mentioned. (by which time you'll probably have finished, or are still doing, the rough shaping anyway)
In the case of milliput a pause in sculpting is even more recommended. It lets those wee little polymers start binding together, reducing the fragile softness, crumbliness and water-solubility of fresh putty, and leaving a more pleasant and workable texture. It can be left up to a hour, though that depends on local temperatures and is about the upper limit.
Me, I like mixing a bit of green stuff into milliput. The elastic nature of GS also helps bind the milliput together.
Standard milliput yellow-grey is cheap and widely available in the UK. However, there are other claylike, hard-curing putties like A+B, or the two others I've personally tried: magic sculp and apoxie sculpt. Similar to eachother, and a bit more expensive than milliput, but more what you might call 'user-friendly'. (i.e. they have fewer foibles to get used to) The webshop I'd normally point people to is kaput right now, but have a look here and here...(Though be aware I'm not sure how many of those links are still current, and there's always ebay too.)
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2014/08/11 19:58:55
LordSmurf40k wrote: thanks for the replies, i forgot to mention about the redrilling, so its lucky your head was screwed on unlike mine lol. Ive seen that video about the real use for lgs, i think the guy said it was used for roughing up surfaces/giving a surface some texture, or something along those lines. I was just hoping the lgs was a quick solution
is milliput like ordinary green stuff ? If so that would be great as ive been meaning to get into sculpting chapter symbols for my marines.
Milliput tends to sculpt into harder edges than GS, IIRC.
It definitely doesn't need 10 minutes, but it's a very neat little trick. It basically adds grainy texture to a smooth surface, not as harshly as sand but still nice for a 'filthy' sort of look after painting.
The first 5 or so minutes is the guy ranting about how rubbish LGS is at its original purpose: Gap filling.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/11 19:48:39
SIUC Strategic Games Society, a Roleplaying/Tabletop/Card student organization/club at Southern Illinois University - Carbondale
Bronzefists42 wrote: I noticed that the plastic glue label recommends wearing something akin to a hazmat suit when handling the glue. I have been using it for years and never used gloves or anything nor do I know anyone who does. ShouldI be worried for my health?
Well, there's a slight risk of gluing something together with it. Only slight, mind.
2014/08/11 20:30:29
Subject: GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
LordSmurf40k wrote: hi all, ive been drilling bolter barrels and as i didn't have any spares i used tactical marines from my collection. As you can imagine i didn't quite get it spot on for the first couple of marines, so i need to fill the small holes and re-do them. my question is which would work best, GW's LGS or Vallejo's plastic putty. Alternate materials to fix this problem are welcome
cheers
LS40k
Not really what you asked for but since I am a bit of a neatfreak when it comes to centering barrel holes I have a tip that has served me well.
I first make a very small indent with the drill, maybe half the width of the drill using the conical tip. Then I check the centering. If it is off I tilt the drill about 45 degrees to drill slightly sideways in the direction you want to move the hole. Be very gentle with the pressure here, you are not drilling but rather recentering the hole. When you are satisfied with the centering, continue to drill the hole with perfect centering. Everyone is happy!
// Andreas
Dark Angels 4th Company (3,830pts) 950pts fully painted
2014/08/12 04:46:36
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
Milliput is good for redrilling because it's quite hard. Greenstuff (not liquid, the 2 part) cures to be a more rubbery finish, making it harder to cut/sand/drill later. Though you can cut and drill greenstuff, because it's soft it tends to come off in chunks. Since milliput dries harder and more rigid, when you go to cut/drill/sand it, it shaves off more smoothly and predictably. I'm sure there's other putties that are similar to milliput, but of the ones I've used, it's the best for that. I have used some types of plumbers epoxies as well which can be gotten quite cheap from hardware stores, but I find they are either too rigid and brittle or too soft and floppy (like greenstuff). So milliput is what I recommend out of what I've tried.
Evertras wrote: It definitely doesn't need 10 minutes, but it's a very neat little trick. It basically adds grainy texture to a smooth surface, not as harshly as sand but still nice for a 'filthy' sort of look after painting.
Oh yeah, I've seen a friend use it for nurgle-ing vehicles. I've never understood why people make excessively long videos to explain something simple "Liquid greenstuff is bad a gap filler, it shrinks, is difficult to manipulate to fully fill a gap and requires post work to clean it up. It is, however, good for applying to a surface to give it texture (show image)". See, doesn't need a 10 minute video. Sorry for the off topic rant, it's something that bugs me, people making long videos for something better communicated through text.
The only time I want to see videos in this context is when it's some procedure that you are demonstrating... or if it's a hot chick and I'm just watching it for the eye candy
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/08/12 04:49:38
2014/08/12 12:04:32
Subject: GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
See, doesn't need a 10 minute video. Sorry for the off topic rant, it's something that bugs me, people making long videos for something better communicated through text.
I hear that. He forgets the adage 'show, don't tell' for a while and I don't care if he took six minutes or six months (feels like he took six months to stumble through that explanation), but he lost me way before that with the magic word, 'unboxing'.
So... Um... I agree about drilling holes: get a wee guide mark in there to help centre the drill bit. Sometimes with tricky jobs (not usually soft styrene) I drill a narrower guide hole first, which is usually quicker and a bit easier to centre. Then the drill bit of the required diameter simply widens that, with a little less effort than if you started with it.
thanks everybody for the input and the tips, really helps. can you use milliput to create the ultramarine logo and apply it to a shoulder pad, as my models are from years ago so their already glued......and it saves me £6 for 10 pads from GW. If the answers yes, can you then create a mould with the milliput so i can cast the symbol instead of having to sculpt it each time?
Cheers
2014/08/13 22:16:15
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
I use the plastic putty as a small gap filler, and the liquid green stuff as more of a surfacer (for small scratches, abrasions, very small cracks, etc.).
There are a lot of other good ideas in this thread as well (miliput, etc.).
best of luck!
DavePak
"Remember, in life, the only thing you absolutely control is your own attitude - do not squander that power."
Fully Painted armies:
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2014/08/15 19:38:01
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
hey guys thanks for all the advice. I was thinking of using milliput for press moulding to help keep the symbols uniform for all my ultramarines. Could also create new symbols with it to, such as an aquila with the ultramarine symbol in the middle, or being held in its claws
cheers
2014/08/15 22:21:06
Subject: Re:GW liquid green stuff or Vallejo plastic putty?
The problem with a lot of this stuff is it's not used properly for the correct purpose. For example, I know there are at least 3 grades of the Milliput and I routinely use the wrong one for the wrong chore. Thanks for posting "the proper use of Greenstuff" video. I think that will help a lot of people.
It'd be great if someone did a vid of all the compounds and what they're intended use it. Although I don't think it will work for what you're doing, there's Zap-A-Gap, probably the most misused modelling substance around!
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Dark Angels 4th Company (3,830pts) 950pts fully painted
