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Inspired by this thread lets explore the opposite idea.

Build the worst possible list while maxing out a FOC. Who has the most pathetic army possible? Every unit you select must take all available bodies and upgrades (but not necessarily the best available upgrades). If your HQ can take an honor guard or vehicle or something it must do so. If your troops can take a transport they must, unless the squad is too big to take a transport.

Gwaihirsbrother wrote:
unless the squad is too big to take a transport.

I'm interested, why did you place this restriction?

Edit: Also, when you say "must take all available upgrades", could you clarify? Some units have access to more upgrades than they may legally take. (Chapter Masters, for example, may take AA or Termi Armour, but it restricts what else may be taken.)

I'm interested, why did you place this restriction?

If an entry says something like "if the squad has x or fewer models it may take a transport". In that case if you take x+y models you can't take a transport. That is fine. You don't have to limit to x models and take the transport. You can go either way: take x+y models, or take x models + transport. If you can take x+y models andd the transport you would need to do that.

Edit: Also, when you say "must take all available upgrades", could you clarify? Some units have access to more upgrades than they may legally take. (Chapter Masters, for example, may take AA or Termi Armour, but it restricts what else may be taken.)

An example would be an Eldar vehicle with TL shuriken catapults with the option to upgrade to a shuriken cannon. Must take the upgrade. If you can't legally take the upgrade you can't take it. I'm looking for a legal list that throws as much stuff as possible onto every model and squad that is a terrible list.

Gwaihirsbrother wrote:

I'm interested, why did you place this restriction?

If an entry says something like "if the squad has x or fewer models it may take a transport". In that case if you take x+y models you can't take a transport. That is fine. You don't have to limit to x models and take the transport. You can go either way: take x+y models, or take x models + transport. If you can take x+y models andd the transport you would need to do that.

Ah, I understand.
Sorry, I thought you were implying you couldn't take a transport if you had more models than its capacity (I know there are some transports that state that).

Gwaihirsbrother wrote:

Edit: Also, when you say "must take all available upgrades", could you clarify? Some units have access to more upgrades than they may legally take. (Chapter Masters, for example, may take AA or Termi Armour, but it restricts what else may be taken.)

An example would be an Eldar vehicle with TL shuriken catapults with the option to upgrade to a shuriken cannon. Must take the upgrade. If you can't legally take the upgrade you can't take it. I'm looking for a legal list that throws as much stuff as possible onto every model and squad that is a terrible list.

Okay, I'm with you.

I'll start thinking about the best worst list I can!

HQ
- Old One Eye
- Deathleaper

Elite
3 x 3 Pyrovores

Troops
6 x 9 Ripperswarms with all upgrades

FA
Either max winged Rippers or just Spore Mines

HS
3 x Tyrannofex with Fleshborer hives

I was trying to come up with an extra-sucky codex marine list following these parameters, and was having problems making a list that was unplayable.

HQs are probably going to be captains with stormbolters. I’d have to double check to see if you can take two of them on one model; I think you can.

Elites are going to be 3 TLHF/ML dreads.

Troops are max scouts, probably with shotguns. They get to skip out on the LSSs, as they are to big (but with combat squadding could actually use them well)

FA is a tough choice. Probably max HB attack bike squads.

HS is whirlwinds.

Dark Eldar

Hq: The K Man (Please don't make me spell his name...the Mandrake one)

Elites: 3x10 Mandrakes.

Troops: 3x10 units of Wyches without Haywire grenades...ON FOOT!

Fast Attack: 3x10 Hellions...Without the Baron!

Heavy Support: 3 Chronus Pain Engines.

I win

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Dark Eldar

Hq: The K Man (Please don't make me spell his name...the Mandrake one)

Elites: 3x10 Mandrakes.

Troops: 3x10 units of Wyches without Haywire grenades...ON FOOT!

Fast Attack: 3x10 Hellions...Without the Baron!

Heavy Support: 3 Chronus Pain Engines.

I win

I raise you with:

HQ: The Changeling
- Herald of Tzeentch w/Lesser Locus of Transmogrification + Mutating Warpblade + Lv2 Psyker on Divination
- Herald of Tzeentch w/Greater Locus of Change + Staff of Change + Lv2 Psyker on Divination
- Herald of Tzeentch w/Greater Locus of Change + Staff of Change + Lv2 Psyker on Divination
HQ: The Blue Scribes of Tzeentch

Elites: 3x 9 Flamers of Tzeentch inclu Pyrocaster w/Mutating Warpblade

Troops: 4x 20 Pink Horrors w/full command inclu Blasted Standard & Staff of Change on champ.
2x9 Nurgling bases

Fast Attack: 3x 20 Chaos Furies w/Daemon of Tzeentch

Heavy: 3x Burning Chariot of Tzeentch w/Blue Horror crew & Exalt Flamer w/Mutating Warpblade.


A close combat Tzeentch army that gets 0 summoning help from Malefic, and decked out to try and become a Chaos Spawn factory through those warpblades, whilst still providing some fireworks care of a smattering of boomsticks!
At the very least, it'll be worth the price of popcorn!

 Shadox wrote:
HQ
- Old One Eye
- Deathleaper

Elite
3 x 3 Pyrovores

Troops
6 x 9 Ripperswarms with all upgrades

FA
Either max winged Rippers or just Spore Mines

HS
3 x Tyrannofex with Fleshborer hives

Very Nice! I was thinking of Termagants, x30 with double glands.

Farsight Tau probably win this.

HQ: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Elite: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Troops: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Fast: gun drone squads upgraded to shield drones

Heavy: heavy gun drones

Fortification: remote sensor towers

LoW: Orca


Yes, that is a Tau list with 18x twin-linked BS 2 burst cannons, a BS 4 twin-linked long-barreled burst cannon, and a BS 4 missile pod. And NO OTHER RANGED WEAPONS. Have fun trying to win with a Tau list whose best chance of killing anything is in melee!

HQ 3 warbosses, maxed our most expensive gribblies
3 meks

Elite
3 maxed out nob squads

Troops 9 max squads of gretchin

Fast: 3 bommas

Heavy: 3 maxed out wagons

LoW: ghazzy

Get shart all done, but if those nobs actually hit home it would be hilarious.

Of course Legion of the Damned detachment only. Auto-lose every game!

On a more serious note, Inquisition:

HQ: barebone Inquisitor
Elite x3: 36 Daemonhosts.

 Peregrine wrote:
Farsight Tau probably win this.

HQ: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Elite: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Troops: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Fast: gun drone squads upgraded to shield drones

Heavy: heavy gun drones

Fortification: remote sensor towers

LoW: Orca


Yes, that is a Tau list with 18x twin-linked BS 2 burst cannons, a BS 4 twin-linked long-barreled burst cannon, and a BS 4 missile pod. And NO OTHER RANGED WEAPONS. Have fun trying to win with a Tau list whose best chance of killing anything is in melee!

oh god, lol

An entire army of the Damned. Auto lose end of turn 1.

 Peregrine wrote:
Farsight Tau probably win this.

HQ: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Elite: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Troops: crisis suits with all upgrade slots filled with support systems instead of weapons

Fast: gun drone squads upgraded to shield drones

Heavy: heavy gun drones

Fortification: remote sensor towers

LoW: Orca


Yes, that is a Tau list with 18x twin-linked BS 2 burst cannons, a BS 4 twin-linked long-barreled burst cannon, and a BS 4 missile pod. And NO OTHER RANGED WEAPONS. Have fun trying to win with a Tau list whose best chance of killing anything is in melee!

Farsight detachment cant have elite crisis suits, it converts them to troops, not as an additional option.
You'll have to settle for stealth suits in the elite section. still one of the least efficient units in the game. (for all who wonder, a gunless crisis suit team can cap at a stunning 269 for 3 suits that one of is a sargant that pack FnP, optional skyfire and 4+invuls, and nothing else, at all.)

Elysians. heh.

HQ: 2 Lord Commissar (Power Fist, Plasma Pistol)

Elites: 3x 3 Drop Sentinels (can't fit in transports)

Troops: 6x Veteran Squad (Grenade Launchers, Valkyrie with missiles)

Fast Attack: 3x5 Tauros Assault Vehicles (Flamers) with Sky Talons

Heavy Support: 3x Demolition Teams

Militarium tempestus:

1 command squad full upgrades, ded taurox prime
4x 10 tempestus scions, upgrades ded railroad primes

Basically what you have here is a totally worthless army devoid of unique flavor. No anti magic, no anti flyer, lousy anti tank, no counters to av14+

But all the lasrifles are twinlinked which is nice

The funny part is that this list is really one of your only options playing tempestus scions. People rag on the de, sob, and ba for being trash but then totally forget about the scions and how utter rubbish they are as a codex.

Space Wolves:

HQ:
-Cannis Wolfborn

- Wolf Guard Battle Leader
- Terminator armor
- frost sword
- combi-flamer
- digital weapons

Troops:
-15 Bloodclaws
- 2 Flamers
- Wolfguard Pack Leader w/ terminator armor, combi-flamer, and frost sword
- Stormwolf DT

-5 more units of the above-

6 Lone Wolves w/ Terminator armor, combi-flamers, and frost swords

Elite:
- Murderfang
- Drop Pod DT w/ Deathwind ML

- 10 Wolf Guard (power armor variant)
- 10x combi-flamer
- 10x frost swords
- Rhino DT w/ ram, extra armor, and missile

- another unit of the above -

2 Lone Wolves w/ Terminator armor, combi-flamers, and frost swords

Fast attack:
Nothing but Fenrisian Wolves!

Heavy Support:
3 Whirlwinds

Why do people keep posting lists that will effortlessly beat the no-gun Tau? For example, that SW list is clearly terrible, but it has weapons and functional units. You need to try much harder to come up with units that are useless, not just a bit poorly optimized.

 BoomWolf wrote:
Farsight detachment cant have elite crisis suits, it converts them to troops, not as an additional option.

And you take the elite ones from the Tau codex. Remember how the "faction" thing works, you can now mix Farsight and normal Tau in the same FOC.

HQ:

The decapitator


troops:
5 wyches
5 wyches

elites
10 mandrakes
10 mandrakes
10 mandrakes

heavy support
3 chronos parasite engines



Done.

 Peregrine wrote:
Why do people keep posting lists that will effortlessly beat the no-gun Tau? For example, that SW list is clearly terrible, but it has weapons and functional units. You need to try much harder to come up with units that are useless, not just a bit poorly optimized.

 BoomWolf wrote:
Farsight detachment cant have elite crisis suits, it converts them to troops, not as an additional option.

And you take the elite ones from the Tau codex. Remember how the "faction" thing works, you can now mix Farsight and normal Tau in the same FOC.

I was going to say the same. That Tau list is horrible. I can't think of an army that could fail that hard.

 Peregrine wrote:
Why do people keep posting lists that will effortlessly beat the no-gun Tau? For example, that SW list is clearly terrible, but it has weapons and functional units. You need to try much harder to come up with units that are useless, not just a bit poorly optimized.

Well it is the clear winner so far (legion of the damned doesn't really count), but it is still interesting to see people shooting for second place. Some armies though even if built as badly as possible are still ok, clearly not tournament winners or anything, but with some codexes it isn't possibe to get even close to that Tau list.

I wonder what the best worst list someone can come up with for eldar would be. That will be hard to do, need to find a way to avoid wave serpents in the list.

 Shadox wrote:
HQ
- Old One Eye
- Deathleaper

Elite
3 x 3 Pyrovores

Troops
6 x 9 Ripperswarms with all upgrades

FA
Either max winged Rippers or just Spore Mines

HS
3 x Tyrannofex with Fleshborer hives

You know I will go ahead and say that this is the worse list I can imagine with one caveat...

Take broods of 3x carnifex, decked out with all the upgrades for a CC monsters, then watch them eat themselves outside of synapse range rather than take the Tyrannofex, I feel like the Tyrannofex is in danger of actually accomplishing something by itself.

And yes, I think this list is worse than the Tau one. Even if both armies did absolutely nothing, the Tyranid list would still kill itself.

Trying to do one for Eldar:

HQ

Autarch with a scorpion chainsword, warp spider jump pack and fusion pistol

Elites

Banshees and/or harlequins

Troops

2x rangers

One squad of 20 storm guardians

Fast Attack

3x1 Vyper with EML's and Shuriken Cannons

Heavy Support

3x Dark Reapers

Maybe add Maugan Ra into the Storm Guardians squad so he's not where he's supposed to be and costing entirely too many points while he's there.

 Peregrine wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
Farsight detachment cant have elite crisis suits, it converts them to troops, not as an additional option.

And you take the elite ones from the Tau codex. Remember how the "faction" thing works, you can now mix Farsight and normal Tau in the same FOC.

We tried to find way around that many, MANY times in ATT for optimization purposes, but there isn't.
Its not a function of how "faction" works, its a function of how "farsight enclaves" (and other supplements) work. due to the fact they modifey entire detachments, you either have their rules applied to the entire detachment-or not at all, mixing is impossible under the rules as listed in the supplement itself. (if the supplement was worded differently it WOULD have been possible.)

CSM

HQ - Sorc MoT
Elite - Mutilators MoT
Troops - Lots of Tsons
Fast - Warp Talons MoT
Heavy - Forgefiend

MarsNZ wrote:
CSM

HQ - Sorc MoT
Elite - Mutilators MoT
Troops - Lots of Tsons
Fast - Warp Talons MoT
Heavy - Forgefiend

Sorry, aside from the Mutilators and 'talons, I actually run this list to great effect :p

Against what?

Other lists from this thread?

SENTINELS OF TERRA

HQ- Librarian, (roll on sanctic) grav pistol, auspex
HQ 2- as above

TROOPS 1-6: Scouts with shotguns, sergeants with sniper rifles

ELITE- 3x assault centurions

FAST ATTACK 3x scout bikers

HEAVY SUPPORT: 3x assault centurions

Now you have an abominably expensive army that's almost entirely useless outside of 18 inches. I do like the idea of 54 infiltrating shotguns though.