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I didn't want to take this http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/614050.page thread off on a tangent....

When a tank is bubble-wrapped by a unit (or units) of troops, do you allow the tank a 5+ cover save for firing through an intervening unit? Surely the 25% cover restriction for vehicles supersedes the more general firing-through-intervening-unit rule? Given the size of a trooper relative to the size of a tank, I always think you're hard-pressed to claim that infantry are providing 25% cover to a larger vehicle (smaller vehicle....maybe).

Shooting through a unit confers a cover save as if the target was in area terrain. Since vehicles do not intrinsically get a cover save from being in area terrain, you would still need to be 25% obscured.

 Happyjew wrote:
Shooting through a unit confers a cover save as if the target was in area terrain. Since vehicles do not intrinsically get a cover save from being in area terrain, you would still need to be 25% obscured.

It gets a save as if it was behind terrain (not in area terrain). But still needs the 25% standard.

Fragile wrote:

 Happyjew wrote:
Shooting through a unit confers a cover save as if the target was in area terrain. Since vehicles do not intrinsically get a cover save from being in area terrain, you would still need to be 25% obscured.

It gets a save as if it was behind terrain (not in area terrain). But still needs the 25% standard.

Derp. Forgive me. I'm still celebrating the Buffalo Bills actually winning a game.

Snapshot wrote:
I didn't want to take this http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/614050.page thread off on a tangent....

When a tank is bubble-wrapped by a unit (or units) of troops, do you allow the tank a 5+ cover save for firing through an intervening unit? Surely the 25% cover restriction for vehicles supersedes the more general firing-through-intervening-unit rule? Given the size of a trooper relative to the size of a tank, I always think you're hard-pressed to claim that infantry are providing 25% cover to a larger vehicle (smaller vehicle....maybe).

25% obscurity can definitely be achieved by bubble wrapping, no doubt in my mind. It is much easier to get that most people give credit for. Its just because we're looking down at the models all game that it makes it sometimes difficult to ascertain or outright unbelievable. But this image should give you an idea



A line of grots will easily give a rhino 25% obscurity. A wrap of any human sized models around a Leman Russ should have no problem doing the same. Even a Land Raider, which is around the same height, can be easily obscured for that delicious 5+ cover.

Thanks for the image. I think you're right - packed reasonably close there shouldn't be an issue.

Assuming the firing unit is at the same level or lower yes. If it is firing from a heightened position the vehicle might not get the save.