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List 2.6
Another small change. I promoted the SM Cpt back up to a Chapter Master and demoted the WL to a WGBL. The SW dex is very low on models with EW so a SM biker with a SE to take S10 wounds is huge in a TWC unit. The WGBL loses 1A, 1WS, 1W but in the Armor of Russ I get the same saves as a WL in AA with 6A on the charge. Over all I feel that having the extra wound on the biker with EW is more important.

: Combined Arms Detachment (25#, 1286 pts)
HQ
1 Wolf Guard Battle Leader 171 pts Bolt Pistol; Thunderwolf Mount; Armour of Russ; Frost Axe x1
2 Fenrisian Wolves

1 Rune Priest; Psyker (Mastery Level 2)
Elite
1 Iron Priest, 135 pts Thunderwolf Mount;
2 Cyberwolf
Fast
Thunderwolf Cavalry, 270 pts
1 Thunderwolf Cavalry Pack Leader Storm Shield x1; Power Fist x1
1 Thunderwolf Cavalry Power Maul x1; Storm Shield x1;
1 Thunderwolf Cavalry; Power Fist x1
1 Thunderwolf Cavalry Storm Shield x1

1 Drop Pod,
Troops
5 Blood Claws, 295 pts
1 Stormwolf; 2x Twin-linked Multi-meltas

5 Blood Claws, 295 pts
1 Stormwolf; 2x Twin-linked Multi-meltas

: Allied Detachment (560 pts)
HQ
Iron Hands Chapter Master, 245 pts Artificer Armour; Power Fist x1;Space Marine Bike
1 The Shield Eternal [UM]
Troops
Scout Squad], 55 pts
Heavy
2 Centurion Devastator Squad 260 pts Grav-amp; Hurricane Bolter x2; Grav-cannon x2;
1 Centurion Sergeant Grav-amp; Hurricane Bolter; Grav-cannon; Omniscope

Validation Report:
a-0. Army Selection: Battle-forged; c-1. File Version: 1.08 For Bug Reports/www.ab40k.org; b-1. Roster Options: Named or Special Characters; a-1. Scenario: Normal Mission; b-2. Levels of Alliance: Battle Brothers
Roster satisfies all enforced validation rules

Composition Report:
HQ: 2 (- - -)
Elite: 1 (- - -)
Troops: 2 (- - -)
Fast: 2 (- - -)
Heavy: 0 (- - -)
LOW: 0 (0 - 1)
Fort: 0 (0 - 1)

Total Roster Cost: 1846

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interesting idea, would like to see it played out.. however i feel the iron priests are a huge waist of points, maybe some wolf gaurd on bikes to cruise around with the priest? pass that preferred enemy bonus around also a single unit model unit of thunder cav is giving up to much free points to your enemy. keep them in packs of at least three.

Unless I'm wrong the Iron priest can run with the TWC. Everyone on a mount or a bike will team up to be 1 death star unit.

 sickening wrote:
Unless I'm wrong the Iron priest can run with the TWC. Everyone on a mount or a bike will team up to be 1 death star unit.

Sure you can throw iron priests in, since they are IC and on thunder cav, however thundercav can not share a unit with bikes. it doesn't really make a death star unit because it can be picked apart and you cant move wounds around the same, and your charge rolls will have to be for each individual model. I will tell you from personal experience, any thunder cav without a storm shield will be picked apart from AP2 like butter and only being T5, can be devastated from the str10 ap2 plates. your blood claws are kind of a sorry excuse for troops too. I would recommend using the "Champions of fenris" supplement which its detachment does not require 2 troops, its 1 hq - 2 elite. thats a free 140pts for maybe more thunder cav or again wolf gaurd on bikes. its just hard seeing that rune priest going to be solo and an easy target. dont get me wrong, i would love to see this play out, just seems like easy points to the enemy picking a single model/unit and gaining points, even an HQ could be sniped out turn 1 or 2.

Bikes absolutely can join TWC. But you need more cyber wolves. The 4+/FNP and 4+ LOS is critical to keeping the star alive.

I'm not crazy about stormfangs either, I'd try to squeeze in a second drop pod for 3 more grav cents by using the Sentinels of Terra supplement instead of standard SM as your allies. The can take DevCents as HS and Elites. I would agree on the Champs of Fenris though, cheaper tax. Just take a WGBL on TW and then take your two Iron Priests for your elites.

I actually like the Stormfangs for this list. It gives you pivotal anti-tank and AA that you are otherwise lacking. I would say more Cyberwolves, and maybe drop the Missile Launchers on the Cents to make the points for it

Well there is a lot going for on in this list. It is very streamlined but without some Thunder Hammers in the TWC it will be a little lacklustre. Dump the MLs from the Grav Cents. Drop the bike & RA from the Rune Priest (Grav Cents need him), drop the meltaguns from the BCs, drop the SM libby.

This gives you 180 points to play with. As others have stated the Stormwolves are not great particularly without multimeltas, the Skyhammers are poor for the points here. ObSec on flyers and units in flyers is not great. As others have stated CoF might fit this list better. So drop both BC units entirely, whoops noticed you've got the HS ones they are terrible the dedicated transport ones have better weapons, better transport and are less points. So either drop an Iron Priest for 300 points, swap the Stromfangs for Stormwolves with MMs (the same points) and get:

Chapter Master: bike, SE, TH, AA 250

Then add a TH and Power Maul to the TWC.

Or go CoF dropping both flyers and BCs giving 770 points:

Chapter Master: bike, Ghorgons Chains, TH, AA 250

Wolfguard: 4 combi melta, Drop Pod 165

Drop Pod: 35

3 Grav Cents: Omniscope 260

Then add TH and 2 Power Mauls to the TWC

Either way you get a unit of prescienced Grav Cents and someone who can tank S10 for the TWs.

 The Shrike wrote:
Bikes absolutely can join TWC..

my mistake that was a 6th edition rule... TWC could never join anything but other TWC and wolves. Thats cool they deleted that little rule.

i like the idea of the stormfangs, just not the blood claws.

 stormoffires wrote:

 The Shrike wrote:
Bikes absolutely can join TWC..

my mistake that was a 6th edition rule... TWC could never join anything but other TWC and wolves. Thats cool they deleted that little rule.

i like the idea of the stormfangs, just not the blood claws.

Stormfangs are terrible. Stormwolf has better weapons and better transport for less points. Lets compare:

Stormwolf: 235 points gets you 2 tl MMs and tl LasCan.
Stormfang: 255 for the same.

Transport: Wolf 16 & Assault Vehicle vs 6 on Fang ~ Wolf wins
Hellfrost Foccused: Twinlinked and Turret on Wolf vs Lance on Fang ~ wolf wins
Hellfrost dispersed: Twinked Small Blast on Turret on Wolf vs Large Blast Hull mounted on fang ~ Wolf wins

The Stormwolf >>>> Stormfang

List updated

I would go Iron Hands Chapter Tactics, getting IWND and FnP on your tank is far more useful than any of the doctrines to this list.

I would swap the Power Maul over to the naked TWC that way you get an extra attack with it and don't put it in Harms way unnecessarily meaning you have a scrub with a SS who can take bullets for the squad.

Otherwise looking good.

Iron Hands Chapter Tactics, that's a good idea thanks.

Swap the Power Maul over to the naked TWC, kind of funny I was thinking that just after I posted my list.

Quick update. Dang army builder!!!

 FlingitNow wrote:

 stormoffires wrote:

 The Shrike wrote:
Bikes absolutely can join TWC..

my mistake that was a 6th edition rule... TWC could never join anything but other TWC and wolves. Thats cool they deleted that little rule.

i like the idea of the stormfangs, just not the blood claws.

Stormfangs are terrible. Stormwolf has better weapons and better transport for less points. Lets compare:

Stormwolf: 235 points gets you 2 tl MMs and tl LasCan.
Stormfang: 255 for the same.

Transport: Wolf 16 & Assault Vehicle vs 6 on Fang ~ Wolf wins
Hellfrost Foccused: Twinlinked and Turret on Wolf vs Lance on Fang ~ wolf wins
Hellfrost dispersed: Twinked Small Blast on Turret on Wolf vs Large Blast Hull mounted on fang ~ Wolf wins

The Stormwolf >>>> Stormfang

I completely agree with this assessment. Lance doesn't come into play much and means less when you have the 2 TL MM and TL LC as well. I do like the large blast better than TL small blast but not enough to spend more and give up the assault ability (which technically means that I'm saving points by taking out the assaulting unit as well ) If the ap 2 on the large blast was correct it wold make me reconsider occasionally but alas the wolf just crushes the fang.

It's not just twinlinked vs large blast/lance it is also Turret (sat much further back) vs front mounted Hull. That is a huge difference on a flyer,even more so when you add in that you have Power of The Machine Spirit.

I agree with Flingit, it's a good list. But that TWC unit is grossly expensive. You don't need specials on every guy just because it's an option. I'd consider streamlining the TWC more than anything.

For 4 TWC, I'd go with a WC/SS leader, 1 PF and 1 other SS (not on the guy with a PF, you generally want that guy farthest from the front line). You'll easily wipe out entire squads just with that. Rest will often be overkill. With points saved, you can get 4 Cyberwolves in the unit. Just think, it's 15 points for 1 extra T5 4+ wound (they're T4, but majority toughness rule is in effect), that can also eat unwated challenges and LOS on a 4+. It's crazy effective and one of the reasons why Iron Priests are so effective in the new codex.

Where does Army builder get the points wrong?

Have you tried this list without the Cents; pure ThunderCav? What were the differences?

Anyone know of any battle reports with this many ThunderCav?

After finally playing a couple of games with it Ive learned a few things.

The Cens and priest will die very quickly! So quickly im wondering if the runic priest is even worth the points.

SS on the TWC are a must! Both games the Death Star died from low AP attacks.

Extra Little wolves could have helped my games out alot! Between the lord and iron priest I could have had six little wolves for 76 points to take up more wounds.

Then lastly I have very few units on the table. Turn 1 the Cents will die or be locked in assault and the TWC will eat and entire army worth of shooting till I can make it into CC. I think MSU could serve me better than the one Wolf Star.

I will run more test games just to make sure the list is my problem and its just not the way Ive been playing them.

I know what you mean. That's exactly been my problem playing with TWC. They're so durable that they take an entire army's worth of shooting, but they're so expensive that you don't have enough on the table to take advantage of your enemy's focused firepower.

What I found to be a solution is to have TWC be reasonably equipped, but not so much that the upgrades outweigh the cost of another naked TWC. Then add a few other high priority targets. Drop pods fit this so well. Anything you can put in there, from TDAWG to Dreads is dangerous enough that your enemy will have to deal with them. You could also go with multiple TWC units.

I've thought about running MSU of TWC but it would end up costing me more points to fill out the min of 3 in each unit.

I feel they are reasonably equipped with 3 shields and 3 Special weapons.

I have been toying with the idea of running a Cpt in place of the SM CM to put 40 points into extra little wolves. I will be losing 1 wound on the SM biker but will gain 3 in the unit. If i can cut another 6 points I can get a 4th wolf.

Its very had to balance killing power with survivability!!!

you are looking for something to absorb the fire power in T2 why not drop a super cheap dread in a pod? you might lose a dread who you could upgrade in the back field. Put the SS/GFA on him and use the 3++

If he gets ignored then laugh as he moves and eats things, if they focus fire laugh as your TWC moves and eats things. its hard enough to kill one with a full round of fire if you place em well and give em what they need to survive.

just MHO


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also a better star unit imo is the Wolf Guard on bikes pack. With their huge list of CC weapons and the JINK save they can make on a T5 it will also draw a ton of agro but is easily a terrifying unit to have to come up against

Wolf Guard on bikes pack?

That's a cool ideal but I'm not going to completely redo my entire army at this point. I'll pick up some DV bikers when I get a chance and test it out.

Also thinking about trading out all my THs for PFs. 5 points cheaper.

The only draw is TH are concussive and PF aren't correct?

the 25 points extra could be for a Lone Wolf, cyber wolves or be some upgrades put the rune priest in runic armor and try to living lighting anything that moves. the SW blessings are pretty nice too.

That's correct. I don't see it being worth the extra 5 points.

I like to roll on Divination shooting for the a 4++ or ignore cover spell getting the TL spell for free. He's a nice support IC for Grav Cents.

Played another game with my list tonight and feel that the addition of the small dogs was a very good move. They allowed me to shrug off lots of S10 AP2 wounds.

Another small update to my list.