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So I have never used green stuff before, and I am going to purchase some and use it for some modelling. I just have a couple questions:

1 - I am looking on Ebay and the only "green stuff" I can find is "Kneadatite Blue/Yellow Epoxy Putty Tape". This doesn't look right to me...Can some one tell me what I should purchase for the best quality green stuff putty?

2 - What are some best practices when using green stuff? How much should I use at 1 time? How long does it take to dry?

3 - Are there any tips and tricks from the veteran modelers out there?

Thanks for the help!

 AutarchRion wrote:
1 - I am looking on Ebay and the only "green stuff" I can find is "Kneadatite Blue/Yellow Epoxy Putty Tape". This doesn't look right to me...Can some one tell me what I should purchase for the best quality green stuff putty?

That is what you are looking for, however I would suggest not buying the "tape" variety. Instead, find some that is in two separate tubes.

2 - What are some best practices when using green stuff? How much should I use at 1 time? How long does it take to dry?

Keep your tools lubricated (water, spit, Vaseline, baby oil, etc) to avoid them sticking to the putty while you work it. Keep in mind that if you use a petroleum-based lubricant, you need to wash everything with warm water and soap after it is cured to clean it. As far as how much you should use at one time, that depends on what you are sculpting! If you buy larger quantities of the material it will often be cheaper and should allow you to use more without concerning yourself on how much is wasted. That being said, if you didn't roll out enough you can always roll out more if you need it. When mixed 50/50 it takes about 24 hours to fully cure.

3 - Are there any tips and tricks from the veteran modelers out there?

Look in to getting yourself some color (or clay) shapers; silicon tips, size 0 extra firm is a good place to start. Also, use Goggle to find some tutorials and tips and tricks, there is lots out there.

Thx SPJ. Very helpful

How much to use at once is a good question as the work time of Green Stuff is, depending on its age and how hot/cold it is, normally about 20-30 minutes of useful work time before the curing process makes it stubborn to use.

Bearing that in mind, I can almost guarantee you that you will mix up twice as much Green Stuff as you actually need, or can use, to complete the job. You can even use some Blu Tac first to see how much Green Stuff you will eventually need but generally, how ever much you think you will use, cut it in half and try that, you can always mix up more putty at a later stage.

What SPJ said.

I'll add, for 1: here's the original manufacturer, who GW, GF9, Warstore and everyone buys it in from. Also note another tip in there: mix 1.5 parts yellow to 1 part blue. That makes the fresh stuff softer, easier to push around, extends the working window, and reduces some of the old 'springy' problem in sculpting with green stuff. (though note the benefits of mixing more blue, too.)

With regards to the 'working window', the amount of time between mixing and when it's become too stiff to work with: that varies according to temperature (the reaction occurs quicker in warm temps) and the amount of yellow or blue you mix in. With Polymeric's mixing suggestion, and the Irish climate (though also with our pretty good Indian summer this year) I can work with it for a comfortable couple of hours, maybe even longer. But check for yourself. (The other day I was using procreate putty, waiting for it to stiffen up so I could work finer details into it, and was still waiting for it to just stiffen a bit after two and a half hours...)

Combining 2 and 3: when using water as lubrication, I use a bit of absorbent material (blister sponge is great, though not so available from GW these days, IIRC) in a shallow dish. This limits the amount of moisture picked up by my tools. Too much water isn't great if a big drop runs off your sculpting tool, wicks around the lump of fresh putty, and prevents it sticking to whatever you're sticking it to.

If you buy a strip of it, try to cut out a few mm from the centre, where the two colours meet. They react along this meeting point, and it can cause hardened lumps to appear in your freshly mixed putty, and cause the GS to go off quicker.

Yep, GS can go off, or stale, or otherwise less useful for sculpting. After several months, especially in the strip, it'll start growing harder to mix, developing hard specks and lumps, will become unworkable earlier, and won't cure properly. If you buy a lot of GS that you know you won't use up soon, you can slow down or stop this effect by keeping the putty in the fridge or freezer. Some sellers also keep it chilled before selling it. Needless to say, big kept for months on a rack in a warm GW store isn't good for it.

(And on the topic of strips of GS, that's all you can buy at this shop, but I feel obliged to pimp it to American hobbyists anyway. )

If you mix too much green stuff for one sitting, you can pop the excess in a wee baggie or pot, and keep it in the freezer too. That'll slow down the chemical reaction and keep it workable for a few days (in my experience) though it helps to get it in as soon as possible. If you freeze mixed GS that's been sitting around for a while, it might only stay workable until the next day.

Clay shapers are good, I have a bunch myself, but for hard pushing and very fine details I'm still fond of a metal tool. The cheap multipacks of wax carvers on ebay and elsewhere are tempting and generally alright, but personally I prefer well-made dental-quality wax carvers, which are bought individually and are individually more expensive than cheap sets, but still pretty cheap. Here in Blighty I can find them on ebay for £2-£3.50 each.

In my sig is a link to my own humble wee forum. If you visit and check the sticky topics in the 'guides and resources' boards, you'll find a few lists of tool and material guides, where you can buy them, and a few links to sculpting guides and references. (I think Mr. Pink's Modern Synthesist guides are particular good for beginners - go look!) And you're welcome to post up your results and progress there too.

If you've NEVER used GS before, I would buy the Citadel or P3 product at least once. it comes in a much, much smaller package, and is made in strips, which you just cut horizontally to get as much as you want. It's premeasured, so when you cut across you get the right ratio of the two materials, it's easy to store, and it's much less messy.

Also, if you're just doing little do-dads on 25mm models (like the odd power cable or purity seal) or fixing mould issues, the small size will actually last you a really long time. Of course, the big tubes are a much better value.

Not a vet, but I use it for minor joins and basic scultping.

Number 1 tip is mixing. Mix blue and yellow VERY thoroughly. More blue lets you sculpt better (retains shape more easily) more yellow makes it work better for smoothing over a join.

You also want to make sure you keep your sculpting tools (and fingers) moist so that the GS doesn't stick to you or anything else. I generally just lick the tip of my finger, my modeling knife, or the rounded end of a metal Citadel file. In terms of how much you want to mix, remember that the end mass of the amount of GS you work with is going to be equal to the total amount of blue + total amount of yellow....plan accordingly. I know that last one sounds basic, but its a big deal. I always end up with more GS mixed than I need, and end up throwing some away.

That being said, the Citadel "brand" GS is a waste of money. You can get decent modeling putting in bulk...I bought a tube of blue and a tube of yellow about 5 years ago, both tubes were roughly the size of a roll of quarters. After a few years of conversion heavy work, I have a bit over 1/3 of each tube left. That is with being pretty wasteful in terms of mixing too much, as well as hand made stuff here and there to get a better feel for using the material.

I've had few problems with green stuff in tape form. I keep mine in the freezer and snap off a section when needed. As mentioned you can cut away the section where the blue and yellow putties join, if you find you are getting dried lumps when you mix.

Regarding lubricant... don't use saliva. At least don't lick your tools or put green stuff anywhere near your mouth. You can use water (dip and flick the excess away) but you'll get smoother results from Vaseline. Just use a thin layer. I blob a bit on the back of my hand and wipe the excess off elsewhere on the back of my hand. Don't use too much! If the putty stops sticking you can give the sculpt a soapy wash once it has cured. Avoid using vegetable oil etc as you will end up with a non-stick surface (Vaseline only stops putty sticking if you use too much).

Work in layers: armature, basic shapes, form, detail. Build up layers for support and allow to cure in between. Otherwise the putty will collapse when you apply pressure!

I recently backed the following Kickstarter:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1389554987/modeling-and-sculpting-course-videos-by-james-van?ref=discovery

The courses are still in development but there are already a few on public release. I've found them really helpful.

http://fireforeffectstudios.usefedora.com/directory/

There's currently 50% off the first module too, which is certainly worth a go for the basics:

http://fireforeffectstudios.usefedora.com/course/FOS1/?couponCode=COUPON347411

Good luck!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Vermis wrote:

In my sig is a link to my own humble wee forum.

Get sculpting and come back to forum Vermis!!!

 moonmin82 wrote:
Regarding lubricant... don't use saliva. At least don't lick your tools or put green stuff anywhere near your mouth. You can use water (dip and flick the excess away) but you'll get smoother results from Vaseline.

Care to explain this as anything other than avoiding the "yuck" factor? I disagree in the strongest possible terms, and posit that your comment is based in some kind of misguided hygiene standard rather than pragmatic outcomes based analysis. Saliva dries slower than water, which makes it a better lubricant. GS isn't toxic, neither are your tools, and you have a lot more control over using saliva in minute quantities (all it takes it a touch of the sculpting tool to the tip of your tongue) than a glob of vaseline that a new sculptor could conceivably accidentally mix in with the GS during the sculpting process, or (worse yet) could cause serious problems if they go to wipe it off with an incomplete cure.

Comments about layering are spot on though.

Excess putty goes great into creating either markers for in game effects. Or my personal fave.
Your very own Pit Spawn.

 Peter Wiggin wrote:

Care to explain this as anything other than avoiding the "yuck" factor? I disagree in the strongest possible terms, and posit that your comment is based in some kind of misguided hygiene standard rather than pragmatic outcomes based analysis. Saliva dries slower than water, which makes it a better lubricant. GS isn't toxic, neither are your tools, and you have a lot more control over using saliva in minute quantities.

Make no mistake, Green Stuff may well not be "toxic" but it is still a hazardous material. The hardener of all epoxy putties is sensitising, in other words it can cause an allergic reaction. This process is made worse still when the exposure is inside of your body rather than simply on your skin. Fair enough, you may know people who have licked their tools for years (I used to) but once you develop an allergic reaction that's it. In most cases it is the result of long term exposure.

I am not disputing the positive results of using saliva as a sculpting lubricant. By all means, spit in a dish, just don't allow the inside of your mouth to come into contact with any epoxy putty. Sadly this is not a "misguided hygiene standard", merely a fact. Having spent a decade working in a lab I know the hazards of various chemicals, both immediate hazards and long term effects. I've also known people who have developed sensitisation and it's not fun.

Everyone is free to make up their own mind, it's their body after all. I just advise caution

Yup. Tom Meier once said that the most toxic stuff in green stuff was the blue and yellow food colouring, but the amines in epoxy putty are still known sensitizers. Nick Bibby was one of the big names in fantasy wargaming years ago. He sculpted the great spined dragon among other things. But he had to give it up when he started taking bad reactions to green stuff. And that was just from exposing his hands to it.

Mind you, looking at the stuff he does these days, I'm not sure that it was entirely a bad thing.

So far I haven't had a reaction, after using at least nine types of epoxy putty, and as a gamble I think I could slip in the shower tomorrow too, so what? But I always wash my hands after using putty (and after mixing some of them), and before wiping my eyes, putting my fingers near my mouth, picking my nose, or eating or drinking anything. And lately I've been wondering about what type of gloves would be most comfortable.

Plus, if you get into the habit of licking tools, and eventually try out something like milliput, well, that might soon put you off the licking...

Fair enough answers, and very well thought out.

I stick by my statement though since you can easily tell people the same thing about tree nut allergies (which is pretty valid if someone is allergic to nuts, but otherwise not so much...). Then again, I've spent more than a little bit of time digging up and remediating lead contaminated soil in the inner city as well as directly experiencing the first hand effects of air pollution due to population density, which truly will cause a more acute reaction than any exposure to GS (unless one has a specific allergy at least).

Advising caution is NEVER a bad idea, to be sure.

Willing to bet that Simple Green is also more likely to cause a reaction than GS...but I'm a bloody savage that still "tips" my brushes with my lips after washing them so wevs.