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hello,

i have i question, today my imperial knight warlord was challanged by an other chacater. after he hit i hit him back (so rolled to hit and then on the destroyer weapon table) the result was a total of 11 wounds
i thought that the enemy got his 3 wounds and the other 9 went over to the unit as in a normal challange. but the destroyer tables states the model suffers d6+6 (in my case 11) wounds. it was rules since it states THE MODEL that they do need bleed through.

I thought any overage in wounds carries through to the unit.

And off we go to YMDC

 PhillyT wrote:
I thought any overage in wounds carries through to the unit.

Normally they do, but

"Multiple Wounds/Hull Points inflicted by a Destroyer hit do not carry over to other models in the unit (any excess are lost)." (Special Rules chapter, Destroyer Weapons section).

So they do not bleed through.

Almost correct DR.

The wounds off of a single D str hit do not carry over, but since this is a case of multiple D str hits, some of them might in fact carry over.


You would apply the first hit, roll to see how many wounds inflicted, and then, if the recieving model was still alive, apply the second hit to him and so on until he is dead.

Any remaining hits after do in fact flow over to the rest of the unit, once again, applied one at a time until all the str D hits are rolled for.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Almost correct DR.

The wounds off of a single D str hit do not carry over, but since this is a case of multiple D str hits, some of them might in fact carry over.


You would apply the first hit, roll to see how many wounds inflicted, and then, if the recieving model was still alive, apply the second hit to him and so on until he is dead.

Any remaining hits after do in fact flow over to the rest of the unit, once again, applied one at a time until all the str D hits are rolled for.

So what rule trumps the rule I posted, because there is a restriction in place, and can't trumps must in a permissive ruleset. (Unless the must specifically mentions that it overrides the cant).

Its not that what you posted is incorrect, its that the D weapon chart does not follow the normal wounding process and in fact replaces it.

You roll to hit, then you take each hit and roll separately on the destroyer chart for them.

If the model in the challenge dies on the first or second hit, the challenge is over and now the remaining hits "must" be allocated to other models in the unit as per the D weapon rules.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Its not that what you posted is incorrect, its that the D weapon chart does not follow the normal wounding process and in fact replaces it.

You roll to hit, then you take each hit and roll separately on the destroyer chart for them.

If the model in the challenge dies on the first or second hit, the challenge is over and now the remaining hits "must" be allocated to other models in the unit as per the D weapon rules.

Except cant trumps must in a permissive ruleset and wounds do not carry over to other models in the unit.

Wounds do carry over, but that's not even relevant to this particular case.


I'll run through an example and tell me where you think im wrong.

Charge goes off, knight and chaos lord are in a challenge.

Lord swings first and chunks off 2 HP from knight.

Knight swings, getting 3 hits.

First hit, as per the D weapon rolls scores a 3, doing D3 wounds. As the Lord has no invun save he is instant killed due to D hits counting as str 10. You don't even have to roll the D3 wounds, cause they don't carry over and don't matter.

The second and third hits, are now allocated to the unit that the lord was attached to, seeing as how the knight is no longer in a challenge with the lord. You would then roll 2 D chart hits, scoring a 2 and a 5, doing another D3 wounds to 2 other models, not carrying over to any other models.


What I think you've been suggesting is that you have to roll all the 3 hits on the D chart at once, total the wounds, and then seeing as how the first one kills the lord you would discard all the remaining wounds as the multiple wounds from D don't carry over. That's an incorrect way to do it. If that is not what your suggesting then I apologize.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Almost correct DR.

The wounds off of a single D str hit do not carry over, but since this is a case of multiple D str hits, some of them might in fact carry over.


You would apply the first hit, roll to see how many wounds inflicted, and then, if the recieving model was still alive, apply the second hit to him and so on until he is dead.

Any remaining hits after do in fact flow over to the rest of the unit, once again, applied one at a time until all the str D hits are rolled for.

Absolutely correct.

If your knight lands 3 hits in a challenge, and then rolls 3 6's, the total damage to the opponent will be one dead character, and 2 dead squad members.

The excess wounds from ((6 +d6 wounds) - enemy character's current wounds) will not effect the squad, however additional hits and damage rolls will damage the character's squad as normal.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Wounds do carry over, but that's not even relevant to this particular case.


I'll run through an example and tell me where you think im wrong.

Charge goes off, knight and chaos lord are in a challenge.

Lord swings first and chunks off 2 HP from knight.

Knight swings, getting 3 hits.

First hit, as per the D weapon rolls scores a 3, doing D3 wounds. As the Lord has no invun save he is instant killed due to D hits counting as str 10. You don't even have to roll the D3 wounds, cause they don't carry over and don't matter.

The second and third hits, are now allocated to the unit that the lord was attached to, seeing as how the knight is no longer in a challenge with the lord. You would then roll 2 D chart hits, scoring a 2 and a 5, doing another D3 wounds to 2 other models, not carrying over to any other models.


What I think you've been suggesting is that you have to roll all the 3 hits on the D chart at once, total the wounds, and then seeing as how the first one kills the lord you would discard all the remaining wounds as the multiple wounds from D don't carry over. That's an incorrect way to do it. If that is not what your suggesting then I apologize.

I see what you are getting at, and I didnt realize you were saying this.

Yes the extra hits would carry over, but not the D3 wounds. (Because of the rules I posted in response to PhillyT saying what he said, and the fact that you roll all To Hit rolls at I4 at the same time as the attacks are simultaneous).

So if the knight has 3 attacks and hits thrice, and kills the challenger with the first hit/wound the other two hits would be rolled for on the next closest models.

So in total 3 models could die if all three attacks hit and no 1's were rolled for the wound roll on the D weapon chart.

Is the knight warlord able to be in a challenge in the first place?

I didn't think Imperial Knights were characters. Do they have a special rule for their warlords?

[EDIT] Just looked at the FAQ. Yes, apparently they do. Nice!

And yes, wounds wouldn't carry over model-to-model, but hits would 'roll over' into the unit.

The stomp attacks would certainly be able to hit the unit as they don't follow the normal rules for attacks.