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ARRRRGGG! My main opponent just bought Deathmaster Snikch and after a sneaky peak at his army book I know that I will have to take a pretty amazing army to defeat it! it would be amazing if anyone could give me tips on how to defeat him (I play High Elves) as he seems really hard-hitting. Thanks

This really belongs in tactics...

For snikch you have asf so you got at the same time. He's only 2W with a 4+ ward. Just focus attacks on him & if he challenges decline.

Ya it really shouldn't be to hard to kill him with only 2 wounds.
He does get always strikes first so doesn't that just cancel out? He is initiative 10 so he will go first if the asf rules cancel out (not sure if that's right tho)

He is killy sure with his 6 attacks and WS 8 but is only s4. The d3 wounds won't really matter all that much.
I'd say just direct all the attacks you can at him he will fail some of his 4+ wards eventually.

He's not so bad unless you can't refuse the challenge. If that's the case and you don't have a 2-3+ armor, he's going to win

Swamp him with regular infantry and decline challenges. Massed Spearmen are his natural enemy.

ASF does not cancel out. You just go at the same time, and no one gets re-rolls.

If the Deathmaster faces:

Spearmen-- at the same time as Snikch, up to15 attacks, 7.5 hit, 2.5 wounds, 1.25 after saves.

Swordmasters-- after Snikch, up to15 attacks, 7.5 hit, 5 wounds, 2.5 after saves.

White Lions-- after Snikch, up to 12 attacks, 6 hits, 5 wounds, 2.5 after saves.

Pheonix Guard-- at the same time as Snikch, up to 12 attacks, 6 hits, 3 wounds, 1.5 after saves

Against a WS7 T3 model with a 4+/4+, Snikch has 6 attacks for 4 hits, 3 wounds, 2.5 after armour, 1.25 after Ward, 2.5 after Multiple Wounds.

So...Snikch cannot reliably kill most well-defended characters, and he cannot survive a prolonged combat of any kind. Overall, I say he is a waste of (a lot) of points.

You know who does okay, though? The regular Assassin with a Weeping Blade and a Potion of Strength. Still not enough to kill a well-protected combat character, but dangerous enough to put on a few wounds, tough enough to absorb a lot of attacks before keeling over, and a good deal less points.

Snikch is really, really bad, especially against Elves of any kind
Don't be afraid of him, as others have pointed out, he'll just die to pointy sticks

Thanks for your replies, I will be trying some this Sunday. I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks

 TanKoL wrote:
Snikch is really, really bad, especially against Elves of any kind
Don't be afraid of him, as others have pointed out, he'll just die to pointy sticks

I DON'T CARE!!!!1 he's still the most awesome character in the book.

LEAVE ME ALONE!


(hehe, sorry, ninja rats are the coolest :p)

Oh I love him. But I mean really he a TURRURIST!

I will "accidentally" let slip I have Snikch & that usually puts my opponent on edge. This makes them more cautious with their characters & lets me dictate play a bit more.

He's a phenomenal character killer but really all you're hoping for him is he kills something worth more than he is, because once he's out he doesn't last long.

Sometimes if I'm playing a bit of a douche, I'll just leave him in plain view on the edge of the table... even if I haven't got him in my list.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Sometimes if I'm playing a bit of a douche, I'll just leave him in plain view on the edge of the table... even if I haven't got him in my list.

And then people don't care as he's the worst character in the skaven book. He's a S4 combat character with 2 wounds at 270 points. He's not that good at fighting RnF and not too good against characters. Also, his major rule from his cloak gets negated by sticking him in a unit.

Oh, go swim in the harbour. People think there's an assassin there and there isn't, so it changes how they play, and that's the important part.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Oh, go swim in the harbour. People think there's an assassin there and there isn't, so it changes how they play, and that's the important part.

Haha that's pretty funny, the guy is probably like whaaaat da haaaay?! when he figures out its not a part of the game lol

Sniktch isn't really that bad all the Skaven named characters are wildly over priced so I wouldn't say he is the worst

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Sometimes if I'm playing a bit of a douche, I'll just leave him in plain view on the edge of the table... even if I haven't got him in my list.

I would consider this cheating. If a model is on the table it is assumed to be in play. What happens if I try to deathsnipe him for easy points but now you say hes not there & I just wasted turns getting things into range?

 chiefbigredman wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Oh, go swim in the harbour. People think there's an assassin there and there isn't, so it changes how they play, and that's the important part.

Haha that's pretty funny, the guy is probably like whaaaat da haaaay?! when he figures out its not a part of the game lol

Sniktch isn't really that bad all the Skaven named characters are wildly over priced so I wouldn't say he is the worst

Hes great in very specific scenerios. If he were to say go up against WoC who cant decline challenges, he then ends up fighting a unit champ, sorc, and bsb just killing each outright before they can attack back then id say he did his job. If they cant refuse then rank and file dont get a swing at him. Thats how you keep him alive.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Sometimes if I'm playing a bit of a douche, I'll just leave him in plain view on the edge of the table... even if I haven't got him in my list.

I would consider this cheating. If a model is on the table it is assumed to be in play. What happens if I try to deathsnipe him for easy points but now you say hes not there & I just wasted turns getting things into range?

He obviously means it's at the edge of the table, as in not on the gaming area, but the area around it. The place you put your dead models or your books or your magic cards, most tables have a little area for that kind of stuff. What he does is leaves Snikch in plain view near the table, but not on it. This gives the impression he is in the list, when actually he is only just standing there in limbo for eternity. People will be more cautious about what they throw into combat when they suspect an Assassin is involved, even if in reality it's just a mind game.

Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Sometimes if I'm playing a bit of a douche, I'll just leave him in plain view on the edge of the table... even if I haven't got him in my list.

I would consider this cheating. If a model is on the table it is assumed to be in play. What happens if I try to deathsnipe him for easy points but now you say hes not there & I just wasted turns getting things into range?

Sorry, yes, by 'the edge of the table', I mean 'along with the other stuff in Reserve or not currently in play'. Such things are obviously excluded from active game play.

While technically not cheating if done in the way you describe. This is very jenky and personally I would be inclined not to play you again if you did this. Especially if you were putting him alongside reserves.

While fully within the rules, I feel it is unsportmanlike & were we at a tournament where I could not refuse a game without taking a loss I would ding you on sportsmanship for it.

@Shas'O Dorian: yeah, it's a bit questionable. But so is "letting slip" that you have a hidden character for the express purpose of messing with your opponent.

@namiel: I doubt Snikch can take on those characters. 2+ Armour saves being easily attainable, along with 3+ Wards that re-roll 1's or -1 to Hit.

I've never seen an Assassin of any kind that could reliable kill the enemy General. They usually put a wound or two on him, but that's about it.

Warpsolution wrote:
@Shas'O Dorian: yeah, it's a bit questionable. But so is "letting slip" that you have a hidden character for the express purpose of messing with your opponent.

@namiel: I doubt Snikch can take on those characters. 2+ Armour saves being easily attainable, along with 3+ Wards that re-roll 1's or -1 to Hit.

I've never seen an Assassin of any kind that could reliable kill the enemy General. They usually put a wound or two on him, but that's about it.

In the situation i described I do believe that because of his iniative and asf he will be rerolling to hit and usually hitting on 3's against those units with poison and doing multiple wounds. So unit champs with 1 wound, bsb's with 2 wounds and sorc lords with 3 wounds it doesnt take much to slip through for him to score enough to kill a character. Yes they would have good armor saves and he will often need 5's to wound but its not unthinkable by any means

The difference is it IS in my list. He is on the table somewhere. I am not actively trying to deceive my opponent with something that is outside the realm of play. I have paid the points for the unit & in my mind that entitles me to use him as a psychological weapon in addition to a physical one.

It would be the same as me putting him on the edge of the table (but off the playing area). I am not against that, I am against doing it when the model is not even in your force.

One instance is informing your opponent that you have a tool (which you have paid for), and attempting to force them into thwarting / avoiding it. The other is Implying you have said tool you don't (and haven't paid for) and trying to deceive your opponent into believing a falsehood, which for me is outside the realm of the game.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Oh, go swim in the harbour. People think there's an assassin there and there isn't, so it changes how they play, and that's the important part.

The only time I worry about assassins is if they're the two major builds in a bellstar. Snikch isn't scary at all.

I've seen him built into a few display boards over the years, looks pretty good, and makes you wonder.

 Acardia wrote:
I've seen him built into a few display boards over the years, looks pretty good, and makes you wonder.

His model is awesome IMO but his points are way beyond what his abilities are

 namiel wrote:
In the situation i described I do believe that because of his iniative and asf he will be rerolling to hit and usually hitting on 3's against those units with poison and doing multiple wounds. So unit champs with 1 wound, bsb's with 2 wounds and sorc lords with 3 wounds it doesnt take much to slip through for him to score enough to kill a character. Yes they would have good armor saves and he will often need 5's to wound but its not unthinkable by any means

I don't think Snikch has Poisoned Attacks, since he's using the Weeping Blade (and then two more).

Against the typical Tzeentch BSB on a Disk (1+/4+), Snikch gets 5.3 hits, 2.7 wounds, 0.9 after armour, 0.7 after Ward. The BSB swings back for...2 hits, 1.3 wounds, 0.7 after Ward.
Same deal against the Sorcerer Lord, I believe.
Against the Nurgle BSB (1+ re-rollable, etc), it's 4.5 hits, 1.5 wounds, 0.2 after armour. Then he swings back for 2 hits, 1.7 wounds, 0.9 after Ward.

So...Snikch is...lack-luster.

@Shas'O Dorian: I am fully aware of the difference between the two situations. One could argue, however, that both situations are in a similar vein of questionable sportsman ship.

Shas'O Dorian wrote:While technically not cheating if done in the way you describe. This is very jenky and personally I would be inclined not to play you again if you did this. Especially if you were putting him alongside reserves.

While fully within the rules, I feel it is unsportmanlike & were we at a tournament where I could not refuse a game without taking a loss I would ding you on sportsmanship for it.

Well, I did specify that it was something to use against douchey people.

 Furyou Miko wrote:

Shas'O Dorian wrote:While technically not cheating if done in the way you describe. This is very jenky and personally I would be inclined not to play you again if you did this. Especially if you were putting him alongside reserves.

While fully within the rules, I feel it is unsportmanlike & were we at a tournament where I could not refuse a game without taking a loss I would ding you on sportsmanship for it.

Well, I did specify that it was something to use against douchey people.

That doesn't make it any better or less jenky. I'd rather confront the player about their behavior or not play them. Just because the other player is being douchey doesn't mean you should, it just makes you look worse. I mean we're mostly adults or at least semi-mature here & the old "He started it..." playground argument shouldn't apply.