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How would this work?

Do you disembark and then terror from the deep or do you just disembark?

The Mawloc is not deep striking

So what is the Mawloc doing?

Also, the first rule says 'when a Mawloc arrives from deepstrike reserves, it can deepstrike ...', which it does imo.

 Happyjew wrote:
The Mawloc is not deep striking

The Mawloc only disembarks. Happyjew is correct.

Okay. Fine by me, would've been stupidly OP anyway. :-P

Sorry, how has it not Arrived from Deep Strike Reserve?

The Unit and its transport was in reserves, and they have both arrived VIA Deep Strike.

Am I missing something o.O?

 Bloodhorror wrote:
Sorry, how has it not Arrived from Deep Strike Reserve?

The Unit and its transport was in reserves, and they have both arrived VIA Deep Strike.

Am I missing something o.O?

The transport arrived by deep strike. The Mawloc disembarks from a unit that arrived from reserve. Technically speaking, they both come from reserve but only the transport enters via deep strike.

So... Regardless of how the Transport arrives, the unit inside always arrives from reserves, not deep strike reserves?

Quite simply, Mawloc comes up from the ground, Tyrannocyte comes out of the sky.

Terror from the sky.

Or maybe the Mawloc gets out mid flight. But would probably die on impact.

leaping out with his mouth wide open and landing on a squad of dudes would be pretty immense....

Catching flys on the way down

 Bloodhorror wrote:
Sorry, how has it not Arrived from Deep Strike Reserve?

The Unit and its transport was in reserves, and they have both arrived VIA Deep Strike.

Am I missing something o.O?

It has arrived from Deep Strike Reserves. However, while implied, embarked models do not Deep Strike.

Even if RAW this were legal, as a Nid player I wouldn't attempt it. Sometimes, you do need to apply common sense when gaming.

So now DE can deep strike raiders and assault out of them because the passengers didn't arrive via deep strike?

 NecronLord3 wrote:
So now DE can deep strike raiders and assault out of them because the passengers didn't arrive via deep strike?

No, because they still arrived from Reserves.

No they arrived by disembarking from an open topped transport.

And they and that vehicle arrived from Reserves.

So too would a Mawloc arriving in a Tyrannocyte.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
So too would a Mawloc arriving in a Tyrannocyte.

The Mawloc is arriving from Deep Strike Reserves, however, it is not Deep Striking (which is part of the requirements for TftD).

P.162 clearly states that arriving via Deep Strike is some times called arriving from Deep Strike Reserve.

 Happyjew wrote:

 NecronLord3 wrote:
So too would a Mawloc arriving in a Tyrannocyte.

The Mawloc is arriving from Deep Strike Reserves, however, it is not Deep Striking (which is part of the requirements for TftD).

Not sure if it matters in the particulars of this discussion, but I don't think the Mawloc is technically arriving from Deep Strike Reserves when it arrives on a transport that Deep Strikes. For a unit to be arriving from Deep Strike Reserves, that unit itself must be designated as Deep Striking when placed in reserves, i.e. " When placing the unit in Reserve, you must tell your opponent that it will be arriving by Deep Strike".

So you could put the Mawloc in Deep Strike Reserves by saying the Mawloc is Deep Striking in which case the Mawloc rolls separately to come in from Deep Strike Reserves and Deep Strikes separately from the Tyrannocyte.

If the Mawloc comes in as a passenger on the Deep Striking Tyrannocyte, the Tyrannocyte is technically coming in from Deep Strike Reserves and the Mawloc is coming in technically from Reserves.

There's some miscommunication going on here between necron lord and happyjew.

NecronLord, here's is the order of events that happyjew is describing to you:

- Tyrannocite and Mawloc are being held in deep strike reserve
- The Tyrannocite arrives from deep strike reserve via deep strike.
- The Mawloc arrives from deep strike reserve embarked on the Tyrannocite. He does not Deep Strike.
- Since the Mawloc's template only works when he has arrives via deep strike (not just from deep strike reserve) he is not allowed to use the template and disembarks normally from the tyrannocite.

In your example:
- A squad of wyches with a raider is placed in deep strike reserve
- The raider arrives from deep strike reserve via deep strike.
- the wyches arrive from deep strike reserve embarked on the raider. They do not deep strike.
- The wyches are disallowed from charging because they have just arrived from reserve. (arriving from ANY type of reserves disallows charging)

Edit - I believe col_impact is correct, the transports would be placed in deep strike reserve, the units they are transporting would simply be in reserve. You are only required to inform your opponent that the squad is embarked on the transport and that the transport will be deep striking.

any model that is inside a transport is described as being "removed from the table" until it disembarks. this is something to remember for this discussion.

I can't believe this is actually being discussed

sangheili wrote:
I can't believe this is actually being discussed

Welcome to Dakka Dakka.

 Nilok wrote:

sangheili wrote:
I can't believe this is actually being discussed

Welcome to Dakka Dakka.

yeah some people want the cake and eat it too.

To be fair though,
The question of what the Embarked Unit is actually doing when the Transport Deep Strikes is very debate worthy.

Not only are there many implications, regardless which answer one's side supports, but the Rules do have problems to begin with. Don't just take a look at the wording of the Deep Strike Rule, though it is concerning, but also look at the terrible formatting used within this Rule. In order to read every Deep Strike related Rule you would need to flick through a dozen different locations within the Book, because the Authors felt certain elements where more specified to things like 'Arriving from Reserves' or what Unit Type the Deep Striking Model possess, so they are located in those areas of the book.

The biggest head-ache I have of all is the fact this is a Rule which over-writes other Advanced Rules, no word on how this is legally possible, and then requires you to follow instructions in the Rule which is no longer being applied. This would not be much of a problem in a better written system, though any Game System should avoid it entirely, by including a set of instructions informing us exactly which parts of the other Rule are being utilized. Yes, 'Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves,' I am looking at you. Does the instructions 'as specified in the Rules for Reserves' mean just the D6 and how to determine if something is Arriving, or does it also includes the moving instructions within this section of the book?

Others have used that clause as a piece of evidence that Deep Strike is movement, so very important to know....

JinxDragon wrote:
To be fair though,
The question of what the Embarked Unit is actually doing when the Transport Deep Strikes is very debate worthy.

Not only are there many implications, regardless which answer one's side supports, but the Rules do have problems to begin with. Don't just take a look at the wording of the Deep Strike Rule, though it is concerning, but also look at the terrible formatting used within this Rule. In order to read every Deep Strike related Rule you would need to flick through a dozen different locations within the Book, because the Authors felt certain elements where more specified to things like 'Arriving from Reserves' or what Unit Type the Deep Striking Model possess, so they are located in those areas of the book.

The biggest head-ache I have of all is the fact this is a Rule which over-writes other Advanced Rules, no word on how this is legally possible, and then requires you to follow instructions in the Rule which is no longer being applied. This would not be much of a problem in a better written system, though any Game System should avoid it entirely, by including a set of instructions informing us exactly which parts of the other Rule are being utilized. Yes, 'Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves,' I am looking at you. Does the instructions 'as specified in the Rules for Reserves' mean just the D6 and how to determine if something is Arriving, or does it also includes the moving instructions within this section of the book?

Others have used that clause as a piece of evidence that Deep Strike is movement, so very important to know....

It's plain black and white man. You put mawlok inside the drop pod thingy. THE DROP POD DEEP STRIKES. mawlok comes out and shoots or borrows. Idk what people are arguing. And don't say it's poor GW rule writting cuz it's not.

Sangheili,
When one formats a Rule so its individual clauses are located in a dozen different places....
How is that not bad Writing in and of itself?

 Nilok wrote:

sangheili wrote:
I can't believe this is actually being discussed

Welcome to Dakka Dakka.

and how some like to bend/interpret rules.

the transport arrived by deep striking, the model is disembarking from a deep striking transport.

the act of arriving by deepstrike calls out RAW that is has to deploy as per deepstrike, if you are not using the rules for deploying by deepstrike then by the rules as written you have not arrived by deepstrike.

there is no rules basis that the embarked model is arriving by deepstrike, or even counts as arriving by deepstrike, because it has not met the requied deploying by deepstrike rules.