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Hi guys, new here and a new fantasy player, so correct me if i'm wrong or if this is in the wrong place.
Ok here it goes:
Lore of nurgle has a spell that removes d3 toughness, roll a 5 or 6 and bam t3 units dead? Does this avoid deamons 4++ against magic or HE's world banner? Also seen as were on the topic, you don't get magic resistance for miscasts so why would you get the world banner or 4++ save against it? I play against deamons and HE and this came up so any help is greatly appreciated!

Many thanks

Big Mek Mattazar

 Big Mek Matta Spanna Heed wrote:
Hi guys, new here and a new fantasy player, so correct me if i'm wrong or if this is in the wrong place.
Ok here it goes:
Lore of nurgle has a spell that removes d3 toughness, roll a 5 or 6 and bam t3 units dead? Does this avoid deamons 4++ against magic or HE's world banner? Also seen as were on the topic, you don't get magic resistance for miscasts so why would you get the world banner or 4++ save against it? I play against deamons and HE and this came up so any help is greatly appreciated!

Many thanks

Big Mek Mattazar

A) Does the spell state a minimum toughness? If not, then dropping stuff to T0 will kill them. It's a Skaven thing, with Wither.

B) The banner and ward work because they're ward saves against stuff. The 4++ talisman applies to everything. Magic Res specifically states that it's a ward against wounds caused by spells.

Cheers mate for clearing that up! Makes sense once you put it like that. (you know when you confuse yourself so much you don't know how simple it really is) Speaking of which does that mean -3 toughness would get rid of dragonbanner unit? Cos if so all these forum's on how daemons can beat it are missing the fact they should just use thatspell!

 Big Mek Matta Spanna Heed wrote:
Cheers mate for clearing that up! Makes sense once you put it like that. (you know when you confuse yourself so much you don't know how simple it really is) Speaking of which does that mean -3 toughness would get rid of dragonbanner unit? Cos if so all these forum's on how daemons can beat it are missing the fact they should just use thatspell!

Doesn't the spell stay to a minimum of 1?

Not as I remember, but i don't have the army book to hand, so may be wrong.

I seem to recall reading a line to the effect of "no unit stat can be lowered below 1" in the main rule book for fantasy at some point. Don't hold me to that, but I'm pretty sure its a feature that you can't totally wipe out a units abilities - just get near to close enough by lowering them to 1

 Overread wrote:
I seem to recall reading a line to the effect of "no unit stat can be lowered below 1" in the main rule book for fantasy at some point. Don't hold me to that, but I'm pretty sure its a feature that you can't totally wipe out a units abilities - just get near to close enough by lowering them to 1

You're misremembering; there is no such provision. The rulebook actually tells what happens when stats drop to 0, among them that if your S, T or W drop to 0, you die.

However, in the case of the Nurgle spell, it does indeed state that it's to a minimum of 1 as TDA suggested. Most spells and effects that drop stats have this sort of statement. It's actually fairly difficult to take advantage of the "0=death" trick, because very few effects allow for dropping below 1. There's a Skaven spell that'll do it, but it only drops the T by 1 (permanently, similar to Plague of Rust) per casting, and it's very short ranged (12"). So it's still hard to get a T3 unit to 0.

 Overread wrote:
I seem to recall reading a line to the effect of "no unit stat can be lowered below 1" in the main rule book for fantasy at some point. Don't hold me to that, but I'm pretty sure its a feature that you can't totally wipe out a units abilities - just get near to close enough by lowering them to 1

This is incorrect. There is nothing in the BRB that says this. Some effects have limits (i.e. to a min. of 1) but this is not in the BRB. In fact it states that if some states ever reach zero, the model is removed.

Curse of the Leper does state to a minimum of 1.


If you could find a way to combine it with a spell that can reduce you to 0 then yes you will wipe the unit out.

Or just use it in combination with that T test or take wounds spell. Which is the proper way to do it.

Old version of the spell allowed you to kill models by reducing it to 0, but the new spell has a buffer

 welshhoppo wrote:
Curse of the Leper does state to a minimum of 1.


If you could find a way to combine it with a spell that can reduce you to 0 then yes you will wipe the unit out.

Or just use it in combination with that T test or take wounds spell. Which is the proper way to do it.

I'd advocate Curse of the Leper plus anything from the Lore of Tzeentch, but those two don't typically play nice.

Page four of the little rulebook specifically says if S T or W hit zero you die automatically.

the nurgle spell, soulblight form death and withering from shadow all say to a minimum of 1

I'd like to first point out that you do NOT get a ward save or Magic resistance save or any save of any kind vs an effect that does not cause a wound.

the effects we are discussing here do not cause wounds therefore things that grant ward saves or have magic resistance have no effect on the effect of such things.

the Warriors of Chaos Lore of Nurgle has no stipulation to a minimum of 1 with curse of the leper, as such it can reduce a T value to 0.

 nutty_nutter wrote:
I'd like to first point out that you do NOT get a ward save or Magic resistance save or any save of any kind vs an effect that does not cause a wound.

the effects we are discussing here do not cause wounds therefore things that grant ward saves or have magic resistance have no effect on the effect of such things.

the Warriors of Chaos Lore of Nurgle has no stipulation to a minimum of 1 with curse of the leper, as such it can reduce a T value to 0.

Nobody was claiming that lowering stats allows ward saves, so I'm not sure why you brought that up.

And you are incorrect, the WOC Lore of Nurgle version of Curse of the Leper does include a "minimum of 1" stipulation. Perhaps you are using a copy of the old WOC army book? This is the book you should be using now here.

The older, outdated version of the WOC army book, from what I remember, did not have the stipulation, which is why I believe you're referring to that one.