Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

This will be for more casual play. I'll likely be facing Dark Eldar most often, but I would like for my list to be balanced if I play anyone else as well.

HQ: 150
Librarian: Terminator Armor, Mastery 2, Storm Shield, Bones of Osrak (+1 Warp Charge, Re-roll failed psychic tests)

Elite: 220
Terminator Squad: AC

Troops: 226
Scout Squad: 4x Bolters,1x Heavy Bolter in a Land Speeder Storm
Scout Squad: 9x Bolters, 1x Heavy Bolter

Heavy Support: 400
Predator: Las Turret/Sponsons, Dozer Blade
Vindicator: Dozer Blade
Vindicator: Dozer Blade

Total: 996

Only things I can't change is the HQ, a Vindicator, and the Terminators (unless someone knows where I can find TH/SS sprue for reasonable price to convert them)

All advice/discussion/condemnation is appreciated.

First up; the list is interesting. I would almost certainly give it a couple of games for fun. But, weirdly, I don't see this working with Imperial Fist chapter tactics.

Your bolters are mostly focussed on your scouts, who will die relatively easily unless they hole up in cover-a tactic which generally works best with scouts carrying sniper rifles. The heavy bolter is a sensible choice given your CT, but you should try and have some diversity-it'll work reasonably well against DE and IG, but this list is going to have a hell of a time against MEQ. Pred looks nice (I don't run one myself, but I know they're powerful), and can be counted as your AT component

Vindicators are nice, but I doubt you'll find models clustering close together in enough places for two vindicators to be necessary (plus, scatter ruins many carefully placed plans for both sides); I would probably drop one of the vindicators and use the points to bump a scout squad up to a tac squad.

Terminator squads are rarely a bad choice (they're not always the best choice, but they'll do some damage); Sternguard are also a decent choice, although they don't benefit from your chapter tactics. I think in this case termies will work with your HQ, so I'd test it on the board before jumping to any conclusions.

skolirvarden wrote:
First up; the list is interesting. I would almost certainly give it a couple of games for fun. But, weirdly, I don't see this working with Imperial Fist chapter tactics.

Your bolters are mostly focussed on your scouts, who will die relatively easily unless they hole up in cover-a tactic which generally works best with scouts carrying sniper rifles. The heavy bolter is a sensible choice given your CT, but you should try and have some diversity-it'll work reasonably well against DE and IG, but this list is going to have a hell of a time against MEQ. Pred looks nice (I don't run one myself, but I know they're powerful), and can be counted as your AT component

Vindicators are nice, but I doubt you'll find models clustering close together in enough places for two vindicators to be necessary (plus, scatter ruins many carefully placed plans for both sides); I would probably drop one of the vindicators and use the points to bump a scout squad up to a tac squad.

Terminator squads are rarely a bad choice (they're not always the best choice, but they'll do some damage); Sternguard are also a decent choice, although they don't benefit from your chapter tactics. I think in this case termies will work with your HQ, so I'd test it on the board before jumping to any conclusions.

I do feel like I am heavy on anti light vehicle and won't be able to take on higher AV save for my single las pred which could be concentrated on and removed.

I was told in the tactics sections that I should generally run at least 2 vindicators if I take them at all, since they are such a big target it is likely my opponents will want to get it off the board ASAP. Also I am working on converting the Terminators to Assault Terminators so hopefully that will add some punch.

At 1000 points I think you could probably play the vindicator off the pred, they're both going to be drawing attention.

Not sure if you need the Assault termies-again, at low points you can probably get some decent work done with just standard termies. The only real benefit of TH/SS is the 3++, which you may not actually need

skolirvarden wrote:
At 1000 points I think you could probably play the vindicator off the pred, they're both going to be drawing attention.

Not sure if you need the Assault termies-again, at low points you can probably get some decent work done with just standard termies. The only real benefit of TH/SS is the 3++, which you may not actually need

So you would suggest dropping one vindicator and using those points to upgrade the 10man scout squad to a Tac/Rhino squad? If I did that going with a HB/Plasma Gun Tac Squad it would put me at 967 points so I could even upgrade the Land Speeder with an assault cannon to pull some light anti-vehicle duties.

The reason I want to convert the termies is I just keep hearing how Terminators are mediocre, not great and not bad. It seems worthwhile to upgrade them to a unit that is considered useful for what is essentially 5 more points.

Yeah, I'd go for the upgrade to Tac/Rhino with a special weapon; dealers choice, but I don't care for plas when you've only got one-Gets Hot happens. I'd probably go for grav, but Melta is also a decent choice, just depends how close to the enemy you want to get. Given that you're rocking a heavy bolter, you'll either be combat squadding or standing still when you exit the Rhino, so choose accordingly.

*shrug* I think it depends on how you play Termies; a lot of playing styles seem to have evolved from previous editions where charging in hammenators was the best play. These days..........I have Assault Termies in a mixed squad (3 LC, 2 TH), but I'm on the fence about whether it was a smarter choice than going with standard termies.

I will say yes, of the two options, Assault Termies are better for just ramming them right down the throat of your enemy, but I wouldn't comfortably say they are the better of the two choices for the points, especially considering that you can't assault from Deep Strike-if you're footslogging your Assault termies, they will get shot. They will die under weight of fire.

Your anti-tank should be handled by lascannon Devastators or Devastator Centurions with lascannons and missiles; they have 'tank hunter' which is probably the best part of your Chapter Tactics.

Drop the Predator ASAP. It's not a fast vehicle, so forget about moving it to get a better shot.. That's why I really like the Centurions.. But 150 for 4 lascannons on a basic dev team is also a steal.

The Vindicators can be nice in pairs, but O don't think they really work in this list at the moment.

I'm a big fan of scouts when taken in large quantities and if you use the Sentinels of Terra supplement for 'close range bolter drill'.. And I think for 100 points, 5 bolter Scouts in a land speeder storm can be a great troops choice.

As for the Terminators, deep-striking some Tactical Terminators can be alright with all the bolter shots, just don't put them in a position where AP2 will mince them, or outside of cover. The problem you'll have with Assault Terminators is the lack of a delivery system.. Without a Land Raider, they won't do much for you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I would try something like this:

Libby - staff, bones, shield, term armor
Tactical Terminators (5) - cyclone missile launcher
Scouts (10) - bolters, land speeder storm w/heavy flamer (combat squad and outflank both)
Tactical Squad (10) - plasma, rhino
Centurion Devastator Squad (3) - lascannons, missiles

Or, you could replace the Centurion Devs with a lascannon Devastator Squad and your Vindicator for roughly the same points.

Hope that helps!

skolirvarden wrote:
Yeah, I'd go for the upgrade to Tac/Rhino with a special weapon; dealers choice, but I don't care for plas when you've only got one-Gets Hot happens. I'd probably go for grav, but Melta is also a decent choice, just depends how close to the enemy you want to get. Given that you're rocking a heavy bolter, you'll either be combat squadding or standing still when you exit the Rhino, so choose accordingly.

*shrug* I think it depends on how you play Termies; a lot of playing styles seem to have evolved from previous editions where charging in hammenators was the best play. These days..........I have Assault Termies in a mixed squad (3 LC, 2 TH), but I'm on the fence about whether it was a smarter choice than going with standard termies.

I will say yes, of the two options, Assault Termies are better for just ramming them right down the throat of your enemy, but I wouldn't comfortably say they are the better of the two choices for the points, especially considering that you can't assault from Deep Strike-if you're footslogging your Assault termies, they will get shot. They will die under weight of fire.

That is interesting to hear about the terminators but it does make sense, the reason I justified it in the first place was that I would benefit greatly from IF chapter tactics using the storm bolters. But after buying them all I heard was how they are mediocre and not worthwhile to include in any list. I'll have to give them a try in game before I commit to converting them, especially without any means to get them close as you say.

 xTHExCLINCHERx wrote:
Your anti-tank should be handled by lascannon Devastators or Devastator Centurions with lascannons and missiles; they have 'tank hunter' which is probably the best part of your Chapter Tactics.

Drop the Predator ASAP. It's not a fast vehicle, so forget about moving it to get a better shot.. That's why I really like the Centurions.. But 150 for 4 lascannons on a basic dev team is also a steal.

The Vindicators can be nice in pairs, but O don't think they really work in this list at the moment.

I'm a big fan of scouts when taken in large quantities and if you use the Sentinels of Terra supplement for 'close range bolter drill'.. And I think for 100 points, 5 bolter Scouts in a land speeder storm can be a great troops choice.

As for the Terminators, deep-striking some Tactical Terminators can be alright with all the bolter shots, just don't put them in a position where AP2 will mince them, or outside of cover. The problem you'll have with Assault Terminators is the lack of a delivery system.. Without a Land Raider, they won't do much for you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I would try something like this:

Libby - staff, bones, shield, term armor
Tactical Terminators (5) - cyclone missile launcher
Scouts (10) - bolters, land speeder storm w/heavy flamer (combat squad and outflank both)
Tactical Squad (10) - plasma, rhino
Centurion Devastator Squad (3) - lascannons, missiles

Or, you could replace the Centurion Devs with a lascannon Devastator Squad and your Vindicator for roughly the same points.

Hope that helps!

I really wouldn't want to go with centurion devastators since they are pretty expensive and I am on a budget. But a regular devastator squad is definitely an option I would consider. However I am concerned that a four man Las devastator squad would make for a huge soft target, and if my opponent took that out my anti-tank would be really wiped.

But with the list you suggested, using regular Devs 4 man Las squad, I come out to 973 points. With that remaining 27 I could throw some Melta bombs in the troops choices for some anti-tank redundancy and have points to spare to give the sergeant of the tac squad a combi plasma. It would come out like this...



HQ: 150
Librarian: Terminator Armor, Mastery 2, Storm Shield, Bones of Osrak (+1 Warp Charge, Re-roll failed psychic tests)

Elite: 225
Terminator Squad: CML

Troops: 338
Scout Squad: 5x Bolters, Melta Bomb in a Land Speeder Storm w/ Heavy Flamer
Scout Squad 4x Bolters, 1x Heavy Bolter
Tactical Squad: Combi-Plas/Plasma/Melta Bomb in a Rhino

Heavy Support: 280
Devastator Squad: 4x Las
Vindicator: Dozer Blade

Total: 993

At this point since the Scouts in the Land Speeder will likely be getting in close should I give them BP/CCW instead of Bolters?

e/ Another thing I would like to squeeze in there is some anti-air if possible, maybe drop a few things here and there and grab an aegis defense line?

Ablative wounds for the dgs is a good idea, get 2 more bodies in here with the points and trim something else.


At this points level, dedicated AA is going to leave you pretty slim on points for other units like Terminators.. The cents might even do ok at AA since they have twin linked lascannons and extra missiles.. Still all tank hunter.

Drop the combi plasma and vind to get a storm talon for anti air and ground support. They are pretty cheap for a 1k game.