[1500] - Orks - Super Competitive List

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**Waaagh 18**

I'm trying to make as competitive a list as is possible for my orks. That means any critiques you have of the list, no matter how small, I want to hear. Even if I'm way off track, I'm willing to do a complete rewrite. I'm on a major losing streak at my local shop, and I think the solution might lie within list building. I know orks aren't always the most competitive, but I want to do the best I can with my orks, so here it goes.

Total- 1500

HQ- 215
DLS MA Warboss with Bosspole- 130
Painboy- 50
--Mekaniak Mek- 15
--Mekaniak Mek with rokkit- 20

Troops- 486
10 'ard Boyz including Nob with PK, BP, and Shoota, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 175
10 'ard Boyz including Nob with PK, BP, and Shoota, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 175
16 Boyz including Nob with PK, BP, and Shoota- 136

Elites- 425
3 MANZ, Boss Nob has Kombi-Skorcha and BP, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 165
5 Tankbustas including Boss Nob with BP, 3 Bomb Squigs, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 130
5 Tankbustas including Boss Nob with BP, 3 Bomb Squigs, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 130

Fast Attack- 142
Deffkopta with rokkits- 30
4 Warbikers including Nob with PK and BP- 112

Heavy Support- 232
BW with 3x rokkits and ram- 130
2 KMKs with 2 ammo runts and 1 extra Grot Crew- 69
1 KMK with ammo runt- 33

So Tankbustas go into reserve if I don't get first turn, I need to make sure I sacrifice charge them into the enemies best tanks. Meganobz find something nice to krump, could also potentially stay in reserves. The 'ard boyz flank the main BW with the DLS MA Warboss, Painboy, little Mek, and 16 Boyz. The Warbikers jet forward to shoot stuff and charge tanks. The Deffkopta camps behind my KMKs until it does a sacrificial objective grab. The 2 KMKs with rokkit mek and solo KMK shoot at stuff. ANY tips or ideas are appreciated. Even saying, "No Speed Freeks play footsloggers." Is acceptable to me if there's a good reason given. I mainly play against IG, SM, DE, BA, or Eldar.

**doktor_g**

I'm probably off base with this but you're going for target saturation. Reserving the TBs makes it easy for your opponent to put you on foot.... Every round. Let your boys walk and kite them. Cut them down w superior firepower. Plus the TBs will b coming in from your table edge. They'll still be in your deployment zone and out of range of their ranged tanks.

**Sketchyfk**

Most "Super-Competitive lists" (which is an oximoron for Orks these days) tend to run with 3 or 4 HQ, ork's just seem to really benifit from it.

One of the most common things people say is that if your going to take one battlewagon, then you should really take a second one to back it up.

This would mean, though, that you'd need to put your KMKs in a unit of 3, which IMO is actually better anyway. Heavy support is a section of the Codex which really shines. It has lots of really good units. Unfortunately too many. I would either have 2 battlewagons and one unit of 3 KMKs or 1 Battlewagon, one unit of 3 KMKs and either 5 Lobbas or 15 Lootas.

Lootas are a mixed nut atm. They have the position in the codex for anti-flier and light vechile destruction. While they're not AS powerful at anti-air as Traktor Kannons, they are more versitile. Unfortunately they're quite fragile so keeping them in cover is wise. I would run 15 as the more numbers means less change of triggering the Mob Rule. Stick a Mek in with them.

Lobbas, on the otherhand, can barrage snipe and have the same range as the Lootas. From what I've seen, lobbas are considered to be the best Ork Heavy Support option. Their 18pts for the single gun and can hide out of site. They're considered better than KMKs because of this range and because against death star units, they can take out the key characters. They're also our best bet at tanking out open topped vechiles, side armor 10 vechiles (which IG and DE seem to favour).

Ard Boys are awesome, they act as a combat piviot. But seeing your list I think you have too many (especially if you're only taking 2 HQs). Using the CAD, you only need 2 troops. One unit of Ard Boys, one unit of Meganobz and the DLS MA Warboss unit as your 3rd unit should be more than enough. This would free up some points.

Since Mega Armor stops you from running, would it be a good idea to fit the Warboss's Battlewagon and the Manz Missile with a Boarding Plank for the extra charge range?

With how many vechiles you have, if you don't get 1st turn then you're likely to loose quite a lot via shooting. I would be tempted to instead take an ADL and put the Trukks behind that for a 4+ cover save. It isn't great, but it's the same effect as hiding them behind terrain.

I would take 2 seperate units of 1 deffkoptas. There's no reason not to, they're very good in malestorm missions.

The Warbike unit you have seems too small to be effective. They're awesome units, but at 5 they just don't pack a punch and are forced down too easily.

Which unit does your Painboy go with?

KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it. The ADL would also allow you to hide the Mek Gunz and Lootas behind it.

With how many other targets you have, I'm would say it's worth keeping the Tankbusters on field. You have enough to go flat out on the 2nd turn, something is bound to get through. Orks need all bodies on the field early, don't give your opponent a chance to deal with things in multiple waves. A list like this requires you throw everything at them together.

**grendel083**

Some good advice from the two posts above.
Some other options, if you're having a Batllewagin flanked by two Trukks, it might be worth having a Bike mounted Mek with KFF behind them. Should be able to fit all 3 in the bubble. Stick him with your Warbikes and maybe beef them up a little.

To save a few points, maybe drop 2 Rokkits on your Wagon. If it's not stationary it will be Snap Firing at least 2 of them.

Your Tankbustas are really small, how much use will they get out of a Boss pole? If they don't run, the hits caused will probably white them out. Sometimes it's better to run... Boyz mobs they're essential, maybe not so much here though. Do they really need a Boss Nob for that matter?

Painboy: I'd be tempted to drop him entirely. I'm guessing he's going in with the boyz and the Boss? The Boss will be at the front, tanking any shooting that isn't Ap2 and LOS! to the mob if it is. Chanes are if a shot can ignore a 2+ save it can ignore FNP. If you take the Biker KFF Mek mentioned earlier, he can always join this unit once the Boyz are out of the Wagon. If a shot can ignore a 2+ save and FNP, then an invulnerable save might be a better option.
Painboy will help in combat, but again you want as many hits allocated to the Boss as possible.

But honestly play testing is your best bet, especially with Orks. This is one army where "looks good on paper" doesn't quite cut it. It's an unforgiving army to play, so you need to test and get comfortable with your choices.

**Waaagh 18**

Sketchyfk wrote:
Most "Super-Competitive lists" (which is an oximoron for Orks these days) tend to run with 3 or 4 HQ, ork's just seem to really benifit from it.
How do I fit them in my list?

One of the most common things people say is that if your going to take one battlewagon, then you should really take a second one to back it up.
What should I put in that BW?

This would mean, though, that you'd need to put your KMKs in a unit of 3, which IMO is actually better anyway. Heavy support is a section of the Codex which really shines. It has lots of really good units. Unfortunately too many. I would either have 2 battlewagons and one unit of 3 KMKs or 1 Battlewagon, one unit of 3 KMKs and either 5 Lobbas or 15 Lootas.
So I keep KMKs AND add Lobbas?

Lootas are a mixed nut atm. They have the position in the codex for anti-flier and light vechile destruction. While they're not AS powerful at anti-air as Traktor Kannons, they are more versitile. Unfortunately they're quite fragile so keeping them in cover is wise. I would run 15 as the more numbers means less change of triggering the Mob Rule. Stick a Mek in with them.
That's quite a lot of points, what should I drop to add them?

Lobbas, on the otherhand, can barrage snipe and have the same range as the Lootas. From what I've seen, lobbas are considered to be the best Ork Heavy Support option. Their 18pts for the single gun and can hide out of site. They're considered better than KMKs because of this range and because against death star units, they can take out the key characters. They're also our best bet at tanking out open topped vechiles, side armor 10 vechiles (which IG and DE seem to favour).
I'll add some

Ard Boys are awesome, they act as a combat piviot. But seeing your list I think you have too many (especially if you're only taking 2 HQs). Using the CAD, you only need 2 troops. One unit of Ard Boys, one unit of Meganobz and the DLS MA Warboss unit as your 3rd unit should be more than enough. This would free up some points.
So I should drop the 'eavy armor on my 2nd mob, or the whole mob?

Since Mega Armor stops you from running, would it be a good idea to fit the Warboss's Battlewagon and the Manz Missile with a Boarding Plank for the extra charge range?
I get the feeling my enemy is going to kill it pretty early, is it still worth it?...

With how many vechiles you have, if you don't get 1st turn then you're likely to loose quite a lot via shooting. I would be tempted to instead take an ADL and put the Trukks behind that for a 4+ cover save. It isn't great, but it's the same effect as hiding them behind terrain.
I'll bring KFF Mek on Bike to cover them

I would take 2 seperate units of 1 deffkoptas. There's no reason not to, they're very good in malestorm missions.
I love them too, but I didn't formerly have the points.

The Warbike unit you have seems too small to be effective. They're awesome units, but at 5 they just don't pack a punch and are forced down too easily.
They were meant to be a missile

Which unit does your Painboy go with?
He did go with the MA Warboss, but I'm taking him out for the KFF Big Mek on bike

KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it. The ADL would also allow you to hide the Mek Gunz and Lootas behind it.
I use ammo runts to negate gets hot

With how many other targets you have, I'm would say it's worth keeping the Tankbusters on field. You have enough to go flat out on the 2nd turn, something is bound to get through. Orks need all bodies on the field early, don't give your opponent a chance to deal with things in multiple waves. A list like this requires you throw everything at them together.
Yeah. Keeping them on is probably the best. I just have fears of drop pods trike again, and infiltrating blood angels. In a couple of games recently, I've lost 25% of my army before I could move

Thanks for the help!

**Sketchyfk**

Waaagh 18 wrote:
Sketchyfk wrote:
Most "Super-Competitive lists" (which is an oximoron for Orks these days) tend to run with 3 or 4 HQ, ork's just seem to really benifit from it.
How do I fit them in my list?
= You could run 2 CADs, tho this is typically easier in 1850 point games and with a unit of Grots (min squad of 10 = 35 pts)

One of the most common things people say is that if your going to take one battlewagon, then you should really take a second one to back it up.
What should I put in that BW?
= I would either remove the Eavy Armor on one unit of Trukk Boys and increase their number to 20, then place them in there.
= Or move the Tankbusters in here. I'm really fond of 15 Tankbusters with a Mini Mek + a Painboy in a Battlewagon. Giving the battlewagon 4 Rokkits means you have a very powerful weapons platform. Most of the time, your foe will be concentrating on other threats LIKE the KMKs, MA DLS Warboss or the Manzmissile. You CAN have the Squigs in this unit, if you wish, but I find that the superior range of the Rokkits means you can stay out of charging range. You can still charge units and most titans (like Wraithknights) don't appreciate that many Rokkits or meltabombs all flying towards them. This is a more durable unit than the sacrificing 5-7 Tankbusters. The Painboy would give a nice 5+ FnP to try to save some against completely dying due to the explosion damage. Make sure you give the Painboy a BP to keep them from running away. If you decide to drop the Painboy, definately upgrade one to a Nob with the BP.

This would mean, though, that you'd need to put your KMKs in a unit of 3, which IMO is actually better anyway. Heavy support is a section of the Codex which really shines. It has lots of really good units. Unfortunately too many. I would either have 2 battlewagons and one unit of 3 KMKs or 1 Battlewagon, one unit of 3 KMKs and either 5 Lobbas or 15 Lootas.
So I keep KMKs AND add Lobbas?
If you can, yes. KMKs really struggle for range against some camping armies (tho this is counteracted by malestorm as they're forced to move). This is where a 2nd CAD comes in handy, as you unlock a total of 6 Heavy Support options.

Lootas are a mixed nut atm. They have the position in the codex for anti-flier and light vechile destruction. While they're not AS powerful at anti-air as Traktor Kannons, they are more versitile. Unfortunately they're quite fragile so keeping them in cover is wise. I would run 15 as the more numbers means less change of triggering the Mob Rule. Stick a Mek in with them.
That's quite a lot of points, what should I drop to add them?
If you can add 5 Lobbas, I would just do that instead. To me, the weakest unit to drop is the small Warbiker unit. They're just too small and you already have an Ard-boy and Manz missile. Both of these can PK Tanks early game. But then, so can the Tankbusters with Meltabombs.

Lobbas, on the otherhand, can barrage snipe and have the same range as the Lootas. From what I've seen, lobbas are considered to be the best Ork Heavy Support option. Their 18pts for the single gun and can hide out of site. They're considered better than KMKs because of this range and because against death star units, they can take out the key characters. They're also our best bet at tanking out open topped vechiles, side armor 10 vechiles (which IG and DE seem to favour).
I'll add some

Ard Boys are awesome, they act as a combat piviot. But seeing your list I think you have too many (especially if you're only taking 2 HQs). Using the CAD, you only need 2 troops. One unit of Ard Boys, one unit of Meganobz and the DLS MA Warboss unit as your 3rd unit should be more than enough. This would free up some points.
So I should drop the 'eavy armor on my 2nd mob, or the whole mob?
As grendel083 said: "play testing is your best bet, especially with Orks. This is one army where "looks good on paper" doesn't quite cut it. It's an unforgiving army to play, so you need to test and get comfortable with your choices."
= Ard Boys ARE good. But I don't think I would run 2 units. You could try merging the units together to make a 18 Ard Boyz squad with a Nob + BP + PK all inside a Battlewagon. These guys want to charge, so make sure you put a Boarding Plank on it. It'll be an expensive unit but it'll murder most things in combat, which seems to be your thought process. The 20th space is for a Mek to be challenge fodder.

Since Mega Armor stops you from running, would it be a good idea to fit the Warboss's Battlewagon and the Manz Missile with a Boarding Plank for the extra charge range?
I get the feeling my enemy is going to kill it pretty early, is it still worth it?...
They probably will kill it pretty quickly. If they don't then you get to slaughter them. But then when you're playing a rush army like this you have to anticipate some things are going to die early game. But it means your other threats are going to reach through. There are many different loadouts you could try, but I would advise 2 battlewagons, with 2 trukk units covering their sides, then any more trukks behind it.

With how many vechiles you have, if you don't get 1st turn then you're likely to loose quite a lot via shooting. I would be tempted to instead take an ADL and put the Trukks behind that for a 4+ cover save. It isn't great, but it's the same effect as hiding them behind terrain.
I'll bring KFF Mek on Bike to cover them
Which unit does your Painboy go with?
He did go with the MA Warboss, but I'm taking him out for the KFF Big Mek on bike
I saw someone suggest a Biker Big Mek with a KFF. It's quite expensive, but it does make sense with how many vechiles you have. I used to use the KFF all the time, but ever since it was downgraded to a 5+, it never seems to work for me. I would perhaps just move the Painboy to a different unit (like the 20 ork boys in the other battlewagon) and try that out. They will still be very killy. But then it's an invulnerable save, not a cover save anymore. So there IS that.

I would take 2 seperate units of 1 deffkoptas. There's no reason not to, they're very good in malestorm missions.
I love them too, but I didn't formerly have the points.
How many do you have?

KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it. The ADL would also allow you to hide the Mek Gunz and Lootas behind it.
I use ammo runts to negate gets hot
Ammo runts are more useful for that re-roll to hit. These are guns which you REALLY don't want to miss with, especially early game.

With how many other targets you have, I'm would say it's worth keeping the Tankbusters on field. You have enough to go flat out on the 2nd turn, something is bound to get through. Orks need all bodies on the field early, don't give your opponent a chance to deal with things in multiple waves. A list like this requires you throw everything at them together.
Yeah. Keeping them on is probably the best. I just have fears of drop pods trike again, and infiltrating blood angels. In a couple of games recently, I've lost 25% of my army before I could move
If you REALLY struggle against them, I would switch to just playing the Green Tide formation. That's 100 boys and a Warboss (technically 90 boys and 10 nobs with 6 PKs if the standard loadout). You can space them out enough to cover ALL of your field, limiting where the drop pods come in on. Also useful against fliers and titans. Fliers and drop pods will struggle to find a place to land, so you can control their movement on the field. The downside to this list, is that you need 90 boys...

Thanks for the help! No Problem

**Waaagh 18**

I have 9 Deffkoptas

Automatically Appended Next Post:
@Sketchyfk

**tilds**

Sketchyfk wrote:

KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it.

Can you explain how more crew would counteract Gets Hot? As I understand it, the wound is taken by the artillery model and not the crew member.

**Waaagh 18**

Revised List:
Taking in feedback and tactics given, I have created the following list.

Total- 1500

HQ- 280
DLS MA Warboss with BP- 130 (goes with Boyz in BW)
Big Mek with KFF and BP on bike- 115 (goes with biker screen)
Mekaniak Meks with rokkit- 20 (goes with KMKs)
Mekaniak Mek- 15 (goes with Lobbas)

Troops- 313
18 Boyz including Nob (to each challenges in lieu of mek)- 118 (go in BW)
12 'ard Boyz including Nob with PK and BP, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 195

Elites- 421
3 MANZ, Boss Nob has BP and Kombi-Skorcha, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 165
6 Tankbustas including 3 Bomb Squigs, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 128
6 Tankbustas including 3 Bomb Squigs, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 128

Fast Attack- 132
Deffkopta with rokkits- 30
Deffkopta with rokkits- 30
4 Warbikers- 72

Heavy Support- 354
BW with ram, rokkit and boarding plank- 135
5 Lobbas with 5 ammo runts and 3 extra Grots- 114
3 KMKs with 3 ammo runts and 2 extra Grots- 105

Continued feedback is appreciated!

**blaktoof**

I would consider mixing tankbustas up a bit, and give a few tankhammers, they can fire the bomb squigs and then you have some assault mojo with them. Not really necessary you can go either way depending on how you like to play- I just sometimes find personally that the str8 ap 3 melee attacks come in handy

otherwise looks good, only real weak point is anti air, but can't take it all and if you take anti air you have to really commit to it :(

**Waaagh 18**

The thing about tank hammers in small squads of bustas is that with all the assault elements in this army (MANZ, 'Ard Boyz, and DLS MA Warboss), I don't really need them. I want Tankbustas attacking tanks, and melta bombs are better in that case. Also, I have to protect the tank hammer, and if I take 3 casualties from exploding Trukk, I'm down to 2 guns, and he'll die in close combat before he can swing, so I lose the points. That's just why I prefer no hammers.

My meta also doesn't really use flyers, at least in 1500 point games (more for 1850 or above...). Theoretically though I'm stumped as to what I could take for AA, I'm open to ideas...

**shyzo**

They say that Tankbustas do as great AA. 12 Tank Hunter rokkits are deadly to flyers.

**Sketchyfk**

Waaagh 18 wrote:I have 9 Deffkoptas

Nice. There's is typically 2 ways to take Deffkoptas these days. Either as units of 1, or as spunges.
A spunge consists of 5 Deffkoptas and a Painboy on a Bike with a BP. This makes the unit VERY durable. Adding a Warboss with a PK or a Big Mek with KFF on a Bike makes it even more so. The later option works nicely as the unit will typically want to stay at range anyway. Think of them as the new Nob Bikers. They can't hit as hard, yes, but it lets you scout lots of Rokkits and a Warboss into the front lines.

tilds wrote:
Sketchyfk wrote:
KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it.
Can you explain how more crew would counteract Gets Hot? As I understand it, the wound is taken by the artillery model and not the crew member.

While gunners can't be used to directly counter it (unlike the Zzap Kannon), they can help to buff the unit out. On a unit which is already wounding itself, treat them as extra wounds and stick them up front of the KMK. These Toughness 7 Grots (with a nice armor save) will take any incoming fire before the gun itself would (due to the way shooting). That means, if your opponent has an AP1 or 2 nasy shooting weapon, the grots will take it first, rather than the gun. This is a gun you want to protest at all costs, IMO.

Waaagh 18 wrote:Revised List... DLS MA Warboss with BP- 130 (goes with Boyz in BW)
18 Boyz including Nob (to each challenges in lieu of mek)- 118 (go in BW)
Mekaniak Meks with rokkit- 20 (goes with KMKs) -- put him naked with the Warboss.

I would prefer putting a PK on the Nob, dropping the boyz unit down to 17, and putting the Mek (naked) into this quad (of Slugga boys I presume). This means that you're almost guarenteed to get one turn in combat with 2 PKs destroying your foe, rather than just the Warboss's PK. This also means you have 2 turns (yours and your opponents turn) to divert the challenges away from your Warboss, who you REALLY doesn't want to recieve a challenege against an AP1 or AP2 weapon.

Waaagh 18 wrote:The thing about tank hammers... I prefer no hammers

I COMPLETELY agree. Meltabombs will be more than effective for you.

**tilds**

Sketchyfk wrote:
tilds wrote:
Sketchyfk wrote:
KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it.
Can you explain how more crew would counteract Gets Hot? As I understand it, the wound is taken by the artillery model and not the crew member.
While gunners can't be used to directly counter it (unlike the Zzap Kannon), they can help to buff the unit out. On a unit which is already wounding itself, treat them as extra wounds and stick them up front of the KMK. These Toughness 7 Grots (with a nice armor save) will take any incoming fire before the gun itself would (due to the way shooting). That means, if your opponent has an AP1 or 2 nasy shooting weapon, the grots will take it first, rather than the gun. This is a gun you want to protest at all costs, IMO.

Okay, that makes sense.

Sketchyfk wrote:
These Toughness 7 Grots (with a nice armor save) will take any incoming fire before the gun itself would (due to the way shooting).

Do the grots get the 3+ armorsave from the gun aswell? I thought they only got the Toughness 7.

**Sketchyfk**

Sketchyfk wrote:
These Toughness 7 Grots (with a nice armor save) will take any incoming fire before the gun itself would (due to the way shooting).

Do the grots get the 3+ armorsave from the gun aswell? I thought they only got the Toughness 7.

**Waaagh 18**

Sketchyfk wrote:
Waaagh 18 wrote:I have 9 Deffkoptas
Nice. There's is typically 2 ways to take Deffkoptas these days. Either as units of 1, or as spunges.
A spunge consists of 5 Deffkoptas and a Painboy on a Bike with a BP. This makes the unit VERY durable. Adding a Warboss with a PK or a Big Mek with KFF on a Bike makes it even more so. The later option works nicely as the unit will typically want to stay at range anyway. Think of them as the new Nob Bikers. They can't hit as hard, yes, but it lets you scout lots of Rokkits and a Warboss into the front lines.

tilds wrote:
Sketchyfk wrote:
KMKs have that Get Hot rule. I would really advise stacking up on gunners to counteract it.
Can you explain how more crew would counteract Gets Hot? As I understand it, the wound is taken by the artillery model and not the crew member.
While gunners can't be used to directly counter it (unlike the Zzap Kannon), they can help to buff the unit out. On a unit which is already wounding itself, treat them as extra wounds and stick them up front of the KMK. These Toughness 7 Grots (with a nice armor save) will take any incoming fire before the gun itself would (due to the way shooting). That means, if your opponent has an AP1 or 2 nasy shooting weapon, the grots will take it first, rather than the gun. This is a gun you want to protest at all costs, IMO.

Waaagh 18 wrote:Revised List... DLS MA Warboss with BP- 130 (goes with Boyz in BW)
18 Boyz including Nob (to each challenges in lieu of mek)- 118 (go in BW)
Mekaniak Meks with rokkit- 20 (goes with KMKs) -- put him naked with the Warboss.
I would prefer putting a PK on the Nob, dropping the boyz unit down to 17, and putting the Mek (naked) into this quad (of Slugga boys I presume). This means that you're almost guarenteed to get one turn in combat with 2 PKs destroying your foe, rather than just the Warboss's PK. This also means you have 2 turns (yours and your opponents turn) to divert the challenges away from your Warboss, who you REALLY doesn't want to recieve a challenege against an AP1 or AP2 weapon.

Waaagh 18 wrote:The thing about tank hammers... I prefer no hammers
I COMPLETELY agree. Meltabombs will be more than effective for you.

I really want the Meks to go with the mek guns batteries though... If I don't, then 3 wounds can easily make my Lobbas run away. Also, I think if I fail a gets hot roll, I can use an ammo runt to reroll and then the gun gets to reroll its scatter if it wants...

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Rather than having the Mekaniak Meks go with the Warhoss as challenge eaters.

**grendel083**

Sketchyfk wrote:
I'm pretty sure that they also get the 3+ armor save, they as they share the gun's profile in that sense.

It makes things hilarious when you have 30 grots all manning an ADL's Quad Gun or Icuras Lascannon

No, they absolutely do not get the 3+ armour save!
They only use the Toughness of the Artillery, and only for shooting. There's no profile sharing.

Also the Quad gun is not Unit Type: Artillery - it's a Gun Emplacement.
Grots unsing that gun will not be sharing it's Toughness. The gun is seperate from the unit, and can be targeted seperately.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Waaagh 18 wrote:
I really want the Meks to go with the mek guns batteries though... If I don't, then 3 wounds can easily make my Lobbas run away. Also, I think if I fail a gets hot roll, I can use an ammo runt to reroll and then the gun gets to reroll its scatter if it wants...

It's a tough call. It's a real shame you can't put Runtherds in your Mek Gun units anymore.

List is looking good though, give it a few test games and see how it goes

**Waaagh 18**

I'll be sure to tell you all how it goes when I use the list! However, I can't do a true bat rep because I don't know to post pictures on this forum.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
A summary is the best I can do!

**grendel083**

Waaagh 18 wrote:
I'll be sure to tell you all how it goes when I use the list! However, I can't do a true bat rep because I don't know to post pictures on this forum.

You can upload photos to your own gallery here on Dakka. Profile -> Gallery -> Upload photos
Your image page will then give you a link to copy and paste.

A summary is the best I can do!

Looking forward to it

**Sick Bag**

I would drop the KMK. I ran them for 4 months and I don't ruin they ever paid for themselves.

Also add way more bikes or dump them entirely. At 1850 I run 15 Bikers + a Warboss. I used to run 10 and they broke almost half of the time before they got into melee. At 5 you lose 2 you get to take a Moral Test with only a 33% chance of breaking heads. Not good odds.

Ard Boyz can be over priced, but in the right numbers they do serious work. Debate still rages on.

**Waaagh 18**

Well I played a game with the list... And it did ok... I think its performance might have depended on HOW I played it rather than what I used, I definitely had the tools to win the game. The KMKs and Lobbas were definitely worh it, especially for how cheap they are. I think putting the Megaboss with the Meganobz would have been better, but I don't have time to explain everything right now. More info later...

Automatically Appended Next Post:
So I played the list against Dark Eldar Haemonculus covens, with raider spam (the transport skimmer thing that isn't a venom). I basically toasted his leaders tank, then charges in with the Meganobz and the Warboss. However, it took way too long to kill his Warlord (some mandatory named character... Eternal warrior, really good power from pain) and his accompanying groteaques (big wrecks wirh rampage). He then charged in with 30 wrecks and the tide of war swayed. My boyz from that point on were just a combat resolution suck, as I was slowly ground down. I was down to only my Warboss, but I think I could actually have done OK, because he is so survivable. My 'ard boyz charged a monster early on, but due to Trukk mispositioning, my Tankbustas couldn't help attack very well and got fried, and my power klaw nob took forever to kill it. My Lobbas weren't extremely effective, killing a Haemonculus, and being a threat. They were a very nice threat though, and took forever to die. My KMKs took down a raider, I could have protected them a bit better by spreading over a 2nd level better, so I was disappointed. My Deffkoptas were amazing at zooming back and forth getting the objectives I needed. The Tankbustas overall were pretty good, as I blew up a raider and damaged others, however, they failed utterly agains the monster. I think my list performed well, but I was inexperienced with how to use it. In the big battle of Warbosses, I slightly failed to choose how many units to commit, and got countercharged very hard. The Boyz became a combat res suck, and I started to lose it. I feel like Mad Dok would be way better than the KFF, (because I got first turn, I don't know how good it is at protecting stuff for this list). Fearless for my Warboss would really help, and rampage for him when he gets his unit gets low on health would really be useful, as well as FNP. I think I'll try that next game.

**grendel083**

Waaagh 18 wrote:
I think its performance might have depended on HOW I played it rather than what I used

Yep, Orks aren't the easiest army to play. Very unforgiving of mistakes.
Sounds like you're starting to learn how to use them though

keep it up!

**Waaagh 18**

grendel083 wrote:
Waaagh 18 wrote:
I think its performance might have depended on HOW I played it rather than what I used
Yep, Orks aren't the easiest army to play. Very unforgiving of mistakes.
Sounds like you're starting to learn how to use them though keep it up!

I'm going to try this list out for a couple more games, I don't think it really lacks the tools to do anything. Thanks for the positive feedback!

However, I've made some modifications based on last game. Someone said earlier, that another PK in the big mob would be useful, and I really agree now. I've therefore decided to add Grotsnik, because I feel like that will keep the Boyz from being dead weight. I often lose a good chunk of them before I can strike, so this will help with that, and with getting teamed up on. I also really appreciate my Deffkoptas, as they got me all my tactical objectives because of their mobility. So here goes:

Total- 1499

HQ- 325
MA DLS Warboss with BP- 130
Mad Dok Grotsnik- 160
Mekaniak Mek- 15
Mekaniak Mek with rokkit- 20

Troops- 302
17 Boyz including Boss Nob- 112
12 'ard Boyz including Boss Nob with PK and BP, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 190

Elites- 421
6 Tankbustas with 3x Bomb squig, Trukk with rokkit and ram (I'm getting better at playing with these guys every time I use them

)- 128
6 Tankbustas with 3x Bomb squig, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 128
3 MANZ, Boss Nob has Kombi-Skorcha and BP, Trukk with rokkit and ram- 165

Fast Attack- 90
Deffkopta with rokkits- 30
Deffkopta with rokkits- 30
Deffkopta with rokkits- 30 (I love these guys)

Heavy Support- 361
BW with 3x rokkit (only because I had 10 extra points and didn't know what to get with them. I'm open for suggestions...), boarding plank, and ram- 145
5 Lobbas with 5 ammo runts, and 2 extra Gretchin- 111
3 KMKs with 3 ammo runts, and 2 extra Gretchin- 105

Continued feedback is appreciated!

**Sketchyfk**

The Haemonculus are incredinbly close combat orientated. I'm pretty sure their Wracks don't even have ranged weapons (they had a flamer in the old codex, I ain't sure about their new codex). I imagine the Haemonculus used the ranged weapons provided by the transports to counteract this?

I really wouldn't advise putting your Warboss with the Manz, as it's too easy a target to pop and force that really expensive unit to walk. But it might be worth trying out just for you to see the result.

Sounds like you had the right plan, popping the vechiles where you could. Just remember that the Lobbas CAN damage AV10 (although it's a small chance).

Orks are not the CC monsters they once were. They are still monsters, but, as you said, loosing fearless is a killer to them. There's also the Big Bosspole, however keeping to one codex, the Doc is easier.

All i can really advise is to stay back and shoot against truely dedicated CC armies like this.

**Waaagh 18**

Sketchyfk wrote:
The Haemonculus are incredinbly close combat orientated. I'm pretty sure their Wracks don't even have ranged weapons (they had a flamer in the old codex, I ain't sure about their new codex). I imagine the Haemonculus used the ranged weapons provided by the transports to counteract this?

I really wouldn't advise putting your Warboss with the Manz, as it's too easy a target to pop and force that really expensive unit to walk. But it might be worth trying out just for you to see the result.

Sounds like you had the right plan, popping the vechiles where you could. Just remember that the Lobbas CAN damage AV10 (although it's a small chance).

Orks are not the CC monsters they once were. They are still monsters, but, as you said, loosing fearless is a killer to them. There's also the Big Bosspole, however keeping to one codex, the Doc is easier.

All i can really advise is to stay back and shoot against truely dedicated CC armies like this.

The problem was he had some of the terminator size base models (bigger wracks) with his best unique character that had to be his warlord. (Some formation with deep striking monsters). I charged my boyz and MANZ into it expecting to kill it, and he slightly forgot how power from pain worked, so they had EW one turn early. I failed to kill them with 15 boyz attacks, 2 MANZ, and my DLS MA Warboss. He then countercharged with all his wrecks, and I started losing ground. My 4 man bike countercharge failed, and I failed a bunch of fear checks which decimated my units. It was a downhill battle. I realize that Mad Dok would really help, cause if that happened, all the remaining boyz would be fearless (no mob rule deaths) have FNP, and get 1-3 extra attacks each. When orks get ganged up on, it's brutal, this would help.

Continued feedback on my new list is appreciated.

Side note: another reason I slightly dislike the KFF Bike, is it makes me clump together so I have protection, but not very spread out.