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Hello everyone! if any of you know my youtube channel you know I just got back into 7th edition! so far I won my first 2 games

So I was reading the rule book and as the title hints, how do these two come together?
For example:
Assassin VS captain with a tactical squad. while the captain is locked in a challenge with the assassin.
if I land 6s and get a precision strike with the assassin can I allocate that wound out of the challenge and into the tactical squads sergeant?

as for 1 the captain counts as being part of that unit for the sake of the close combat but the challenge rules simply states that wounds must be allocated to the opponent first.
but precision strikes simply says I choose where to allocate that wound towards an engaged model/unit. which the sgt is still part of as he is engaged in that combat and can still strike blows against me as I have no other models in the combat correct?

I am just looking to try and clear this up so no one gets cheated should this come up and all your minds would surely point something out I may have missed =)

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

You could not, much like excess wounds do not get allocated to the unit when the character dies.

Iron Father Mac wrote:
You could not, much like excess wounds do not get allocated to the unit when the character dies.

Challenges spill over in 7th.

That said, I'm not aware of anything that let's you target outside the challenge before your enemy is dead, barring area of effect attacks such as Gaze of Death or the side effects of swinging a Black Mace around.

Iron Father Mac wrote:
You could not, much like excess wounds do not get allocated to the unit when the character dies.

Except excess wound totally do get allocated to the unit - Rulebook page 102 Combatant Slain.

Regarding the question, I would say that the 'must' of "when allocating Wounds caused by either of these two models, the must be allocated to their opponent first." (Fighting a Challenge, p102) beats the 'may' of the Precision Strike special rule, but have no particular solid evidence for that - it's just HIWPI.

I see. I would argue that that precision strikes states to ignoring the normal rules for wound allocation. the normal wounds for wound allocation in a challenge is they must be allocated to the opponent. but then again I can honestly see this going both ways.

 GamzaTheChaos wrote:
I see. I would argue that that precision strikes states to ignoring the normal rules for wound allocation. the normal wounds for wound allocation in a challenge is they must be allocated to the opponent. but then again I can honestly see this going both ways.

By that logic, you could allocate the wound to anyone on the table.

Wound Allocation in a challenge isn't restricted to the opponent solely as a function of the challenge. It's because for the duration of the challenge, the model in base contact is the only one your challenger is engaged with.

Precision Strike doesn't let you ignore the rules that determine which models are valid wound receptacles. It just lets you choose one of those valid models instead of the closest.

In the case of a challenge, you only have one valid model to choose from.

 insaniak wrote:
... for the duration of the challenge, the model in base contact is the only one your challenger is engaged with.

Is that true in this edition? I can't find where it says that in the rule book.

 insaniak wrote:

 GamzaTheChaos wrote:
I see. I would argue that that precision strikes states to ignoring the normal rules for wound allocation. the normal wounds for wound allocation in a challenge is they must be allocated to the opponent. but then again I can honestly see this going both ways.

By that logic, you could allocate the wound to anyone on the table.

Wound Allocation in a challenge isn't restricted to the opponent solely as a function of the challenge. It's because for the duration of the challenge, the model in base contact is the only one your challenger is engaged with.

Precision Strike doesn't let you ignore the rules that determine which models are valid wound receptacles. It just lets you choose one of those valid models instead of the closest.

In the case of a challenge, you only have one valid model to choose from.

However the rule book doesn't mention this. they simply count as being in base to base contact and use each others stats when fighting. the rest of the squads are still engaged in that combat. Remember anyone within 2 inches of a friendly model that's in base contact in close combat is considered engaged. so even by my logic you couldn't allocate a wound to someone across the table. as the the precision strikes states that the wounds are allocated to an engaged model.

Unless I have missed something nothing in fighting a challenge says they are the only 2 who are considered to be engaged in close combat. just that they must allocate the wounds to each other.

if I have 10 space marines with a SGT who's locked in a challenge VS your 1 chaos lord. my entire squad gets to attack your chaos lord as he is the lone person in that challenge. IF he had a squad then my marines MUST allocate their wounds to the chaos lords squad first. they did this to prevent tar pitting units. so even this shows these models are still engaged.

 GamzaTheChaos wrote:
if I have 10 space marines with a SGT who's locked in a challenge VS your 1 chaos lord. my entire squad gets to attack your chaos lord as he is the lone person in that challenge. IF he had a squad then my marines MUST allocate their wounds to the chaos lords squad first. they did this to prevent tar pitting units. so even this shows these models are still engaged.

That is true, but i cannot agree with Precision Strikes being able to apply to the Lord until his own Squad is dead. (Quanar's "must" V "may")

 BlackTalos wrote:

 GamzaTheChaos wrote:
if I have 10 space marines with a SGT who's locked in a challenge VS your 1 chaos lord. my entire squad gets to attack your chaos lord as he is the lone person in that challenge. IF he had a squad then my marines MUST allocate their wounds to the chaos lords squad first. they did this to prevent tar pitting units. so even this shows these models are still engaged.

That is true, but i cannot agree with Precision Strikes being able to apply to the Lord until his own Squad is dead. (Quanar's "must" V "may")

My argument would be "must" doesn't apply when I am told to ignore those normal rules of allocation.

 Jimsolo wrote:

 insaniak wrote:
... for the duration of the challenge, the model in base contact is the only one your challenger is engaged with.

Is that true in this edition? I can't find where it says that in the rule book.

Fair point. The wording has changed from them being engaged to just being in base contact only with each other, and having to allocate to each other first.

In which case the situation for precision strikes does indeed become somewhat more murky than I had thought.

I think the change to both rules was done to allow this.

It has always seemed silly to me, that a character in a challenge can still have his wounds attended to by an apothecary (FNP) while fighting in a challenge.

This at least gives you a chance to take out the character attached to the group that's buffing the opposing champ.

It's a special rule vs. The main rules.
Precision strike has to trump the main rules or it doesn't work at all.
RAW seem to say that precision strikes can be allocated out of a challenge.

It's a weird case and I would guess that the designers didn't consider it when the rules were written, as the precision strike text does not allude to it.