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1000

I thought about combiplas's for the sergeants, but I don't want to model them as I won't be running them at 1500pts. I could drop the veteran sergeant upgrades to give the MotF the Ironstone, an auspex and upgrade a dread to venerable, or upgrade a rhino to a heavy bolter razorback and have 10 spare?

Master of the forge 90
Tactical squad, veteran sergeant, plasma gun, rhino 130
Tactical squad, veteran sergeant, plasma gun, rhino 130
Tactical squad, veteran sergeant, plasma gun, rhino 130
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

1500

1

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, flamer, assault cannon razorback 150
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

2

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Devastator squad, 4 plasma cannons 130
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

3

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Devastator centurion squad, grav cannons and amps 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

/1k list
Veteran sergeant upgrades aren't worth it unless you buy them a power axe - and even then, they'll just be challenged out unless the motf is with them. You could exchange the vet upgrade for a combi weapon on two squads and buy a power axe for the third, to go with the motf. I would use magnetized hands and weapons for your sergeants in any case. The ironstone isn't really worth it untill you absolutely spam vehicles in my opinion.

1500 lists

Would you consider a Land raider crusader? If you put an ironstone motf in one of those, all your vehciles would measure it's radius from the LRC hull which would give you a pretty big bubble of 4+. And the LRC itself gets 3+ repairs as well of course, making it night indestructible.

I guess I'll go for magnetising the arms for combiplasma's then.

I'd rather not, as while it'd be difficult to take down, a land raider just wouldn't put out enough damage. I'm essentially torn between another tri las predator and rifleman, and grav centurions.

How about:

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun 190
Tactical squad, plasma gun, razorback with TL lascannon 160
Grav Cenurions 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dread 120
Rifleman dread 120

If you're not running any hardcore transports (ie Land Raiders), then I think you should find the points to put your MotF on a bike.

Makes him more survivable, and gives him the mobility to help out your vehicles should you need to spread them apart; also means he can get into combat quickly if need be.

I was thinking about possibly going for a land raider, if I did, what one would you recommend?

I know a crusader would be pointless since hurricane bolters suck and I'd be using it as a gunboat. The vanilla version wouldn't be too bad, but a abit pricey still for not that much damage output and the redeemer is hampered by such short range.

If I did go for a Raider though, how about:

Master of the Forge 90
-4 Servitors 40
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Land Raider 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

Either that I could stick to a TL las razorback for him to sit back with the Preds, add in a Whirlwind and a bike squad?

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas, rhino 200
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas, rhino 200
Tactical squad, combiplas, plasma gun, TL lascannon razorback 170
Bike squad, 2 additional marines, 2 plasma guns, 1 combiplas 145
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Whirlwind 65
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

I could add in a bike squad somewhere?

Essentially, the base of the list boils down to:


Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

With 250 to spare. I wouldn't mind going for:

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, 5 additional marines, rhino 200
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, 5 additional marines, rhino 200
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, 5 additional marines, rhino 200
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, TL lascannon razorback 170
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

I’m a big fan of the classic LR myself. Put an assault unit and use it where it’s needed. Recognize that it’s going to be overpriced, and split between being a transport and a MBT. Some people call that "muddied role", I call it tactically flexible. Not something I’d casually drop into a list through.

If you are just tacking it on for the guns, look to the sky and get a stormraven instead. I’d say to add some preds, but you already did that.

I like all your lists here. There are pros and cons to each. I prefer the resiliency of the full tac squad, but can see the allure of the razor squads.

I figured that the Raider wouldn't really be worth it. I'm not a fan of fliers, I'd probably add one in at 1850, but that's a long way off for now.

I've really just gotten to the point of tinkering now, I just thought of the following list though taking into account the lack of anti-horde and using 10 man tac squads.

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, 5 additional marines, rhino 200
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, 5 additional marines, rhino 200
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, TL lascannon razorback 170
Tactical squad, plasma gun, combiplas, TL lascannon razorback 170
Thunderfire cannon 100
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Dreadnought, lascannon and missile launcher 135
Dreadnought, lascannon and missile launcher 135
20 spare

I like the symmetry of this list. What's the plan for the MotF? Do you just put him near the Dreads and attached to the TFC for a T7 warlord and to maybe repair the dreads? Does he have the Ironstone?

Also, have you considered making the Dreads venerable? A re-roll on the damage table + the IWND on them in fortified cover could make them pretty hard to kill... I've also seen the MotF on a bike with conversion beamer that hides until the right time and then fires from far away to be pretty fun and kinda effective.

Are you open to taking any Forge World units? The Sicaran is a great unit and could out perform your tri-las preds and provide some AA, AND you could take two of them with your MotF in the list... might be worth checking out! The only reason I really don't like the tri-las preds is that they have to be sitting still the whole game to bring all their weaponry to bear effectively... you may want to consider that if you play on a field with lots of LoS blocking terrain...

As for the Land Raider comment, I also like the idea of an original Land Raider to put the MotF in. Again, if you're open to FW consider the MotF in the near-indesctructible Land Raider Achilles... it covers your TFC needs, it's mobile, and has nasty MMs on the sides... and ceramite plating!!

As for the tac squads, I like the 200 point plasma load-out rather than the razorbacks, but that's just my opinion. I think lots of marines on the table would augment your long-ranged anti-armour focus. If you are taking razorbacks though, I'd take assault cannons to help against hordes.

Hope that helps, overall it looks like the fun start to a list!

I didn't even think about attaching the MOTF to the Thunderfire in all honesty! Honestly, I'm not all that sure as to what to do with the MOTF besides fulfilling the HQ tax and doing the odd repair.

I'm trying to put together a fun list, that I can fully learn the game with that I can use for semi-competitive to tournament play as I progress.

Forgeworld seems not only a bit too expensive cash wise, but also unappealing since not everyone wants to play FW units.

I think I'm most drawn to this list:

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Devastator centurion squad, grav cannons and amps 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

The dreads would go for light vehicles such as transports, the Tri Las would cover heavier stuff like MC's, the Grav Cents would do both, while the Razorbacks would cover anti infantry, dropping off the odd Tac squad where needed.

The MOTF would either sit back with 1 razor, protecting the dreads and/or Preds or head forward with the other razors, get out with the tacs and keep them shooting, taking midfield.

That's my conception of it anyway. It's inspired by this list:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXnGW-U2q_c

If I did go for a Raider though, I'd be drawn to this:

Master of the Forge 90
-4 Servitors 40
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Tactical squad, 5 additional marines, plasma gun, combiplas 200
Land Raider 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

Have you considered a librarian with the centurions instead of the MotF? You don't really need him do you for the list? You could get a level 2 librarian and hope for invis for the cents to help them up the field for right around 100 points I think... just a thought.

 trephines wrote:


I think I'm most drawn to this list:

Master of the Forge 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Devastator centurion squad, grav cannons and amps 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

I like this one, although I'd drop one Tact squad for; a Thunderfire cannon; meltabombs for the other three Tact squads; and stick Gorgon's Chain on the MotF (then he's 2+, 3++, +1 FNP and EW). I'd run a Libby rather than a MotF, but thematically the MotF is a better fit.

If I ran a librarian, I'd go for a command squad, dropping a tac squad, along the lines of this:

Librarian, auspex 70
Command squad, 3 plasma guns (or 2 with an apothecary), rhino 180

I think you're missing the point of the librarian here.. the only thing to really do would be buff the cents. You don't really have any protection for them, and he could really enable them to do some more damage or survive longer. If you do take a command squad, it's not really worth it to cram them into a rhino where they aren't doing anything more than a regular tac squad. You want them in a pod to use all 5 special weapons, or on bikes or something... or with a beefy character for the apoth support.

Understood! I'll probably try them both out and see which I like best, I've dry fitted together a pretty decent looking librarian now with staff, just needs a couple of bits here and there.

I figured I'd break this into two lists, one with the gravstar and another with more tanks.

Master of the Forge, Ironstone 120
Tactical squad, flamer, assault cannon razorback 150
Tactical squad, flamer, assault cannon razorback 150
Tactical squad, flamer, assault cannon razorback 150
Tactical squad, flamer, assault cannon razorback 150
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

Librarian, ML 2 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Tactical squad, plasma gun, assault cannon razorback 160
Devastator centurion squad, grav cannons and amps 250
Tri las predator 140
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Rifleman dreadnought 120

I like the second list. No one should really give you crap for it either... it's not a true deathstar i mean you're not teleporting it around while invisible, while there are beefy melee characters in it... I think it's well rounded enough and fun.

If you don't like flyers then you can always take a mortis dreadought with two twin-linked autocannons, it is limited to 0-1 for non dark angel armys, and is only 5 points more then a normal riflemen dread. It however gains the skyfire and interceptor rules if it doesn't move in the movement phase, which is great against flyers, and if you want to short against ground targets you just have to move it so it doesn't gain the rules.

Some are funny about Forgeworld though, so I think I'll be keeping the Dreads as they are.

Thats your choice, but people are funny about alot of things (flyers, lords of war, imperial knights etc etc.) and it has the 40k stamp of approval so it has been play tested and completely legal for 40k.

As an alternative 1k list:

Librarian ML 2 90
Tactical squad, plasma gun, rhino 120
Tactical squad, plasma gun, rhino 120
Tactical squad, plasma gun, razorback, assault cannons 160
Tri las predator 140
Rifleman dreadnought 120
Grav centurions 250